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You can't get light weight glass and rear seat delete on the S. Also T should be about 85 lbs lighter (with similar options and transmission)
You can't get the bigger turbos and bigger brakes with red calipers on the T along with a few color options.
Simple as that. Use the configurator to cross shop. Depending on your preferences you pick if its worth the $ to go for an S vs T.
It’s so funny reading people from USA about money issues. In our country you are rich if you drive a Porsche. Doesn’t matter which version.
Now back to the question. I can only tell you my story and experience so you can filter what is important to you. The S has more power. You will notice this specifically if you drive above 160km/h towards top speed. Below that the difference is also noticeable with the best traction. So the 4S PDK will really be faster than a manual T at a traffic light. It comes down to what is important for you. I enjoyed my traffic light launches with my 4S. But want a more puristic drive now. So that’s why I got my 992 T manual.
One important thing in this story is that more power does not mean more fun. If you drive around in a country side road, when you step up the gas you might see yourself driving much harder than allowed and not feeling so well. You are constantly looking for police or just don’t feel relaxed. Sometimes it can be just too fast. So my theory was that less horsepower will mean I need to push harder to get the same result (purist side) or just that when you step it up you are going less faster and the stress level is lower (watching police all the time). But the reason why the 200bhp Toyota GT86 is such a good car is that you need to push it without going excessive speeds. Of course it’s not the same, but I hope you get my point.
You also need to consider that the T has the turbos from the base engine. And they respond better or quicker to the gas (spooling?). Again: good news from a purist point of view.
Another issue are the breaks. The S has better breaks. But it turns out Porsche breaks are always on par. After reviewing the SportAuto test of the T on Hockenheim I can only conclude that the standard breaks are enough. They drove 7 full laps and there was no fading at all. Maybe even the lesser brakes suits the car better? But if they drove it for 7 laps full without any issues I know I can drive it on the road without any issues and on the circuit as well. I never drive more than 3 or 4 laps on the circuit and never brake as hard as the top test drivers do.
Final point are the looks. If you have certain interior color wishes you need to go for the S. To me the T was a great package with a lot of nice exterior details that only the T has. Sound deadening, no back seats, light glass and less isolation in different (unmentioned) parts. That is something I like a lot.
So to me the S is not worth the extra money for now. Even if they would be priced the same I would 100% go for the T.
My Porsche cars:
991.2 T
991.2 GT3
992 4S
992 T (not driven yet)
I let go of my allocation for that reason. When I was building my spec the seats were not available. On top of that the PCCBs were not either. This is 2 months ago. I kept my 4S 🤷🏼♂️
You can't get light weight glass and rear seat delete on the S. Also T should be about 85 lbs lighter (with similar options and transmission)
You can't get the bigger turbos and bigger brakes with red calipers on the T along with a few color options.
Simple as that. Use the configurator to cross shop. Depending on your preferences you pick if its worth the $ to go for an S vs T.
You can get the lightweight glass on a S. I have it on my 22' C2S
It’s so funny reading people from USA about money issues. In our country you are rich if you drive a Porsche. Doesn’t matter which version.
Now back to the question. I can only tell you my story and experience so you can filter what is important to you. The S has more power. You will notice this specifically if you drive above 160km/h towards top speed. Below that the difference is also noticeable with the best traction. So the 4S PDK will really be faster than a manual T at a traffic light. It comes down to what is important for you. I enjoyed my traffic light launches with my 4S. But want a more puristic drive now. So that’s why I got my 992 T manual.
One important thing in this story is that more power does not mean more fun. If you drive around in a country side road, when you step up the gas you might see yourself driving much harder than allowed and not feeling so well. You are constantly looking for police or just don’t feel relaxed. Sometimes it can be just too fast. So my theory was that less horsepower will mean I need to push harder to get the same result (purist side) or just that when you step it up you are going less faster and the stress level is lower (watching police all the time). But the reason why the 200bhp Toyota GT86 is such a good car is that you need to push it without going excessive speeds. Of course it’s not the same, but I hope you get my point.
You also need to consider that the T has the turbos from the base engine. And they respond better or quicker to the gas (spooling?). Again: good news from a purist point of view.
Another issue are the breaks. The S has better breaks. But it turns out Porsche breaks are always on par. After reviewing the SportAuto test of the T on Hockenheim I can only conclude that the standard breaks are enough. They drove 7 full laps and there was no fading at all. Maybe even the lesser brakes suits the car better? But if they drove it for 7 laps full without any issues I know I can drive it on the road without any issues and on the circuit as well. I never drive more than 3 or 4 laps on the circuit and never brake as hard as the top test drivers do.
Final point are the looks. If you have certain interior color wishes you need to go for the S. To me the T was a great package with a lot of nice exterior details that only the T has. Sound deadening, no back seats, light glass and less isolation in different (unmentioned) parts. That is something I like a lot.
So to me the S is not worth the extra money for now. Even if they would be priced the same I would 100% go for the T.
My Porsche cars:
991.2 T
991.2 GT3
992 4S
992 T (not driven yet)
You’re proving the point of why manufacturers offer different versions of the same car, and market them differently. When Porsche announced the 992 they positioned the S as the ‘sports’ model, which compared with the base it is. When the GTS was released it became the sports model in the Carrera line, the ‘sweet spot’, a ‘mini-GT3’ (which is palpably silly). Now with the T they market it as a sort of mini-GTS which is kind of fair. Bottom line they’re looking to maximize sales and profit of course.
Re,. the brakes (not ‘breaks’ BTW), if they didn’t get any fade after 7 full laps then I’d argue they really weren’t using them. Even the standard S brakes are marginal over that sort of distance; they will continue to work but the pedal goes noticeably soft. You need to upgrade the pads at least, some suggest fluid as well.
The rest of course I agree with you. What you forget is that somebody started a thread if a S was worth the money. Since this question is very subjective one can only help (when not knowing his incentives) by giving your own opinion and thought proces. I am not starting a discussion which car is objectively better. And I know about Porsche marketing in general. But some people just have no idea what the differences are or what to order. There is so much possible. That is the reason why they start a thread like this. They are asking for opinions so that they can make a choice themselves right? What I do know is that almost every 911 feels different to the other. Even an S compared to an S with RAS will feel completely different.
Yes I think these Germans have no idea how to drive fast on a track and have no idea what they are talking about
Nice video but I stand by my statement that the standard brakes are marginal over that many laps. Plenty here will back this up, including pretty much all the people who track their cars regularly. Not saying they'll necessarily stop working but you can absolutely feel the degradation through the pedal.
Biggest weak point on the 991T were the standard OEM brakes.
Forget about lapping, even a spirited drive through the canyons and you would suffer brake fade and "near death" scary type of squishy brake pedal feel. The PCCBs, in my opinion, were a must-option for the 991T if one wanted to really ring out the car.
No idea, obviously, whether the standard iron brakes on the 992T are better (or worse) than the 991T version, but as I've said before if I were spec'ing a T from scratch the only options I would opt for are PCCBs and the LWBs.
And to say the T is just a baby GT3 is silly, if not downright incorrect.
Biggest weak point on the 991T were the standard OEM brakes.
Forget about lapping, even a spirited drive through the canyons and you would suffer brake fade and "near death" scary type of squishy brake pedal feel. The PCCBs, in my opinion, were a must-option for the 991T if one wanted to really ring out the car.
No idea, obviously, whether the standard iron brakes on the 992T are better (or worse) than the 991T version, but as I've said before if I were spec'ing a T from scratch the only options I would opt for are PCCBs and the LWBs.
And to say the T is just a baby GT3 is silly, if not downright incorrect.
This is exactly it.
At one point I was looking at used 991.2 T's and really the only ones I considered were manual, LWB, PCCB optioned cars.
Also besides the performance benefit, I think the base brakes do not look the greatest. I guess you could solve this with some aftermarket products.
But the LWB are a must on a T. I passed on an allocation for this reason. Now have a C2s at local port...
Also T should be about 85 lbs lighter (with similar options and transmission)
With similar specs, the difference will be nowhere near that much. I’d estimate similarly specced -T and -S would be within 20lb of each other.
The -T does offer weight savings options that are not offered on the -S, such as rear seat delete and LWBS, so the lightest possible -T will have a bigger difference to the lightest possible -S.
If you can afford to buy the S, I'd suggest you don't think about the T in terms of saving money but in terms of what you get vs the S. I decided on the T because I wanted to buy a new car that was reminiscent of older more raw 911s. Pretty difficult feat but the T is the closes one can get from the Carrera lineup. It has the suspension bits from the S, the lowest weight, the most responsive engine due to smaller turbos which both sound and feel the most like an NA car, and things like no rear seats and lightweight glass which makes it noisier and more spartan. If these are the kind of things that appeal to you, definitely look closer at the T. If you just want the most powerful 911 you can get for your money, buy another model. I have deposits (not allocations yet) on three GT products and the T is the only Carrera that appeals to me.
Nice video but I stand by my statement that the standard brakes are marginal over that many laps. Plenty here will back this up, including pretty much all the people who track their cars regularly. Not saying they'll necessarily stop working but you can absolutely feel the degradation through the pedal.
I agree with your statement 100%. I don’t think you understood me. What I think I said was that if SportAuto can drive 7 laps without fading the brakes they should be more than fine to me on the road. But also on track where I usually not drive more than 3 or 4 laps in a row before taking a 5 min rest. And I brake less hard than those testers.
04-12-2023, 12:25 PM
