CSK 911 C4S

I'm CPO as well. Still have 4 years 74K miles left.

I'm going to go at least if not more them 100K miles on the car and if it starts to come apart it's history but it will have to be something major..... engine/PDK major before I kick it to the curb.

chuck911

You got a couple different things going on here but the main thing seems to be long term cost. If you're keeping your cars 5-10 years then you're taking a hit of about 70 to 90% of total depreciation. In other words you're selling at the bottom, locking in near maximum loss, in order to maybe avoid some potential expenses. With a car like a 991 selling at 10 years to buy new is locking in a $60k loss, then spending another $70k on top of that for the new car. Even if you don't want to count the loss, and assume you'll get top dollar on trade and a great deal on the new car, you're looking at like $60k. To save maybe what, half that in some big unforeseen maintenance expense? Which might not come for years, if ever?

The way I see it, if you're truly concerned about total ownership costs and still want a 911 you really have only one good choice. Buy the best ten to twenty year old 911 that you can. Those cars are in the bottom of the depreciation curve. You could be looking at anything from a 964 or RS America, to a 993. The 996 is also in there at bargain basement pricing, probably the most underrated and unappreciated 911's of all time. Hard to beat from a value standpoint.

Oh and by the way, this really does work. It wasn't my plan, but my 911SC was purchased right about the bottom of its depreciation curve. The first several years it went down in value. Now 15 years later its twice what I paid for it. Maintenance? Sure. Add all of it together I could still get out of the car ahead today. In fact I can't help noting this would almost be true even if I had bought the car new! So that's your other option- buy new and hold forever!

Grunty

I wonder if the absurd price increases of older Porsches in recent years is analogous to market bubbles or beanie babies.

drcollie

FYI my first Porsche was a 1970 911E. I bought it as a 22 year old with the money I made as a motorcycle mechanic and it had 27,000 miles on it. I drove it like I stole it, literally - for nearly every mile and I had the tickets to prove it, too. All I ever did was change the oil in it, and stick a set of tires on it every to often, change the air filter and maybe some brake pads.

At 133,000 miles, it needed some work. Synchos were grinding, Valve Guides leaking and Cam Chain Tensioners were shot. Had the engine re-done by Butch Stokes in Ft Laudrerdale in the late 70s, and surprisingly the lower end and rings were super-strong, just needed the above and put in a new clutch disc for good measure.

At 242,000 miles all the above was needed again, but the paint was shot and I was ready for something newer and got the brand new 1 gen RX7, which was a HUGE mistake. Hated that car, it wasn't a Porsche. Sold that and back into a 911 Targa.

My 911's have never owed me a thing. They've been more solid than my BMW's.

Car25

[QUOTE=96redLT4;I know our fancy kitchen appliances after a remodel are far less reliable and more expensive to fix than the old units which are still functioning 20 yrs later as back-ups in the garage. The appliance repair guy told me the expensive new units are designed to work basically until they break and than be thrown away. Does anyone else wonder about these

MJBird993

The cars, no, the appliances, yes.

VintageRacer

I don't worry about it. It's part of ownership.

I've lost a lot more money on depreciation than I've spent on maintenance on my cars. It happens.

MerlinsGarage

Keep it or lease it.

chuck911

I have a printout filed away somewhere, its a compilation of prices over time for just about every Porsche model. With very few exceptions they all decline in price for about 15 years, then start trending up again. By 30 to 40 years pretty much all of them are back where they started. Some do better, some worse.

The thing is, its not just early Porsches. Its everything. Pick just about any car from 30 to 40 or more years ago. If its in great condition, guaranteed its worth a lot more now than when new. I recall a friend shopping for a nice vintage VW Beetle telling me they aren't there for under $5k, and that was 10 years ago. A 1960 Beetle cost $1565. Just to pick one totally at random, last weekend I saw an AMC Ambassador. A new '69, $2900. Today? $20k. When I say they all appreciate, I mean they ALL appreciate!

At least, in nominal terms. Far from absurd, this is all perfectly natural and to be expected once you understand these prices are all denominated in printed from nothing Federal Reserve Notes. The "appreciation" that you call a bubble disappears the minute you recalculate prices in terms of money that can't be printed, aka gold. With few exceptions pretty much all these same cars that have gone up in terms of FRN's have gone down in terms of real money.

johnireland

Complexity leads to fragility and fragility leads to failure. All the electronic things...window regulators, emergency brake, trunk openers, power mirrors, power seats, power door locks, cruise controls, stability management systems, navigation systems, none of these make a car a better car, they only make it more costly to buy and to repair. There are now seven sensors on each door just to open and close it.

And when they fail you feel it in the wallet the most because it was stuff that you really didn't need. A hand crank to roll up the window, a latch to open the frunk, a simple mechanical seat adjustment, you reach out the window and use your hand to adjust your mirror, looking for a gas station or pizza joint and you use your smart phone with it more up to date nav system.

Chuck911's analysis is right on the money. If you want fun and value pick up a used Porsche and drive the wheels off of it. The money you save in the purchase price can easily cover service and maintanence...and if you can live with the same car for 5 or so years, you might even break even.

But this also depends on who you are. I find my 996 more than fast enough for the public roads. I also like that it is still analog in many ways...and that I got it for a fraction of the price of a new 911 that is only marginally faster or quicker. Some how the difference between 4.8 and 5.1 seconds 0-60 or between 174 mph and 185 mph top end just isn't worth an extra $100,000...to me.

solomonschris

It is certainly true that if the VERY many electrical/computer related items in the 991 start failing, it will be a very expensive car to own in the "out" years. Big "if" in my experience. My 991 is my sixth 911. My ownership has included, over the past 28 years, a 993tt, a 997C2S, an '87 coupe, an '89 coupe, a '89 turbo cab and my present '12 cab C2S. Nothing on any of the cars has ever broken. These cars seem to be as dependable as an anvil .The only regret I have is selling every single one of them. They were all fabulous cars to own/drive/be seen in, and to be viewed in my garage, by me, with a martini in my hand. Terrific ROI in my opinion. What is the return on investment when you go to your favorite fabulous restuarant? That is how I see my love of Porsche. They are a fabulous experience every time I get behind the wheel, and I don't need to worry about weight gain. Enjoy..Chris

solomonschris

I'm too damn old to know how to correct my previous post. I meant to say "favorite restuarant ", nor favorite investment. Sorry.....Chris

gota911

Homeles

I have a 62 356C that's cost me more than your car. Do I worry about it? NO.

I worry more about the possible failure of Greece, which isn't much.

gota911

Chis,

If you are still breathing, you aren't too old to learn that.

If you need to edit a post, go to that post and at the bottom right corner of the panel, click on the icon that looks like a piece of paper and a pencil. That will open your post and let you edit it. When you finish editing the post, click on Save.

Try it on one of your posts, it's easy.