bmxracer4

I have read through all the posts about with the following searches "clutch, clutch problems, clutch travel" and I thank everyone for there info. My problem is slightly different, though. I have a '97 993 with 28K miles that was just purchased. I was told it has the RS clutch and the LWF setup and was installed 5K miles ago.

The clutch engages at the floor, I mean at the floor. The clutch is smooth through the travel with out any sticking points. The shifting is fine and the car doesn't stall when coming to a fast stop. The acceleration through all the gears is awesome, no slipping even on hills.

I took it in to the dealer and they want to remove the clutch to see whats up. If a clutch wears and the point of engagement moves up, why is having the disengagement at the floor bad? I see posts where racers like the clutch actuation at the floor and this can be adjusted by machining the flywheel.

Besides not wanting to spend a mint at the dealer, could this be something that could cause further problems, ie transmission synchros, other clutch components?

I would appreciate any help with this because I could live with the engagement point, especially if it will come out as the clutch wears.

Thanks

mborkow

"I took it in to the dealer"
i wouldn't trust a dealer with my car.

STLPCA

I don't have the answer, but I do have a question:

The correct guide tube (for the the throwout bearing) for an RS clutch (#950.116.813.30) is, IIRC, noticeably longer than the regular guide tube (#950.116.813.06).
Does anyone know if the wrong (shorter) guide tube would move the clutch engagement point closer to the floor? If so, that might be your answer.
If not ... nevermind

BTW, my P dealer has an excellent service dept.

Alan C.

Maybe Steve W. will chime in on this one.

bmxracer4

I live in Portland and am going to give Steve a call first thing Monday morning. I saw pictures of the guide tube and the different lengths and wondered if the wrong one was put in when the work was done. Thanks for the responses.

I am thinking that maybe the previous owner needed the leg room and wanted the engagement right at the floor, so he had the LWF machined down. Just a theory to make me feel better....

Anymore experiences????

kkim

Just a guess... a bad clutch master/slave cylinder, perhaps?? If you hold the clutch in for a long period of time with the car in gear and running, does the car start to engage even though you don't let up on the clutch?

Have you tried bleeding either?

Toga

Interesting problem!
One element that I'm sure could give that result is the rubber tube that connects the slave cylinder on the gear box to the aluminium line which is on the car. If that rubber tube is aging and getting flexible, it can inflate under pressure when you depress the clutch pedal. Doing this, it plays the role of an accumulator until it does reach it's maximum inflation, then you get enough pressure at the clutch to operate it.

Just my .02

bmxracer4

Thanks everyone for your responses. Great forum! I spoke with Steve W. @ Rennsport this am(very nice), and he referred me to Stuttgart Autotech here in town. I called them(also, very cool) and set up an appointment to bleed the clutch and brakes with new fluid for starters.
I took the car out for a very hard/fast drive last night in wrestling shoes and the clutch was perfect, just close to the floor. I will also have them look at the slave, hydraulic tubing and anything else that looks questionable.

Thanks again for the suggestions

Caveman

Could it be the more obvious reason that the clutch is almost worn out? My old BMW's clutch pedal was literally having to be pushed into the carpet when I got the clutch replaced. I should note that it still operated perfectly, just very low to the ground. Maybe they lied about the work done? Do you have invoices?

Good luck!

Regards,

David

Fred, Long Island

Here's long shot....I know the pedal lever is different from previous models which had a roll pin securing the lever to shaft. If the roll pin fails, the pedal falls. Could the kinematic lever have slipped on its shaft? Long shot but a maybe. Good luck.

bmxracer4

Fred, I bought the kinematic lever just in case. It turns out my clutch "at rest" is about an inch down from the brake. I took the car down to Stuttgart and they flushed the brakes/clutch and put new fluid in and the engagement is off the floor now. I will use the DIY to replace the kinematic lever and see what happens. As for the master/slave cyclinder, both are good to go. The hoses are not expanding and look like new. I don't now if the correct guide tube was installed but I will know next clutch rebuild. (Excellent suggestion Dan. Thanks Kelly, Fred, Dan and Toga for your input! Cheers!

Monique

First thing: if I lived in PNW, my car would only go to Steve's. In fact, when I need valve guides, my heads will be sent to him from Europe.

Highly doubtful an RS clutch and LWF would give up the ghost in 5k mles. Even more unlikely to machine down the component.

BTW, if you have LWF, the engine is very responsive to the throttle.. almost an extension of your thoughts... like a ricer bike.

ca993twin

Caveman,

Your BMW symptoms sound unusual for a "worn" clutch. I think of a worn clutch as one where the material on the friction disc is getting too thin and needs replacement. This is "normal" wear. In this scenario, the clutch pedal would disengage nearer the top, until it got to the point where it would virturally disengage itself (slipping all the time).

Another way a clutch wears is for the springs in the pressure plate to go bad. This is not the normal wear, and this may lead to the engagment point as you describe.

I would like to make sure my understanding is correct. Do you have any details of the wear mechanism in your BMW?

Caveman

Hi Steve,

This was few years ago and the clutch lever was gradually engaging nearer and nearer the floor until you could no longer engage it. We had it replaced and that was the end of the problem. I'm not sure of the specifics - sorry.

Regards,

David

bmxracer4

I found the problem. I went to upgrade the kinematic lever and found that when I got it out it was the upgraded part number-03 already. Hmmm. I removed the clutch lever and the the bottom bracket was twisted. I took it in to Sunset and we had different opinions whether this was bad or not, so we ordered one. The part came in the next day and proved mine was bent. I installed the new one and low and behold the clutch not only feels easier(smoother) but the engagement is at the center and the clutch pedal lines up with the brake now. Note: kind of a PITA bleeding the clutch for the first time...

I am so stoked. Thanks for everyones input!
Paul