2018 GT3 vs 2019 GT3 on track- actively updating
11-03-2018, 04:47 PM
#106
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All the reasons you mentioned is exactly *why* Sonoma is great. Part of a great car is also how much confidence it inspires in the driver to not have those chicken lifts in key areas that will cost time.
It's the same reason why people lose so much time T9 at T-Hill. Requires full confidence in the car and their skill to stay on the gas when the car lightens up.
For most drivers doing trackdays, confidence is the biggest barrier to improving. It's rarely the car.
It's the same reason why people lose so much time T9 at T-Hill. Requires full confidence in the car and their skill to stay on the gas when the car lightens up.
For most drivers doing trackdays, confidence is the biggest barrier to improving. It's rarely the car.
11-03-2018, 05:07 PM
#107
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I couldn't be happier with the PCCB on my .2 3RS. I couldn't agree more with the whole confidence inspiring argument. Here is a cool pic from when I tracked it two days after the Petit Le Mans at Road Atlanta.
11-03-2018, 06:50 PM
#108
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11-03-2018, 07:42 PM
#110
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CJ, if we ever want to do a similar event/comparison at AMP in AZ... let me know... would be fun!
Best Regards,
Dave
11-03-2018, 08:23 PM
#111
CJ and I are on The Throttle dogs instagram and Throttle Dogs Youtube : Link to our Youtube
CJ and I formed Throttle Dogs about 8 months ago to bring the perspective of two car guys - one who can drive the hell out of a car. The other - is more the normal car enthusiast.. which I guess would be me.
We'll be bringing more content with a bunch of shenanigans and tomfoolery
CJ and I formed Throttle Dogs about 8 months ago to bring the perspective of two car guys - one who can drive the hell out of a car. The other - is more the normal car enthusiast.. which I guess would be me.
We'll be bringing more content with a bunch of shenanigans and tomfoolery
11-03-2018, 11:00 PM
#113
My experience as well. Target is 32-33 hot at the end of a 20-25 min session.
I found that at our local tracks, 25 psi cold Michelin will get to 32 psi. Dunlops heat up more and require lower cold pressure - 23 psi. By the time the tires get up to 29-30 psi after a few laps, you are already getting excellent grip and maintaining that level of performance as the pressure creeps towards 32-33 psi.
Even with these starting pressures, if you are abusing the tires, you can easily get them to spike in pressure/temperature. Not being smooth with the throttle application, or allowing the front end to go into understeer in low-speed corners due to too much steering angle, and the tires can easily spike to 36-38 psi at the abused corner. At that point, there is no grip at all.
I found that at our local tracks, 25 psi cold Michelin will get to 32 psi. Dunlops heat up more and require lower cold pressure - 23 psi. By the time the tires get up to 29-30 psi after a few laps, you are already getting excellent grip and maintaining that level of performance as the pressure creeps towards 32-33 psi.
Even with these starting pressures, if you are abusing the tires, you can easily get them to spike in pressure/temperature. Not being smooth with the throttle application, or allowing the front end to go into understeer in low-speed corners due to too much steering angle, and the tires can easily spike to 36-38 psi at the abused corner. At that point, there is no grip at all.
Moving on, given this thread is clearly becoming an advert for a channel so I'll cut to the chase: 720s is a minimum of 2 seconds a minute quicker than the current GT3 when on P-Zero. The reality is, its on a different level to the GT3 - more akin to the GT2RS. If you put the 720s on PZC4 Corsa which are about the same as MPSC2 the gap widens - considerably.
To highlight how different these cars are - I have pulled together a simple graph (real data).
You have to keep one thing in mind - the Mclaren in stock form comes with P Zeros which aren't that great for track use - they are capable of one or two quick laps and even then they haven't got a particularly good sidewall - so under hard cornering they can feel a little skittish. In a straight line its night and day its not even close see graph.
I'm surprised this wasn't noted - its one of the most obvious things you notice when you get in a 720S - put your foot down and it just keeps on going and going and going. The other obvious thing you notice is the suspension - its fantastic - can't say enough good things about it.
I really am a great fan of what Porsche do but as an enthusiast with no cars to sell or website to market - the 720s is about as good as it gets, put the cars on the same tires or at least equivalent and then tell it as it is.
Last edited by groundhog; 11-04-2018 at 02:57 AM. Reason: typos
11-04-2018, 12:26 AM
#116
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You will simply destroy the sidewalls - the advice you got applies to track tires - MPSC2 are street tires, they are not race tires with heavy duty sidewalls. With Porsche you are best running 34f/36r hot on MPSC2N1 - you'll find its optimal. Just as Michellin recommend
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https://www.michelin.com/eng/media-r...ck-performance
11-04-2018, 12:29 AM
#117
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11-04-2018, 12:44 AM
#119
Michelin has developed new Cup2’s with embedded temp/pressure sensors in the tread (rather than TPMS which is on the wheel) and an iPhone app to optimize pressures for best track performance. Pretty sure they set the target at 32psi (2.2 Bar is 31.9 psi):
https://youtu.be/HuWxQruS79I
https://www.michelin.com/eng/media-r...ck-performance
Literally terrified how much those tires will run....
11-04-2018, 12:59 AM
#120
Michelin has developed new Cup2’s with embedded temp/pressure sensors in the tread (rather than TPMS which is on the wheel) and an iPhone app to optimize pressures for best track performance. Pretty sure they set the target at 32psi (2.2 Bar is 31.9 psi):
https://youtu.be/HuWxQruS79I
https://www.michelin.com/eng/media-r...ck-performance
Just keep in mind that track looks like its at altitude - so a correction would have to made e.g. 2.1 to 2.3 bar is ~ 30.5PSI to 33.5PSI (so if this was at 5000ft) the pressure at sea level would be an additional ~2.5PSI - so roughly 33PSI to 36PSI at or near sea level. (We're probably on the same page)
So those of you in Denver would be running hot at 32/33 would be running the equivalent of 34.5/35.5 down on the flats (e.g. near sea level).
Last edited by groundhog; 11-04-2018 at 02:58 AM.