Macca, good comparative review, and mostly in line with my impressions of the two cars. Areas where we differ may be partly due to the GT4 you drove not being factory stock; our GT4 is factory stock, while our GT3 has some alignment adjustment and front bar at stiff, and definitely feels a bit different than factory stock.

I enjoy both cars on the road, and here are the things that jump out to me:

- Using the manual in the GT4 is a pleasure, and for the past several weeks I've driven it only with the sport button off. A substantially bigger blip is needed from 3rd to 2nd, as compared to 4th to 3rd, which maybe reinforces the notion that the gearing isn't quite right. But the PDK in manual mode also has its unique pleasures, even after many thousands of miles.

- The ride quality of the GT4 is more compliant. Lately, I've put the GT4 dampers on firm to tighten up the feel of the car, whereas the GT3 feels a bit too harsh with dampers on firm.

- The rear vs mid engine feel of the two cars is very apparent. The GT3 is still a 911, even as a 991. I like the feel of both, but I have special attachment to the 911 layout, and I think the world would have been a discernably lesser place if the 911 hadn't been created a half century ago.

- The GT4 is objectively lighter than the GT3, but doesn't subjectively feel lighter (and Cayman R feels much lighter than the GT4).

- The soundtrack of the GT3 is hard to beat, still leaves me in awe after winding up the engine. The soundtrack of the GT4 is great ... until you hear the GT3. I rode in a friend's 996 cup back to back with driving my GT3 on track, and while the cup of course sounded more race car (because it is!), I like the sound of the GT3 just as much, if not a little more.

- The GT4 isn't really underpowered and puts down good numbers, but it definitely feels a bit weak compared to the ferocious thrust of the GT3 when wound up.

- To me, the difference in price is worth it because the GT3 feels like that much more car, but the GT4 is a lot of car too and I think somewhat of a bargain (if not overloaded with options).

For road use, if roads allow opening both cars up, both cars are great, and best to have both, but I might go with the GT3 if forced to pick one. If roads are more limiting (nearly all of the roads in my area), I think I might go with the GT4 if forced to pick one. On track, I don't yet have enough seat time in the GT4 to properly compare, but meanwhile the GT3 remains exhilarating.

 

^ yes. The numbers on the motor just don't tell the story when behind the wheel.

The feeling is this: The GT4 wakes up and pulls hard pretty low but then starts to sort of taper. The GT3 (997 or 991) just feel like they will keep pulling and pulling and pulling. It's that intensity that is missing on the GT4.

You can see it on track too. My 997 isn't terribly more power-wise from the GT4 (comparing wheel dynos... ). But while the GT4 carries more corner entry to apex speed, and gets the shot on me out of the corner (because I'm a ***** and still learning to tame the beast) about 1/3 to 1/2 way on the straight I'm pulling on the GT4. And then it's the same story again on the next corner. GT4 can carry a massive amount of cornering speed.

At Thunderhill 3mi, similar tire-spec and chassis setups 997.2 GT3RS to GT4... Lap times were nearly identical (same driver). But for him GT4 is much easier to drive at the limit where 911 requires massive sack on the hairy edge.

Of course 991GT/RS is just another level, power, grip, chassis, and PDK.

If I get some time later today I'll overlay some data from the track last weekend on my RS vs. another GT4.

 

Macca- Great review and I do not disagee ith your assessment . Coming from the 991 GT3 there is no doubt "that freakin engine" is a masterpiece and I hope they get it all sorted out.

The GT4 is all about the Manual although we all know it it a little more than that but in the modern sports car world today it is one of the best Manuals. I used to think the R8 V10 had the best Manual with its gated shifter but the GT4 is slightly even better and that says a lot.

I do prefer the damping of the GT4 though. I find the GT3 to be a little stiffer in "normal" mode but really splitting hairs here.

The Exhaust- GT3 louder and I think the extra 1500 RPM make the difference but I think the note out of the GT4 is sweeter sounding but I have also added headers and exhaust so that could add to the difference.

Glad you had a chance to really exploit the Gt4 a little. When the 991.2 with a Manual comes out there will be a lot of tough decisions being made by both the GT4 and 991.1 GT3 Owners.

 

Nice post and writeup, Macca! Since I own both, I would have to concur with your assessment!

 

...and someone who we can trust on his opinions.

 

Great write up Macca, thanks for sharing your thoughts. Just a small correction: The GT4 has a longer wheelbase than the GT3, so what you felt may have been the rear wheel steering rather than (an erroneous) longer wheelbase on the GT3. Like Manifold and Jimmy-D, I think the longer wheelbase of the GT4 may be the reason the car feels more "compliant" than the GT3.
I got a chance to drive my GT4 and my friend's GT3 back to back on a great road recently also. And I wrote it up here: https://philipganderton.com/personal...-gt3-compared/

 

I find all mid engined cars to be much easier to drive until at the sharp edge of adhesion (especially those with lots of power), at which point they can be snappy as hell. I'm a huge fan of the rear engine, be brave with corner entry speed, deal with it, put huge grip down on the way out. Driven properly it's more predictable to me and way f'ing fun

 

Good review but where's the drifting video.....?

 

I drove both on separate days a month apart earlier this year at the PEC. First the GT3, and my initial impression of the GT4 was the same - where did the engine go? I think this comes from pulling away in a car that feels basically the same from the driver seat. After getting up to speed a lap later and focusing on the car under you, the GT3's manic engine was forgotten.

My next impression was how absolutely amazing the PCCBs felt on the GT4. The GT3 had them as well, where they felt well matched to the chassis and did not stand out; perhaps a combination of less weight and less speed in the GT4 presented an overkill situation. Not only were the initial bite and unrelenting force eye opening, but the GT4 felt much more stable under braking at 10/10ths.

Compared to the GT3 I found more understeer in the GT4, which I attribute to the longer wheelbase and lack of RWS that effectively shortens the GT3's wheelbase even further. As an aside - I loathe electronic controls interfering with my analog driving experience, but dammit the GT3 turns in well!

The auto-blip was fun for five minutes, but then I turned it off and H/T myself, which was more fun.

I came away with a similar engine/transmission conclusion as Macca, but with a different perspective. To me both cars were too easy. The GT3 because of PDK, and the GT4 because I feel it is underpowered compared to the chassis, as I did with my 987 Spyder. Obviously both chassis and engine are improved in the GT4, but to me the net result is the same - both mid-engined cars are a lot of fun, but not particularly challenging. The answer for me, of course, would have been the 911R. Or a GT3 motor in the GT4. We'll see what the future holds with the next generations of both - perhaps one of them will get me back into a Porsche.

 

Great review Mark.
I happen to own both cars and the comments are spot on. Only other negative issue with the GT4 that I can add, which Mark has not touch on, is the wheel/ rear axle hop. If you try to launch the GT4 even at low RPM's e.g 3500 RPM, you are presented with excessive rear axle hop, and of course this is exaggerated if the ground is wet.
Again well done and great review. Mark

 

Alan .... I completely agree with you on the GT4 PCCB brakes. The initial bite is so strong, it really takes you by surprise. On wet surfaces if you are not careful, you will invoke ABS almost immediately. Every time I drive the GT4, I have to make huge adjustment on how I tackle my brakes, to avoid slamming my passenger into the windshield! Mark

 

Thanks Alan and others.

Alan I agree these cars are comparatively "too easy" especially compared to their older siblings. The GT4 with auto blip is a very easy gearbox to use and IMO a halfway house to the PDK in manual mode.

It should be said we were both driving the GT3 in manual mode on those back roads (it's the only mode I use when driving that car proper).

Also the GT4 had the DSC suspension box and I left it in whatever mode Leong had set which may have been quite stiff compared to stock.

Both cars were on fairly fresh fitted MPSC2 and both were at factory alignment and height (Leongs car has been returned to road settings for Targa in October).

My car has DMS headers fitted with air filters and RT RE10 pads 24 hours before this drive. Otherwise it is 100 stock. I'll write a review on DMS shortly. The sound is great.

Just wanted to tidy up a few points there so all differences in cars were known....glad you find the review of interest and value - I think it was a great insight for both Leong and myself too...

 

Ps I also must add both these cars are ROW variants Cubsport 003 spec with the half cages fitted by the factory so this may have affected the stiffness of the chassis in both cars just FYI. Roads were narrow bitumen with many negative cambers and uneven surfaces in places , back road rural roads little bit like what you find in UK but tight and windy like Tail of the Dragon in places....

 

Very cool. Having had both overtime and can relate to that with a difference that I'm not as good driver as Macca. Thanks for an excellent review

 

Agree!