M3the01

Those that have had rear glass break, are u using any of the wind diffuser pieces? To prevent the wind buffeting...

ipse dixit

Not true in every event in the U.S.

Gary(SF)

I should have said "Every event I have run on the West Coast..."

tgibrit

that would be a good data point. all the track events I have run require windows to be down and as such I use the wind diffuser pieces with fortunately no rear break so far.

M3the01

I too, but above 140 MPH on the laguna seca straight i still get it, just at the end so likely above 125 MPH. I havent had a crack and hoping not too ...

loungin

yes I have the AWE and I was super pissed to find out the rear still fractured.




that’s fast. I’m usually 120-126 top speed at Laguna. I didn’t even notice the buffeting.

usrodeo4

So the 991.2 GT3 RS rear window is glass and not Polycarbonate like the GT2 RS? Did not know that. Glad that it is covered by warranty. Have you considered going to the GT2RS rear window?

AnthonyGan

im also carious about this too!

Marcus S.

Porsche 991.2 GT3 RS, GT2 RS and the 991.2 Carrera T has the same rear window, Gorilla Glas.

My rear window cracked and was changed under warranty 2018 and after that it's fine.

ipse dixit

Not true either.

As I am in CA

TRAKCAR

More and more US tracks and organizers allow windows up.
Ive only attended events that allow windows up and cancelled all others.
50+ track days, many at Sebring and 20,000 miles later I sold the car with its original rear window. And a personele clean interior. It’s not easy to clean what’s behind the seats with a roll bar in the way.

Porsche coukd add a winter tire type warning, windows can’t be open over 200kph or something...

They could also sell us a CS package in a box, so we do t have to copy the OEM roll bars and hack into our tubs to mount them.

- Manufacturers are so sure that windows up are safer in a crash that when there is an impending crash or the car is crashing, some cars close the windows automatically, so those will be closed anyway and a tool is needed.- DE cars have no safety nets. Race cars are not allowed on track without them because flailing arms out of the car is too dangerous; Yet in DE it’s mandatory to stick your entire arm out of the car. Crazy.
- Point by’s at 150 MPH, LOL! We are supposed to extend our entire arm out the window and over the roof. Good luck with that at high speed parts of the track.
- Debris enters the cockpit hitting the driver causing injury and maybe even an incident, typically rubber coming off cars, but also car parts or other debris flying up left after other incidents.
- When crashing, its preferred not to die from sharp pieces flying into the car cutting neck.
- Side window glass is extremely strong for a reason, it helps the structure of the car, we have all seen the guys trying to break them by throwing bricks and failing. – Yes a little ceramic hammer the size of a fingernail breaks it easily.
- Cars are not build to go 150MPH with the windows down - Your head wobbles in the car due to turbulence, hard to focus on your marks and induces vertigo. In the Porsche 991 if you don’t add little foils on the A pillar to prevent the windows blow out.
- Cars are not build to go 150MPH with the windows down – rear windows have been known to blow out, potentially causing incidents.
- With the windows up the side airbag curtains are more effective.

- Heat stroke or just heat fatigue leads to accidents, for this reason IMSA and other race groups make AC mandatory in the closed cockpit cars.

-It is safer to instruct – new student drivers have no business staking their hand off the wheel at modern car track speeds.

-Safety to instruct because communication with the student is easy, does not depend on unreliable head sets.

-Many shorts and tshirt only drivers would suit up in protective gear and full face helmets if they could keep the interior cool.

-Drivers can hear what the engine is doing instead of only hearing wind noise.

-Al manufacturers driving schools are operated with windows up for safety. They may be on to something.

-Driver safety during a crash should be primary. Extraction is the second thought however a net barely slows extraction and helps the primary focus to limit injuries during the incident.

-Arm out the window – specifically some new drivers who give confusing signals are dangerous. A turn signal is clear, every time!

It is silly for Track event organizers to make the decision for the drivers as opposed to give the drivers a choice – and thereby assume liability by going against manufacturers recommendations.

The fact that each group makes certain exceptions for night driving, wet driving or for cars that have fixed windows, just adds to the negligence. As a DE chair I would want to be free of the responsibility and give the drivers a choice.


Many US DE drivers are appalled by the enforced rules by some in the US that go against all ROW organizations.



The excuse:

Mostly the reason for mandatory windows down is to extracate the driver from the car.
But actually with most race seats and it is impossible to get a XXL size driver out of the car without the significant risk of further injury:

“only extricate a driver is there's imminent risk of a fire or visual major blood loss. Otherwise, the spine needs to be secure before moving the person. That takes way longer than breaking a glass. So, the argument of "prompt medical assistance " for the windows down falls short. It's borderline criminal to hastily remove someone from an accident without reasonable reason (fire, visual blood loss or clinical findings of so). Never mind trying to yank an insured driver out of side window opening.”
For a layman to do that, Good Samaritan laws may provide some coverage, for professionals doing that for a living, in not so sure.



From a Porsche engineer:

Quote: Oliver Berg, Manager GT-Product Porsche
“Only 20 the 5,000 first generation 991 GT3 RS owners ticked the box for a/c delete,” said Oliver. “The fact is that while the 14kg weight saving might sound good on paper the discomfort you will experience when wearing a race suit and helmet on track in summer is simply not worth it. You will be hot and bothered and slower because you cannot concentrate as well compared to when you are cool and comfortable.”
http://9tro.com/media/features/new-c...1#content-page
http://9tro.com/media/features/new-c...2#content-page

Gary(SF)

Well, I get what you are saying, but if you re-read my post I said "every event I have run on the west coast" and that is in fact true. I don't pretend to have run with all possible organizers.

FastLaneTurbo

I also saw my friends 2019 GT3RS Rear "Gorilla Glass" Window break at Sebring during his 3rd Run late last year.

A bit OT, but some excellent Track Safety Considerations from Robert Mitchell, a highly experienced co-owner and VERY
Fast Driver of Nurburgring's Apex Ring "TAXI" Service. Lots of other interesting Robert Mitchell Videos driving the Ring on You Tube.

JC68

Well said Trakcar. Turn signals are much safer than sticking your arm out and holding the steering wheel with one hand at high speed.

WB07

Always thought point to pass seemed at odds with safety especially when you are flying at 120mph+ with just one hand on steering; windows down to point...anyway, hope the rules gets changed for our US cousins.

Here in the UK, windows up is allowed; use of the turn signals is advised as is common on public roads anyhow.

On rear window, my '16 3RS was replaced under warranty due to the adhesive failing. OPC found fault during routine service. Replacement is polycarbonate as before as far as I can tell. I expect this to need another attention in a few years though.. we shall see.