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How come McL and Ferrari have turbo V8s and weigh the same or less than a P GT car?

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How come McL and Ferrari have turbo V8s and weigh the same or less than a P GT car?

 
Old 03-02-2019, 07:30 PM
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96redLT4
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Default How come McL and Ferrari have turbo V8s and weigh the same or less than a P GT car?

I understand Ferrari has the reputation of fudging a little but shouldn't a turbo V8 weigh a lot more than a NA 6?
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Old 03-02-2019, 07:35 PM
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Simple

1-Mac has carbon tub which reduces weight dramatically
2- Ferrari lies their *** off.
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Old 03-02-2019, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Drifting View Post
Simple

1-Mac has carbon tub which reduces weight dramatically
2- Ferrari lies their *** off.
this.
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Old 03-02-2019, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Drifting View Post
Simple

1-Mac has carbon tub which reduces weight dramatically
2- Ferrari lies their *** off.
Sums it up
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Old 03-02-2019, 09:55 PM
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isv
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Ferrari quote dry weights in lightest possible spec and the official factory weight is nothing like the actual customer car weight (a 458/488 would be probably just over 1550kg or thereabouts) when fully fuelled.

Mclaren's cf chassis is lighter but probably not 'dramatically'. Well not unless one considers maybe ~80kg to be dramatic (I don't). They also don't tend to have roll cages (ok not relevant in the US but in Europe that adds a fair chunk of weight to the Porsche) and a smaller fuel tank than what one would expect.
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Old 03-02-2019, 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by isv View Post
Mclaren's cf chassis is lighter but probably not 'dramatically'. Well not unless one considers maybe ~80kg to be dramatic (I don't).
The original Mac CF tub weighs 80Kg by itself, but the CF components in current mclarens save over 300lbs compared to traditional metals in sports cars. Over 300lbs is dramatic difference to me.

Maybe CJ or some Mac owners can comment on the precise amount of weight savings in current Macs due to CF.
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Old 03-02-2019, 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted by 96redLT4 View Post
I understand Ferrari has the reputation of fudging a little but shouldn't a turbo V8 weigh a lot more than a NA 6?
False. Fudging a lot. Put their cars on the Dyno, do a test on a 360, 430, 458, 599, F12, results are shocking.

I have put all my Ferraris on corner weight scales, Truth vs. Ferrari numbers are worlds apart.

Take this. A Pista is 40 Kg (88 lbs) lighter than the new F8. F8 published weight is under 3,000 lbs. A Pista tested recently weighed 3,308 (add another 88 lbs, and the F8 is close to 3,400 lbs not under 3,000 lbs).

McLaren is the real deal, I haven't owned one yet because of the horror stories I have witnessed at my local tracks, a couple of student's cars overheated with them or me driving, so I'm just waiting for them to work for my type of use. The 600LT could be the first one , although the 720S TrackPack is appealing.

McLaren weights are realistic, and they understate their cars power. This I like, the fragile Italian thing got old for me, not going back unless really old stuff (Strad, 308, 512bb).

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Old 03-02-2019, 10:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Drifting View Post
Simple

1-Mac has carbon tub which reduces weight dramatically
2- Ferrari lies their *** off.
Nailed it
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Old 03-03-2019, 12:57 AM
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Originally Posted by A/S View Post
False. Fudging a lot. Put their cars on the Dyno, do a test on a 360, 430, 458, 599, F12, results are shocking.

I have put all my Ferraris on corner weight scales, Truth vs. Ferrari numbers are worlds apart.

Take this. A Pista is 40 Kg (88 lbs) lighter than the new F8. F8 published weight is under 3,000 lbs. A Pista tested recently weighed 3,308 (add another 88 lbs, and the F8 is close to 3,400 lbs not under 3,000 lbs).

McLaren is the real deal, I haven't owned one yet because of the horror stories I have witnessed at my local tracks, a couple of student's cars overheated with them or me driving, so I'm just waiting for them to work for my type of use. The 600LT could be the first one , although the 720S TrackPack is appealing.

McLaren weights are realistic, and they understate their cars power. This I like, the fragile Italian thing got old for me, not going back unless really old stuff (Strad, 308, 512bb).
Hmmmm, what is the new F8?

Edit, oh I found it. F8 Tributo
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Old 03-03-2019, 05:24 AM
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Standard 488GTB weighed at SportAutos' supertest (12/2016) 1553kg with full tank, no rollcage. Tested power was 700hp. 7:22'
Mac 720S weighed at SportAutos' supertest (2/2019) 1437kg with full tank, no rollcage. Tested power was 748hp. 7:08'
Huracan Performante (12/2018) 1604kg / 608hp. 40kg extra from full cage and race seat. 7:08'
Porsches in the same supertest:
991 GT2RS (7/2018) 1513kg / 696hp. Weissach-pack but race seat from Cup. (+9kg) 6:58'
991.2 GT3RS (9/2018) 1443kg / 519hp. Weissach-pack but race seat from Cup. (no extra weight mentioned) 7:05'
All Nordschleife lap times by same driver, Christian Gebhardt. Different tires and weather conditions of course.

Calculate Pista's real weight from those numbers. OTH in issue 7/2108 was Pista's tracktest in Fiorano. In the text 90 kilos weight saving compared to GTB is mentioned. Then it would weight, with full tank, 1463kg (1553-90). Tank volume is 78l, so weight of the fuel is about 56kg. 1463-56=1407. Ferrari claims 1385kg dry. 22 kg missing...

Last edited by pete95zhn; 03-03-2019 at 07:13 AM.
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Old 03-03-2019, 06:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Drifting View Post


The original Mac CF tub weighs 80Kg by itself, but the CF components in current mclarens save over 300lbs compared to traditional metals in sports cars. Over 300lbs is dramatic difference to me.

Maybe CJ or some Mac owners can comment on the precise amount of weight savings in current Macs due to CF.
what other CF components are you talking about? Body panels? Outside of the LTs or the expensive stuff like the Senna/P1, body panels on the Mclaren are aluminium or fibreglass.

The key part of the Mclaren advantage is the cf monocoque but I don't believe it has a 150kg advantage over say the Ferrari aluminium chassis. The r8 aluminium spaceframe was 200kg but included both front and rear crash structures plus roof. The original 12c monocell was just exactly that - the tub that was 80kg. The 720 has saved some weight over the 12c/650 by incorporating the a pillars/roof into the monocoque. The weight difference between a 488 and a 720 is ballpark ~100kg and some of that will be lighter components/general weight saving. I don't see how you are getting 150kg just from the chassis material.
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Old 03-03-2019, 08:48 AM
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The more impressive point to me is that the Ferrari has no turbo lag
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Old 03-03-2019, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Perimeter View Post
The more impressive point to me is that the Ferrari has no turbo lag
Which is negated again by Ferrariĺs consistency in lying about just about everything performance related. They have to win even if only on paper.
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Old 03-03-2019, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Perimeter View Post
The more impressive point to me is that the Ferrari has no turbo lag
neither does the 720. What I loved about my 488 was the no lag. Didnĺt think other cars could compare. The. I got 720 and every bit as good in terms as no lag but with more power.

The numbers for weight for the 2 cars have been posted above but to me the 720 just drives and feels a lot lighter than 488. 488 is a great drive with no lag. 720 to me is slightly better.
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Old 03-03-2019, 03:44 PM
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96redLT4
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I don't know why I have always had such a want for Ferrari, ever since I was a kid. They rarely seem to be the best when tested objectively against other cars. I think I need to just get one to get it out of my system. After I have 'experienced' ownership I will probably move back to Porsche for the duration.

J
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