Perfectly put.

 

Well, realistically, you’re not getting an ST. It's for the buyer where these dollars are nothing more than "tees in the golf cart".

I dislike the Porsche caste system as much as anyone. Given that I don't own a 918, I presume that the limited and special cars will be allocations that I will never get, regardless of the fistful of dollars in my hand. So, I don't even bother lusting after one.

 

Don’t know why you’re shoehorning the ST’s adm into this thread. I agree with the earlier guy. If you want the car, pay for it. Otherwise, no one cares.

 

Not a single person should be paying an Addendum on a Carrera, Base, S, GTS, T, GT3 or GT3RS.
Any special anniversary car, or limited edition car deserves an ADM as they are the actual rare limited 911s that will not be back.
If you pay into it now it's like @mooty said, you are burning money, you dont even get anything for the addendum, it is just profit for the dealership.
Many of these variants were available 20 years ago, are available today, and will be available in the years to come.
In the last 20 years, there have been many times you could get a 911 quite a bit under MSRP.
They are not a limited production car. Therefore, a nonlimited edition variant should not be getting an Addendum.
It’s not like CPO cars are hard to find right now either.
You just proved my point, they are not hard to find and therefore are not in limited supply.
Sure some can argue that it was necessary during the times when 1 or 2 911 per variant was being sold per quarter at dealerships in COVID times needed an addendum so the dealerships could stay afloat, and I agree with you there. But, the supply chain has been moving consistently for about a year now, more 911s are being made and sold, and there is not an extremely limited number of 911s being made, for the normal models.

The posers are the people who pay addendums and brag about paying 20k over for a 911 that is not worth that in the slightest.
Then they try and sell it on BAT and complain when they cannot break even because they took 20k and lit it on fire, instead of waiting for addendums to drop or go away or negotiate and get no adm.
It is dimwit people like you who buy into the Addendum, that allow Porsche dealerships to keep adding them on.
You may ask why I can speak on this, why I can say paying for an Addendum on a 911 is stupid, well it's because I got my 2023 T under MSRP in July of this year. UNDER MSRP. I took over my allocation in March still when addendums were stupidly high on every car, but I negotiated with the dealership to not get an ADM.
My Pops bought a 2022 GT3 last year early in the year, with no Addendum, back when they were raging across the US. Saying it is impossible, or not going to happen for the "GT cars is just wrong" as well.
My family and I have never paid over MSRP for a Porsche from any of the dealerships we have worked with, over the last 20 years.
Anyone who pays an ADM on a new or used 911 is letting the Dealer or seller walk all over them.

Exactly, Like that. You said it perfectly.
Some of you might think what I am saying is harsh, but it needs to be said, Addendums do not belong on any of the standard Porsche models on the Cayennes, Macans, Pannameras, 911, 718, none of the standard models are rare enough for one.

 

You can hate on the current market all you want, but it's not like that is going to change the market. You can stubbornly insist that you're not going to pay ADM when other buyers (aka your competition for those cars) are willing to do so. You can rant on the forums all you want, but you will find yourself without a 911. If you're not willing to pay what these cars are commanding, you're welcome to make engine noises and imagine the experience in your chair while seated at your keyboard.

If you want the car and have the cash "to buy multiple 911", you pay what the car is going for in the market -- it's not complicated. Personally, for me, life is short and if I have the cash to get a thing that I want, I get the thing that I want.

Re: Poseurs, they are the ones that claim to have the means and yet, don't buy the cars citing ADM, blah, blah. SPOILER ALERT: There is no ADM on non-GT cars in many markets now. If you're really "shopping" for one of these cars and have the financial means, you can get them. You can also jump ahead in line over the "MSRP or death" crowd by paying a modest ADM (like $5k).

 

Did you read this part of my last post?

You may ask why I can speak on this, why I can say paying for an Addendum on a 911 is stupid, well it's because I got my 2023 T under MSRP in July of this year.
UNDER MSRP.
I took over my allocation in March still when addendums were stupidly high on every car, but I negotiated with the dealership to not get an ADM. they wanted 15k for a T.
My Pops bought a 2022 GT3 last year early in the year, with no Addendum, back when they were raging across the US. Saying it is impossible, or not going to happen for the "GT cars is just wrong" as well.
My family and I have never paid over MSRP for a Porsche from any of the dealerships we have worked with, over the last 20 years.
Anyone who pays an ADM on a new or used 911 is letting the Dealer or seller walk all over them

Re: Poseurs, they are the ones that claim to have the means and yet, don't buy the cars citing ADM, blah, blah. SPOILER ALERT: There is no ADM on non-GT cars in many markets now. If you're really "shopping" for one of these cars and have the financial means, you can get them. You can also jump ahead in line over the "MSRP or death" crowd by paying a modest ADM (like $5k)

this is true now at the end of 2023, going in to 2024. Posers are the ones who complain but dont get one. but there are many gt cars that dealers are asking 50k-150k over for.

 

I agree with Vernin's perspective. I had fairly easy time getting the T build-to-order at MSRP. Did not even have to haggle for that in the SF Bay Area.

Then, there were dealers who were very much willing to *discount* the T in their lot. I will name names. Porsche Marin did that. Their 2 T models are still sitting in their lot, waiting for the buyers *at a discount*.

I have a feeling that some ID's on Rennlist are not real customers, but "customers" who work for the dealers on their payrolls. They have a conflict of interest to perpetuate the ADM sentiment, when it is increasingly just artificial. I will state very clearly that in the SF Bay Area, the 911 market has cooled to the level of MSRP without haggle for the Base, the T, and even the S. If you are paying ADM on these models in the SF Bay Area, you are officially a fool.

 

Thank you very much for confirming my suspicions, and I swear, what you say here makes perfect sense, there is no way dealerships dont have people on here trying to keep the ADM a thing.
It is also good to know that even in Cali and San Diego the ADMs are going down or gone.

 

I have seen some strange *resistance* on this board from so-called "customers" rigorously defending added dealer markups (ADMs), even though the market for the 911 itself has cooled significantly last year.

There is no question that Porsche dealer employees / salespeople are on this board, posing as genuine customers, and pumping and justifying the dealer mark-up agenda. Essentially, they are beating a dead horse for the fools and the suckers who are not in the know, so that they can rip the fools/suckers off when they come into the salesfloor.

 

I honestly believe you are correct, that seems on Par with what I have seen, It's been months and months, yet still, people are talking like ADMs are okay and should be allowed. That is where I have to talk about my experience with ADMs because honestly, I have not ever seen ADMS as bad as they were from 21-23.

What you said is almost proven by how the guy above ignored everything I said, about ADMs

 

It isn't about defending ADMs, it's about being annoyed with people who don't think basic economics should apply to their purchases.

Demand is high for 911s. Dealers have found a way to exploit that. Pay to play. Or go buy a BMW.

 

Ha! FYI, BMW Centers are rocking ADMs on desirable models, especially M cars. BMW ADMs are hit or miss just like it is with Porsche dealers.

 

Paying-to-play is buying it at MSRP like we have been for at least the last 18 years.
Dealers are exploiting their customers it is that simple.
I remember when Dealerships valued their customer, and I am not even that old,
Yet I remember, from Las Vegas Porsche, Brumos Porsche, Porsche North Scottsdale, Porsche of Albuquerque, and Porsche of Rocklin. They valued creating a future relationship with a client, instead of trying to extract all the money they could from a one-time sale.
I will 100% go back to a dealership where I am treated like a human being trying to buy a car,.
I would tell a dealership to F off if they didn't and treated me no better than a cash cow, that only exists to give them money.

 

McNamara -> Yes, your perspective is defending ADMs irrationally, or due to conflict of interest for your pockets with dealers, when the 911 market has moved onto MSRP on the Base, the T, and the S models in most regions in the US.

If you are in denial of that *cold* reality, you are just in denial of the real market today. This is not the car market of 18 months ago.

Ask Porsche Marin that struggles to get the two brand-new T's off from their physical lots. They are very motivated. Ask the fools to buy those today with ADMs, since the market is so in love with ADMs on T's, in your delusions. LOL

 

I'm not 'in denial' of anything. Just pointing out that ADMs exist in the current market for a reason.

You're the dude pushing this constant narrative in every thread you pop up in that 911s are accumulating on dealer lots.