M4 to 991.2 Base Carrera?
#31
While still true, much, much less so than before. Gone are the days of vivacious M’s with bespoke high revving engines. The S55 is a modified N55, bigger turbos thrown on it, and a chassis that can’t keep up.
Ever driven an F10 M5? Great luxury car, feels how you would’ve expected a 550i to feel like if they turned up the boost.
Truer words haven’t been spoken.
#32
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perhaps but isn’t the 991.2 just a 991.1 with turbos attached to it? The current M3/M4 are light-years better than their predecessors. I had an e92 and currently have an F80. Don’t let nostalgia confuse you as to how great the current Ms are. Most of what you’ve highlighted about past models are trivial at best. Those characteristics offer no real advantage today. The current model is faster, more reliable, better mpg and has far more utility.
#33
Race Car
I was given an M4 to drive for a week. Good car, but its sportiness felt “bolted on”. The car feels like a sedan in drag. And that ersatz exhaust... The car is just constantly farting.
A 911 on the other hand, is not in drag. A base 991.2 is like the hottest chick in your high school. Not the hottest chick in the world, but the kind dreams are made of. A 991.2 S is like the hottest chick in your college—she would’ve been the hottest chick out of 20 high schools. Not essential to have the S, but offers just a little more. A little more dreamy. The Turbo is like a super hot 30 something trophy wife with fake **** wearing lots of jewelry. On the arm of an older guy in $400 Prada sneakers and white jeans. She looks expensive and isn’t quite as pure. The GT3 is like a 20 year old Eastern Eurpean model. Skinny, tight. Lusty as all hell on the runway. Not that easy to live with every day.
A 911 on the other hand, is not in drag. A base 991.2 is like the hottest chick in your high school. Not the hottest chick in the world, but the kind dreams are made of. A 991.2 S is like the hottest chick in your college—she would’ve been the hottest chick out of 20 high schools. Not essential to have the S, but offers just a little more. A little more dreamy. The Turbo is like a super hot 30 something trophy wife with fake **** wearing lots of jewelry. On the arm of an older guy in $400 Prada sneakers and white jeans. She looks expensive and isn’t quite as pure. The GT3 is like a 20 year old Eastern Eurpean model. Skinny, tight. Lusty as all hell on the runway. Not that easy to live with every day.
#34
I was given an M4 to drive for a week. Good car, but its sportiness felt “bolted on”. The car feels like a sedan in drag. And that ersatz exhaust... The car is just constantly farting.
A 911 on the other hand, is not in drag. A base 991.2 is like the hottest chick in your high school. Not the hottest chick in the world, but the kind dreams are made of. A 991.2 S is like the hottest chick in your college—she would’ve been the hottest chick out of 20 high schools. Not essential to have the S, but offers just a little more. A little more dreamy. The Turbo is like a super hot 30 something trophy wife with fake **** wearing lots of jewelry. On the arm of an older guy in $400 Prada sneakers and white jeans. She looks expensive and isn’t quite as pure. The GT3 is like a 20 year old Eastern Eurpean model. Skinny, tight. Lusty as all hell on the runway. Not that easy to live with every day.
A 911 on the other hand, is not in drag. A base 991.2 is like the hottest chick in your high school. Not the hottest chick in the world, but the kind dreams are made of. A 991.2 S is like the hottest chick in your college—she would’ve been the hottest chick out of 20 high schools. Not essential to have the S, but offers just a little more. A little more dreamy. The Turbo is like a super hot 30 something trophy wife with fake **** wearing lots of jewelry. On the arm of an older guy in $400 Prada sneakers and white jeans. She looks expensive and isn’t quite as pure. The GT3 is like a 20 year old Eastern Eurpean model. Skinny, tight. Lusty as all hell on the runway. Not that easy to live with every day.
#35
Race Director
^^^Have you driven a current M4? Its pretty ordinary, BMW have gone through 3 or 4 iterations before getting it close to being good or perhaps the better words would be "on par" e.g CS
The base Carrera has a very responsive engine and a really nice blend of torque/power profile - handles well too. One is a practical purpose built sports car and one isn't.
The base Carrera has a very responsive engine and a really nice blend of torque/power profile - handles well too. One is a practical purpose built sports car and one isn't.
One is a purpose built Grand Touring coupe, the other is a sporty coupe derived from a standard coupe platform, which has resulted in many excellent cars.
The carerra doesn't have to look aggressive. Wanna know why? It looks like a Porsche - that is enough and it has nothing to prove to anyone. The M4 was designed for the generation that was blowing up their Skunk2 or Spoon B16B & B18C Vtecs when "Fast and Furious" came out and have started to make a little more money.
The M4 rear seats are hardly more practical than a 991. Also the frunk in the 991 is about the same size as the trunk in the M4.
The M4 rear seats are hardly more practical than a 991. Also the frunk in the 991 is about the same size as the trunk in the M4.
The rear seats are bigger and easier to access. In addition, the rear seats fold down, making carrying larger and longer items a non issue. Not sure about frunk/trunk dimensions, but in my experience, the M4 trunk is more useable.
#36
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I have, not as special as the earlier M cars, but its entirely liveable, fun enough to drive, and really good looking. This is a street car, so ultimate performance is meaningless.
One is a purpose built Grand Touring coupe, the other is a sporty coupe derived from a standard coupe platform, which has resulted in many excellent cars.
Huh? Are you bipolar? A GT3 RS is a $200k car...a tarted up version of a $92k car. The M4 is a tarted up version of a $40k car. At least be consistent. As to the price argument, there are many very expensive cars that are total crap to drive, so its pointless.
I know you are a porsche brand *****, so just it being a porsche is enough for you. A base 991 is just so boring. Its so ordinary. It has nothing interesting about it. Its capable, sure. But thats about it. If the M4 is for the F&F crowd, a 991 is for old chubby accountants. Stereotypes are fun.
The rear seats are bigger and easier to access. In addition, the rear seats fold down, making carrying larger and longer items a non issue. Not sure about frunk/trunk dimensions, but in my experience, the M4 trunk is more useable.
One is a purpose built Grand Touring coupe, the other is a sporty coupe derived from a standard coupe platform, which has resulted in many excellent cars.
Huh? Are you bipolar? A GT3 RS is a $200k car...a tarted up version of a $92k car. The M4 is a tarted up version of a $40k car. At least be consistent. As to the price argument, there are many very expensive cars that are total crap to drive, so its pointless.
I know you are a porsche brand *****, so just it being a porsche is enough for you. A base 991 is just so boring. Its so ordinary. It has nothing interesting about it. Its capable, sure. But thats about it. If the M4 is for the F&F crowd, a 991 is for old chubby accountants. Stereotypes are fun.
The rear seats are bigger and easier to access. In addition, the rear seats fold down, making carrying larger and longer items a non issue. Not sure about frunk/trunk dimensions, but in my experience, the M4 trunk is more useable.
Porsche... so the GT2 set a ring lap record - against Million dollar cars. Porsche is compared to the likes of Ferrari, Lambo, etc for performance. M's are compared to mustangs and Maros. I LOVE M's up to mid 2000's. My M Roadsters Z3 body were some of my favorite cars I've owned. The new ones again ride like crap, don't handle and don't stop well. They have a stupid right pedal that is on or off with nothing in between completely designed to make it FEEL like a fast muscle car that the middle class buys for perceived status. I just don't like contemporary M cars for these reasons.
#37
I own a 650ix BMW and I test drove almost all of the new 3's, 4's 5's series cars. I don't think BMW wants to do the 'best sports car thing' like Porsche and others try to. BMW seems to make cars 30% of all the cars they compete with but never best at any of the categories. No one could say 'but BMW is best at this!' They are not.
#38
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I own a 650ix BMW and I test drove almost all of the new 3's, 4's 5's series cars. I don't think BMW wants to do the 'best sports car thing' like Porsche and others try to. BMW seems to make cars 30% of all the cars they compete with but never best at any of the categories. No one could say 'but BMW is best at this!' They are not.
The 650 is a fantastic car for what it is. Try to review it as a sports car and it comes out like an awful car. Just like that new lexus LC - comparing it to a sports car and it seems bad. Comparing it to a GT cruiser and its a great car.
IMHO the 440 is a better car than the M4. It is a nice sporty coupe. The M4 is just a wannabe muscle car with honda bodykit parts with a BMW badge.
#39
I had a 440 as a loaner, and is it just me or does it seem kind of.. cheap? I understand loaner cars aren't the best equipped, but all the materials felt really cheap compared to my X5M. Obviously the seats weren't real leather, which I expected. What I didn't expect was everything else. The buttons felt cheap, the iDrive wheel felt cheap and flimsy, the turn/windshield wiper stalks felt cheap, the screen looked cheap. Is that how the 3/4 series cars are now, or are loaner cars made with bargain basement materials? My E92 M3s and X5M felt much higher quality everywhere.
#40
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Not a Porsche ***** - we have BMW and Merc in our home too... love Jags and many other cars but I think the new M's are all junk.
Porsche... so the GT2 set a ring lap record - against Million dollar cars. Porsche is compared to the likes of Ferrari, Lambo, etc for performance. M's are compared to mustangs and Maros. I LOVE M's up to mid 2000's. My M Roadsters Z3 body were some of my favorite cars I've owned. The new ones again ride like crap, don't handle and don't stop well. They have a stupid right pedal that is on or off with nothing in between completely designed to make it FEEL like a fast muscle car that the middle class buys for perceived status. I just don't like contemporary M cars for these reasons.
Porsche... so the GT2 set a ring lap record - against Million dollar cars. Porsche is compared to the likes of Ferrari, Lambo, etc for performance. M's are compared to mustangs and Maros. I LOVE M's up to mid 2000's. My M Roadsters Z3 body were some of my favorite cars I've owned. The new ones again ride like crap, don't handle and don't stop well. They have a stupid right pedal that is on or off with nothing in between completely designed to make it FEEL like a fast muscle car that the middle class buys for perceived status. I just don't like contemporary M cars for these reasons.
#41
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I had a 440 as a loaner, and is it just me or does it seem kind of.. cheap? I understand loaner cars aren't the best equipped, but all the materials felt really cheap compared to my X5M. Obviously the seats weren't real leather, which I expected. What I didn't expect was everything else. The buttons felt cheap, the iDrive wheel felt cheap and flimsy, the turn/windshield wiper stalks felt cheap, the screen looked cheap. Is that how the 3/4 series cars are now, or are loaner cars made with bargain basement materials? My E92 M3s and X5M felt much higher quality everywhere.
I also loath the aftermarket looking screen in many of these new cars.... looks cheap to me.
#42
I'm specifically looking for rear-wheel drive for a more lively driving experience. Which one would ride more comfortably - I've read conflicting opinions on this. Not too worried about storage space... more interested in driving dynamics / fun to drive factor at less than jail time speeds.
Bottom line is that the M4 is a good choice for someone who wants a powerful car with above average handling, and needs a back seat. If you want world class handling, then a 991 is the easy choice.
#43
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Viper set a lap record too, but who cares. Unless you spend your time lapping the nring, what does it matter. This is a street car. Porsches are compared to camaros and mustangs too. A base carrera is not being compared to a 488...they are in a massively different league. And you seem to think that because its a porsche, its better...making you a porsche *****.
Because it's a Porsche it has a certain build quality, driver feel and level of engineering - across any model or trim the brand offers. This is consistently a higher level when comparing the cheapest Porsche to the most expensive BMW. So yes, I am a Porsche *****. Everything they make feel and performs as if it was made well. Because it is a Porsche, it IS better than a BMW - because of the reasons I stated and also status if any cares; i don't but many do.
IMO - a base 911 is more fun to drive on the street than a modern 488 which is basically a street legal race car. An M4 is less fun to drive on the street than a base 911 or any Porsche 2 door for that matter. So.... I still prefer the 911/porsche > 488. The viper was a brilliant sports car. The M4 isn't brilliant for anything.
FOR ME, I have a cab because I'm not a hardcore track junky. I want a really solid all around sports car that I can drive anywhere, anytime and fit luggage to take my wife for the weekend or just go out to dinner in. The sole competitor for this is a Lotus but they don't offer a cab. Again, for me and the majority of 911 owners, Porsche is the sole option in the market for this segment.
Sorry that you think the M4 is a nirvana but there is much data to support it has drifted far from the genius that was a 2002, E30, E36 and E46 M car.
#44
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A 911 on the other hand, is not in drag. A base 991.2 is like the hottest chick in your high school. Not the hottest chick in the world, but the kind dreams are made of. A 991.2 S is like the hottest chick in your college—she would’ve been the hottest chick out of 20 high schools. Not essential to have the S, but offers just a little more. A little more dreamy. The Turbo is like a super hot 30 something trophy wife with fake **** wearing lots of jewelry. On the arm of an older guy in $400 Prada sneakers and white jeans. She looks expensive and isn’t quite as pure. The GT3 is like a 20 year old Eastern Eurpean model. Skinny, tight. Lusty as all hell on the runway. Not that easy to live with every day.
#45
M's have real leather but the cheap buttons are consistent. The fit/finish in my 5 series M sport is way nicer as is the X5 vs X3. 3 series aren't that much more $$$ than fords and hyandais now days so there's the building to a target price equation happening.
I also loath the aftermarket looking screen in many of these new cars.... looks cheap to me.
I also loath the aftermarket looking screen in many of these new cars.... looks cheap to me.