Jay J

Which injectors should I buy for mine?
Thanks

Meenrod

Woah... RSR Tribute? Super cool.

Please share some more pictures! I"m interested to know here you got your kit from and how good the transition from sill to rear arch / fender extender is- some of the kits look badly aligned. Also, did you simply widen your wheels by putting in wider bands?

To your question - I went with the Boxster injectors as recommended by some people but the flow rate isn't quite high enough so we switched them out for Bosch Giant White injectors with a 36lb flow rate. Once we did that the fueling improved dramatically. I have an adjustable fuel regulator which goes up to 5 bar if needed, but with the Giant White injectors we have it set at the factory 3 bar level.

Meenrod

It's been a little while since I last updated and there have been quite a few things we worked on.

While the car was getting the supercharger installed I went ahead and fitted H&R purple springs to replace the Eibach pro kit I had and mated to Bilstein B6 shocks. The B6 have extra threads and I was able to get the height to RS front and rear. The car was pretty low from when I got it so I've not had anything to compare to and it was a firm setup. Anyway, I wanted to have the alignment done properly and also have it corner balanced so I took it to Jones Autowerks in San Antonio who are the local Porsche specialists / raceshop. Anyway, they said the H&R springs were too short for the shocks and went ahead and made aluminum collars to raise the perch. They set the ride height at between RS +10 and ROW M030 and when I got back to pick it up I was pissed to say the least. Not as low as I wanted and not what I had asked for. They said "we can lower it but try it out first".

Man was I wrong.

This is like a different car. The kinematic toe on the rear is properly set up, the car is balanced at each corner and the new ride height and set up is a revelation. The ride is transformed- supple, yet taught, firm but smooth. Soaks up the bumps and the damping is spot on. It glides over imperfections now whereas before it crashed. No thumps, no bump steer, no drama. Couldn't care less now that it's a little higher than RS+10. Hats off to the guys at Jones- they know how to set a car up. The 959 on the ramp should have been a giveaway.

I also went ahead and replaced the standard C2 brakes I had (for sale now in marketplace) and fitted Turbo (Big Red) brakes front and rear- I found a brand new old stock set in factory Titanium silver which match better with the gold hardware I have on my Speedlines. Someone please tell me if these are rare or were used on a different model? Not seen Big Reds in Titanium before. Anyway see below for those and the aluminum collar I have on the strut now.



Finally, while this was all going, I asked Jones to replace my clutch as I had fried mine a couple of weeks ago on the way to Radwood Austin showing off to some people on the highway. Silly me. Original clutch and nearly 60k miles it couldn't take the extra power and torque from the supercharger. Having researched this and taken some advice from @Instant-G @JEllis and I sourced a 997 GT3 clutch and pressure plate and mated it to a 964 flywheel (all parts sourced from @Instant-G ) and got the bearing kit too to do while they were in there.

Again- this was another transformation on the car. I suspected it was slipping before and this has just confirmed it as it's putting down the power so nicely now. The LWFW allows it to rev so quickly- it's like a bike now the way it responds to throttle- I hit the rev limiter a couple of times before I got used to it. The clutch and specifically pressure plate are heavier than stock but not too heavy- it feels 'mechanical' now. It might be a pain in stop start traffic though. I'm going to give a while and if I think it's too heavy I'd try the MPL slave cylinder modification too. Finally, I was a little concerned about the effect of a supercharger on the LWFW setup- the extra drag on the system causing it to stall for example, but in my 1996 MY 993 there are zero stalling issues out of the gate. Hardly any noise either- don't hear any chatter at idle, but then again I am running Fabspeed Supercups and wear ear plugs now... if I listen carefully there is a rattle if I stay in too high a gear in low revs- 4th gear at 1800 RPM for example. .

Overall these modifications are incredibley effective - I can't stress enough how much the car has fundamentally changed but still retains it's original charm and character. That being said, It is a little squirrelly at the rear at 60-70mph at 6k RPM, even on a straight road, so clearly the RS spec tires are being overwhelmed by the power/torque so I may look at wider tires/wheels. Really though I have always hankered after a 993 GT2 / RSR.

JEllis

Awesome!

haygeebaby

I know how you feel - two steps forward and one step back. But solider on - stay on target. Your car looks great.
It sounds like you are enjoying your car - SC is da best bang for buck upgrade bar none - in my book. Don't you agree?

Clutch problems - yeah something is bound to give sooner or later.
You are spending like no tomorrow Meenrod.
Perhaps half way down the slippery slope?

I had a friend in Hong Kong who had big reds. His car was 9meister 3.8 and almost GT2 spec for chassis and suspension I think. Blood orange - club sport look - lovely car.
He told me not to upgrade to big reds - said they take a while to warm up. Stock brakes where better for normal road use.
Can anyone comment on this?

Question Meenrod - have you refreshed all your rubber bushes, bearings, top hats, etc, on the car yet?
Did you do any engine mount bracket strength upgrades?
Any added engine oil cooling?
Are you running stock down pipes and stock cat ?

Also - curious to know what your car weighed and also the weight distribution at all four corners with the SC installed.
Can you let us know?

Meenrod

Hey, thank you. We're getting there. I haven't added it all up yet... don't want to know!

See below for weights. Came in at 3080 lbs curb weight (minus driver weight but including fuel). Stock is 3020 lbs so I am pleased with that. I have sunroof, AC, power windows, rear seats etc. The cross weights are at 50% which is perfect.

All the rubber on the car is refreshed to RS spec (minus a couple of bushings in the rear subframe I'm not worried about). Bearings new. Top mounts new. Engine mounts are RS spec. Transmission mount is not new. I haven't strengthened the engine mount bracket (I think 96's onwards were done already)?

I have a custom engine oil fan relay / circuit that brings the fan on earlier at lower temperatures.

It's running stock down pipes and a Fabspeed X-Pipe with sport cats - 200 cell HJS.

Regarding the Big Reds- not sure about them needing to 'heat up' being accurate but if he lives in HK he probably doesn't get above 40mph very often so maybe for him that is true. I have Pagid black pads with them and I went for a drive tonight- they felt very secure, lots of braking power and easy to modulate. The rotors / discs are substantially larger in terms of diameter than stock C2 so they have more leverage. Plus the pads are much bigger- they use front C2 pads on the rear! I think I could feel the difference. Not night and day by any means but more bite and a good match for the power.

haygeebaby

Man - your car build was very similar to mine back in 2011.

So with driver and full tank of gas the car is about 1490kg.
I think that is very close to stock 993 Turbo weight.
So Right hand drive cars will have slightly better center balance.

About 40/60 front/rear - which is pretty much stock.

Ok cool - thanks for the info man.

I am thinking that larger down pipes in boosted applications could bring some gains.
I ran both fabspeed catless pipes, and also the fabspeed x pipes with the 200 cel cats.
I believe I had better performance when the catless pipes where on and better EGT.

Meenrod

Todd at Protomotive recommended going catless too- I looked into downpipes but couldn't find any with the heaterboxes intact. Fabspeed do headers but no heat unfortunately

I think it should be quite a bit lighter than the 993 Turbo, no? Over 100 kg or 227 lbs. It doesn't have the 4WD system or widebody. Plus I lost the varioram intake, SAI system including pump, airbox, and blower fan- I estimate the TPC intake and Eaton weigh about the same as the parts I removed.

The curb weights (which does not include driver or cargo - that would be gross weight) for 993 models are as follows:.

RS - 2822 lbs 1280 kg
C2 - 3020 lbs 1370 kg
C2S 3064 lbs 1390 kg
Meenrod- 3080 lbs 1397 kg
Cab - 3131 lbs 1420 kg
C4 - 3131 lbs 1420 kg
C4S - 3147 lbs 1427 kg
Turbo -3307 lbs 1500 kg

SwayBar

Firstly, great thread Meenrod, thanks for sharing - you now have the ultimate street 993!

Brake performance and temperatures are directly related to the brake pad used.

On the street, you need a pad which bites cold, so therefore, if you run OEM pads, Big Reds will be fine on the street. I have found no need to run a 'performance' street pad on my cars, and we drive our cars hard.

haygeebaby

Yeah sorry - was calculating with driver. You'd be 100kg less than Turbo.
Probably closer to 200kg given generally higher spec'd.

haygeebaby

Meth injectin Meenrod.
That's your number one friend. Use 50/50 meth/water. Pump and water reservoir in the frunk. First injector pre butterfly. If you want even more then second inject before intake manifold.
The meth content will also increase your octane level, give more cooling, prevent detonation to a degree if conditions are correct.

If you are using the stock water pump that came with the TPC kit - change it to the larger Bosch unit that trucks use.
The stock TPC unit is tiny and moving more water around is going benefit greatly in a charge cooler config.

Juha's research has basically said that chargecooling is better for street driving - stop and go application.
Going intercooler like turbo cars is best for track use - no stopping.

You can increase the size of the Mocol heat exchange unit. i have used that config and also a config that uses the boxster heat exchange in the centre of the front spoiler for maximum cooling.
This method was used by rennlister - I can't remember his name - but I ended up talking with him and then applied it myself. He was a nice guys - shared a lot of good information from his experience.
If you decide to use the boxster cooler be aware that the adpater size for the pipe is different.

Gen 4 Eaton SC is slightly more efficient that the Gen 3. Gen 4 should generate slightly less heat given the same output.

Another optimized built I like is the Kelly Moss safari car. Well engineered cooling unit they have - built into the wing. Less weight.
Their airfilter has been relocated into the rear cabin of the car. Which is a good but extreme mod for better air intake temps.

Best scenario would be maximum weight reduction - to a point where the car is still dailyable and to a point where costs start to get too expensive to reduce any more weight.
Then add some moderate power. For example Litchfield Alpine A110. Or Harrop Lotus Elsie. In my mind this is the optimal path to take for the 993.

Or - buy a modern car. New cars a so fast these days. Or any newer 911.

https://www.kellymoss.com/projects/v...ured-jalopnik/

haygeebaby

How is your car going Meenrod?
Are you noticing any belt slippage with the smaller SC pulley choice?

Here is a pic of the early design of a mock DIY shroud I made. Its pretty rough but maybe it will give you ideas of what others have done.
This was taken in 2011 and was the first configuration of my development of my SC project.
Also a pic of someones BMC carbon air filter install.
I cannot find the pics of the large boxster radiator in the front to replace the small Mocal unit. But will keeping look for it.
Also a pic of the stock water pump and larger Bosch unit.

I'm not sure if the shroud around the air filter made much difference. But I am almost certain the larger water pump and larger heat change for the charge cooling system does make a difference in cooling charge air temps.

haygeebaby

Couldn't find a pic with it installed so I just went down stairs and took a pic for you so you can get an idea of the extra size and cooling ability.

Meenrod

@haygeebaby Mate, this is very helpful thank you.

I ordered the BMC filter with carbon canister - looking at the pictures that air to air intercooler allows for a lot more room than I have- I'm not convinced I'm going to get mine to fit but I'll give it a go. Should be here in the next few days.

Your set up looks pretty similar to mine- the water pump I fitted is the Bosch 0392022002 which was factory fitted to the Mustang Cobra 'Terminator' - of all cars. It's designed specifically for air to water intercooler systems in a supercharged application.

The Boxster heat exchanger looks like a no-brainer, so I'll add that to the list.

Regarding belt slippage- I don't think so, but to be honest I don't really know what the signs are- what should I be looking for?

haygeebaby

You are welcome. Nice to help someone else spend money.

You might not have a problem with belt slippage so don't worry too much. You can tell if you where on a dyno and you see rpm/boost are not linear - or on the road with telemetry gear.
Visually you might be able to see the belt jump during a dyno run or the tension pulley moving too much.
Other way might be dust from the belt. Your dyno chart doesn't show the boost during your dyno runs. Ask the dyno operator if he has this data and can add it to the graph for you to see.
They should have monitored/measured boost during the run.

I would look at heat exchange options before going the same route as I did.
Things have changed since 2011. You might want to increase the size of the stock Mocal and install behind the AC heat exchange where the tiptronic transmission heat exchange goes.
Check out Setrab heat exchanges or even CSF.
Make a custom bracket like this - someone made this for additional oil cooler.
Of you could look at installing the heat exchange on the bottom of your spoiler since you have a lot of space there now.
There are so many configurations to go with. Some will help you reduce weight - from your car and your wallet - not you bro.