perfectlap

My hairdresser drives a 997 Cabriolet. The few women I have known who own Porsches all drive Cayennes.
I'm not sure how this perception that folks in the hair industry and females prefer an impractical roadster over a large convertible or SUV but it really is just that, a false perception. If anything the perception should be that the Boxster and Cayman is popular with middle-aged to retired professional males. Second hand ownership seems to fall towards young professional males and frequent autocrossers and racers looking for the lowest cost to race (BSR/BSX).

p.s.
997 Cabriolet and Cayenne buyers will indeed like the new Boxster. They have no interest in a minimalist sports car/roadster.

orthojoe

You're entitled to your opinion, but I'd say you're being a bit harsh. To me, the 981 is still a great car, and I don't see how the 981 is such a drastic stray from it's predecessor. It's no secret that that Porsche dropped the ball from a visual design aspect on both the 996 AND 986. The prototype 986 looked great, but that's not how it ended up looking. I know very few people that think those cars look fantastic. Nobody likes stereotypes, but stereotypes come up because it's a common occurence. Let's face it, the vast majority Porsche buyers are not car enthusiasts and don't surf these forums. Porsche is in business to make money, not to make me and you happy.

They did a nice improvement on the 997 and 987. They knocked it out of the ball park with the spyder. I think they did a great job with the 991 and a fantastic job on the 981.

The 981 is still lightweight, and I'll bet it performs better than than 987. I hear what you're saying about minimalist, etc. I own a spyder. I'm in the same boat as you when when it comes to the philosophy of a true sports car, but let's not get carried away and smear the 981 and toss it in the trash...

Alan Smithee

Indeed, Porsche is doing everything possible to straddle the line between sports car and luxury car to be all things to all people across the entire range, presumably pacifying the hard-core enthusiasts with Spyder/R/GT models.

stevecolletti

That's the way I see it, too.
I only wish they'd make an even harder core option (like the GT cars on the 911 line) available on the mid-engine cars, a Spyder+/R+.

cvazquez

We are just a drop in the bucket for marketing. Porsche is looking for common acceptance to further exploit their massive product line. IMO Porsche is doing a great job by teasing us with the next Porsche. I plan to upgrade my 2005 Boxster in about 3-years, so the 981 will be my next goal.

Alan Smithee

What I have given up wishing for is a non-GT, de-contented base 911, like the ClubSport/RS America models of the past. I don't need or want 400+ horsepower, flamboyant bodywork, or $100k+ price tag, but I would like lighter weight panels, a focused suspension without electronics, sport buckets, and optional sunroof/leather/AC/rear seats/xenons/big wheels. It would probably occupy the same niche and pricepoint as your Spyder+/R+.

As much as I like the Spyder, and the mid-engine layout is growing on me, I have always had 911s.

perfectlap

I disagree entirely. The core of the 1993 Concept was there in the production car. The styling problem (2.5 engine aside) was one that occurrs with nearly every Porsche, from Carrera to Cayenne: stripping the car down to 16" wheels, not including aero, and removing every interior option from the car makes it look like an almost entirely different car. Porsche make you pay for all those crucial elements that keep it from looking no-frills and gutted.

point in case, look at the basic lines and panels of the concept vs fully treated 986 S below it.
The 96(Euro) to 99 Boxster had all the same panels as the eventual S model in 2000.
yet the front fender is practically the same. Door, door handle and mirror as close as you'll get. Rear quarter panel? Check.
Even the rise of the front fender hips above the sloping hood was nearly identical.

By the way, that 2000 S is nearly 12 years old and it looks as current today as it did back then. I think it has a lot more Porsche in it than anything since.
In other words it will blend into the other Porsches in that museum display than the 987 or 981.






I agree stereotypes tend to be true. That's why politically incorrect jokes are often funny. But the stereotype of a hairdresser or female driving a Boxster is simply not born of common occurrence. The Boxster is a pretty rare car to begin with. Outside of autocrossing and Porsche club events I rarely see another person with one. And I doubt I could count the number who weren't middle-aged to retired professional males driving new ones on the finger of one hand. Female Porsche owners overwhelming prefer the Cayenne. I think this is a stereotype that carried over from other convertibles often seen in the movies or TV shows. It simply is not based on "common occurrence" when it comes to expensive, impractical Porsche branded roadsters. They'll go for the SUV with far grater occurrence, either Range Rover or Cayenne.

perfectlap

The notion that purists are irrelevant to Porsche is entirely and completely false. If you are overwhelmingly selling cars to yuppies, or retirees, then that image will stick sooner or later.
In the process the crucial "edge" that lured buyers away from simply plunking down $70K on a bloated BMW, Jag or Merc convertible will not be there anymore.
You can only live on the Steve Mcqueen past for so long before the Kim Kardashian present catches up to you.
Look at the Corvette. An amazing racing history yet its gold-chain and moustache image isn't one Chevy has been able to escape.
You can't hold onto a motor sports racing image "edge" that is no longer yours, from a design perspective, indefinitely.
And stubbornly avoiding the mid-engine issue in sprint racing will only exacerbate the issue. Ferrari loves every minute of that own foot-shooting.
Ferrari F430 and Italias are now seen as edgy sports coupe when Porsche used to be right up there with them. Instead they'll now compete with Aston,Bentley and Jag type buyers.

ClintonM3

I like the new car. But I prefer the evolution of 997 ->991, than 987 ->981.

Enthusiasts and purists are two different groups with distinct purchasing behaviors. Enthusiasts embrace changes. If I were a marketing manager at Porsche, I would value opinions of the enthusiasts group.

Purists should be riding horses. Cause they don't buy cars that often anyways.

orthojoe

I agree with your feelings, and I wish Porsche would agree too. Porsche IS currently relying on the 'steve mcqueen' past you mention to sell their cars. It's why the cayennes and panamera sales dwarf the sales of their sports cars. Is this being short sighted? Maybe. I would agree with you that if they continue to stray from sports cars that eventually the Kardashian present will catch up to them. In the meantime, they are raking in cash for the short term. Who will be right in the end? Us enthusiasts? Or the marketing people?

It's nice that they still throw the hardcore enthusiasts a bone or two with the spyder, cayman R, GT3 XX. If they make another spyder, I would say that they still care about us. If they don't, it's because they're only concerned about short term volume of sales/profits.

I still think the 981 looks fantastic. I think it will sell well and will appeal to both enthusiasts and non enthusiasts alike, which makes the car a winner for everyone.

orthojoe

LOL. Fantastic quote!

perfectlap

I don't think the average Cayenne buyer could tell you who Steve McQueen was.
While 99% of them could tell you Kim Kardashian has sisters. The Cayenne buyer is buying it from a luxury standpoint. They are neither into off-roading or racing.
I'm not sure I would lump Panamera owners in that not knowing Steve McQueen since most are probably middle-aged and retired males too pooped out to put up with a inconvenient 2+2 Carrera sports car that doesn't really seat more than two.


I don't share that that enthusiasm at all. The new Boxster is very blatantly trying to appeal to Merc/BMW/Lexus convertible type buyer at worst and a 997 Cabriolet buyer at best. Come to think of it, the 981 would have been a great design for Cabriolet Carrera since the coupe version is firmly moving toward the GT category and away from the sport coupe mold. The 981 is not a roadster design. It is overly elaborate, overly appointed inside and 20" SUV sized wheels gives an enthusiast or purist alike fewer tire choices than the already limite 19"variety. This is a "transition" car, get out of your big GT or luxury coupe and get into one of these instead. That's why the 981 design seems to be popular with many Cayenne and 997 owners who say "I could see myself buying that". Of course you do, you want plush.
And don't confuse me for some "I hate anything new" type like a 993 die-hard. The Boxster Spyder is a brilliant minimalist design from the interior to the exterior to the performance. Although putting camping tent top on it really limited the sales. That was a head-scratcher. A Miata style manual top employing ultra light hardware and fabric would have netted the same result.
At any rate Porsche is morphing into global luxury brand and away from a sports car icon. This Boxster is attempt to further that goal. Steve McQueen who? Lucky for us there are still engineers with a head for peformance still working over there on the non-style related wing of the factory.

perfectlap

Probably because there are less than 7 sports cars left on the market now. but dozens of 'sporty' cars with SUV interiors.
Go to your local autocross or nearest track event. Same 7 sports cars every year.

orthojoe

I'm sure you're right, but it's the perception/identity that Mcqueen started that those buyers are buying into. How many people actually track their 'sports cars'? A tiny percentage. You know this. I know this. Porsche knows this.

We're going to have to agree to disagree on this. I'm sure you love your 986, so you should make sure to keep it forever because they'll never make another one like it again. The question now is, if you ever decide to get another car, is there anyone that will fill your pre-requisites?

Would you label anyone that gets a 981 a softie poseur? Don't worry about me. I'm keeping my spyder. If I didnt have a spyder, I would consider a 981. I know a few friends that are considering the 981. They are not softies. We all track our cars on a regular basis at thunderhill, infineon, and laguna seca.

btw, love the bucket seats in your 986

perfectlap

Yes. your car.
But hopefully owned by some softie who only drove around the block to get ice cream every week. I like frequent but miminal miles on my residual loss acquisitions.
I have to say though, I think Porsche have been secretly duped by VW to unveil new cars that none of the traditional enthusiast wants...in order to keep the older ones selling robustly in the second hand market. "I never thought I'd want a 997 until I saw the 991".

They are not softie possuers. They are just not roadster types. They can have all the big plush convertibles they want. Just offer us something like Boxster Spyder that doesn't have doors left over from the Carrera GT parts bin. I like the front end though. At first it struck me as way too Honda S2000, compare full frontal shots even the hood line is the same. but I see the Ferrari Cali resemblance more so now. But that interior. Man...Maybe someone will figure out how to rip out and retrofit the eventual R interior, if they offer a spartan version. I can only imagine what that interior swap would cost.