Looking for 964 Turbo
12-08-2016, 04:05 PM
#77
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TCS, twin turbo, you say?
I'm with ya on the selling thing.
I've had my car for 10 years and even though there was very little wrong with it when I acquired it, my OCD has compelled me to make it perfect. That process will never stop.
However, no one will pay me what I think my car is worth as a result of all the love and mechanical affection I've lavished over it through the years.
One of the guys in our driving group sold his 40,000 mile Turbo 3.6 and bought a 2015 Carrera S so he could watch it fall through the garage floor in value. I'll never understand that move.
So I walk out to the garage, pull the cover off the car and think about how lucky I am to have it (tear rolls down cheek
).
I'm with ya on the selling thing.
I've had my car for 10 years and even though there was very little wrong with it when I acquired it, my OCD has compelled me to make it perfect. That process will never stop.
However, no one will pay me what I think my car is worth as a result of all the love and mechanical affection I've lavished over it through the years.
One of the guys in our driving group sold his 40,000 mile Turbo 3.6 and bought a 2015 Carrera S so he could watch it fall through the garage floor in value. I'll never understand that move.
So I walk out to the garage, pull the cover off the car and think about how lucky I am to have it (tear rolls down cheek
).
My 55k mile car was very original. Therefore it needed steering rack, new suspension/bushings and engine out to fix leaks. Even a new steering shaft.
It all adds up very quickly. but the interior/exterior was perfect.
I did have to pull aftermarket stereo and go back to original to make it right.
The car drives really nice and is very well mannored in day to day traffic.
Everytime i drive it I cant help but lust over the classic curves of the front fender/headlights. Everytime I step out of it, I say to myself that i would never sell something that is so good. The only thing better would be a 3.6L.
Look at what the 930's are fetching.
A well sorted 964T for $125-150k is as good a 911 toy as one could wish for in that price range.
Cant see them ever going down in value.
12-08-2016, 05:02 PM
#78
Three Wheelin'
Wow...you must have inspected first hand to make that determination??? BaT said uneven panels to describe the wobble on top of front plastic bumper. Car wasn't in accident and I had asked far more money for it a couple weeks ago before it sold on BaT. Painted areas we're done perfect. Everything worked including all servos for ventilation, a/c, etc. Was it a perfect car....not with non matching engine but thing was far nicer than the $96k price would indicate but market spoke and it is what it is. Ironically I bought my multi concours awarded 3.6lT back for far less than the selller was asking 3 months also so I guess a bit of softening is happening. My only regret was I wish I had bought another set of RH to put on the 3.3l before I listed it so I could keep the new set of speedlines as backup for the set on my 3.6L?
12-08-2016, 05:30 PM
#79
Rennlist Member
My car has the RH's, and I don't have the original Cup I's either. And through my 10+ years of ownership I have always just thought:
1) I wouldn't run the original 17" Cup I's on my car anyway, so why buy a set (stupid me!,... even if just have them in the attic for potential give-away if I were to sell. now they are so hard to find a original set, which for the LIFE of me I cannot figure out why. With SO many of 3.3 964T owners running either Speedline 18" or RH 18", where did all the original sets go??!!!. anyway...),
2) The Speedlines are so expensive & since I'm happy with the RH's, why should I buy a set (again Stupid Me!). Now they are $10k, and even more so I didn't want to spend that much on rims that are actually heavier than the RH's I have on it now.
But the strangest part, is that I've always just thought my car was just a normal typical 964. I just happened to like Turbo's, and the widebody, so when I bought it 10+ yrs ago, I didn't really think much about the fact that it is all original engine, tranny, paint, interior... I even have all the original exhaust. But now that the wife & I have put it through years of Concours, won many trophies, and fixed every last little thing that might be worn, faded, weatherstipping that shrunk even the slightest, etc etc, I'm starting to realize that it is a special car. And probably deserving of having a set of Speedlines.
You guys give me plenty of food for thought. And since Paul & I so enjoy noodling with our cars,... maybe I will re-vamp my search for a set.
thanks for reading through my ramble here.
=Steve
12-08-2016, 05:46 PM
#80
Rennlist Member
Wow...you must have inspected first hand to make that determination??? BaT said uneven panels to describe the wobble on top of front plastic bumper. Car wasn't in accident and I had asked far more money for it a couple weeks ago before it sold on BaT. Painted areas we're done perfect. Everything worked including all servos for ventilation, a/c, etc. Was it a perfect car....not with non matching engine but thing was far nicer than the $96k price would indicate but market spoke and it is what it is. Ironically I bought my multi concours awarded 3.6lT back for far less than the selller was asking 3 months also so I guess a bit of softening is happening. My only regret was I wish I had bought another set of RH to put on the 3.3l before I listed it so I could keep the new set of speedlines as backup for the set on my 3.6L?
EDIT: Although, I do have to say that original Speedlines would certainly bolster the price. Eh, whatever. Getting into a pissing match over car prices is silly. Pay what you think it's worth.
12-09-2016, 09:58 AM
#81
Rennlist Member
Problem is there is far too much product on the market. There are a ton of plain jane 3.6T's with 40k miles asking $330k. It isn't happening for now at least. $250-275k possibly but that is still huge and many people are just posting numbers.
No doubt no matter how fine the car was non matching numbers is going to hurt its value. When I was looking for my car I came across a couple of non matching and S title cars and they would not move or eventually brought 50% the value of a pristine example. Granted a pristine 3.6T at the time would fetch between $55-60K selling at $30k to some was a bargain especially if they only cared about driving it. I am not saying that Sccchiii's car would have fetched $180k if it was matching numbers but no doubt it would have seen more than it sold for.
Sounds to me like Sccchiii bought and sold well. $96K is strong money especially right now for a non matching numbers car. I would have expected less. Buying back his 3.6T at a reasonable price also a wise move. Has the market softened? To a degree. But I still see people buying base 964's for strong money and end up needing a ton of work that was overlooked when purchased.
I am working on a nice C2 now that has just over 106k miles on it. The car is very nice and mechanically sound. That doesn't mean it doesn't need a lot of $$ invested.
It is amazing how far some will go to cover up simple problems that should be disclosed. Maintained by a reputable Massachusetts shop for a while then driven by the current owner I now will have me some 40 hours into the job and about $1000 worth of new hose clamps, oil lines etc. A missing simple rubber isolation support at the top of the oil tank due to improperly routing the new oil lines caused a huge mess that only showed up after he drove it for a while.
Improper hose routing caused it to rub against the support bracket. This also wouldn't allow them to fit the isolation mount so they omitted it causing the hose clamps to cut into the oil lines as well as having the metal return pipe rub against the tire. It also put undo stress on the metal pipe that mounts to the engine case causing it to leak. I had to drop the complete exhaust to clean out the heater boxes and fix a lot of items that went unobserved. A $4 part and lazy mechanic can cost you thousands in repairs after the fact.
This is one of so many cars I see that sell for strong money and the ones i see sell for what people see as reasonable have far more hidden issues.
These cars have always been what people were willing to pay it was all the speculators that ruined it for everyone. No doubt current prices were still something nobody believed we would see just 5 years ago.
No doubt no matter how fine the car was non matching numbers is going to hurt its value. When I was looking for my car I came across a couple of non matching and S title cars and they would not move or eventually brought 50% the value of a pristine example. Granted a pristine 3.6T at the time would fetch between $55-60K selling at $30k to some was a bargain especially if they only cared about driving it. I am not saying that Sccchiii's car would have fetched $180k if it was matching numbers but no doubt it would have seen more than it sold for.
Sounds to me like Sccchiii bought and sold well. $96K is strong money especially right now for a non matching numbers car. I would have expected less. Buying back his 3.6T at a reasonable price also a wise move. Has the market softened? To a degree. But I still see people buying base 964's for strong money and end up needing a ton of work that was overlooked when purchased.
I am working on a nice C2 now that has just over 106k miles on it. The car is very nice and mechanically sound. That doesn't mean it doesn't need a lot of $$ invested.
It is amazing how far some will go to cover up simple problems that should be disclosed. Maintained by a reputable Massachusetts shop for a while then driven by the current owner I now will have me some 40 hours into the job and about $1000 worth of new hose clamps, oil lines etc. A missing simple rubber isolation support at the top of the oil tank due to improperly routing the new oil lines caused a huge mess that only showed up after he drove it for a while.
Improper hose routing caused it to rub against the support bracket. This also wouldn't allow them to fit the isolation mount so they omitted it causing the hose clamps to cut into the oil lines as well as having the metal return pipe rub against the tire. It also put undo stress on the metal pipe that mounts to the engine case causing it to leak. I had to drop the complete exhaust to clean out the heater boxes and fix a lot of items that went unobserved. A $4 part and lazy mechanic can cost you thousands in repairs after the fact.
This is one of so many cars I see that sell for strong money and the ones i see sell for what people see as reasonable have far more hidden issues.
These cars have always been what people were willing to pay it was all the speculators that ruined it for everyone. No doubt current prices were still something nobody believed we would see just 5 years ago.
12-09-2016, 10:21 AM
#82
Rennlist Member
You know, I'm probably not noodling with mine enough these days. Sometimes a whole week goes by and I realize I haven't walked out to my garage.
Tomorrow is the day mine goes up on jack stands for the winter. Soon after that I'll be disassembling things again to work on my winter projects so I will be soon spending quality time with my car again.
Tomorrow is the day mine goes up on jack stands for the winter. Soon after that I'll be disassembling things again to work on my winter projects so I will be soon spending quality time with my car again.
01-05-2017, 10:56 PM
#83
Rennlist Member
Looks like some creative (or maybe not so creative) mods to a 3.3
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1992-Porsche...m=332077943288
Definitely not a fan of the rear badging.
plus I'm guessing whoever put the sound system in (incl the rear interior side panels ?w/ subwoofer?), preferred music over exhaust note. Not a fan there either.
But the biggest turn-off for me is the thousands of pictures they included ALL from the same 10-15' distance from the car. Why sooooooo many of the same exterior pics? No close-ups? They could do better.
things that make ya go hmmmm.
Hey, question for you guys. The original window sticker for that car says "heated mirrors". Do we all have heated mirrors by default for our cars? I recall reading somewhere that Porsche directed some heat through tubing to heat the mirrors. Plus I also did not think it was a specific "Option".
Oh, and it doesn't look like this eBay '92 has a Limited Slip Diff either. strange.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1992-Porsche...m=332077943288
Definitely not a fan of the rear badging.
plus I'm guessing whoever put the sound system in (incl the rear interior side panels ?w/ subwoofer?), preferred music over exhaust note. Not a fan there either.
But the biggest turn-off for me is the thousands of pictures they included ALL from the same 10-15' distance from the car. Why sooooooo many of the same exterior pics? No close-ups? They could do better.
things that make ya go hmmmm.
Hey, question for you guys. The original window sticker for that car says "heated mirrors". Do we all have heated mirrors by default for our cars? I recall reading somewhere that Porsche directed some heat through tubing to heat the mirrors. Plus I also did not think it was a specific "Option".
Oh, and it doesn't look like this eBay '92 has a Limited Slip Diff either. strange.
01-06-2017, 12:30 PM
#84
Rennlist Member
L
Hey, question for you guys. The original window sticker for that car says "heated mirrors". Do we all have heated mirrors by default for our cars? I recall reading somewhere that Porsche directed some heat through tubing to heat the mirrors. Plus I also did not think it was a specific "Option".
Hey, question for you guys. The original window sticker for that car says "heated mirrors". Do we all have heated mirrors by default for our cars? I recall reading somewhere that Porsche directed some heat through tubing to heat the mirrors. Plus I also did not think it was a specific "Option".
01-06-2017, 12:35 PM
#85
Rennlist Member
Black cars look better in the shade. LOL
Speculating here but I suspect considerable paint work at one time possible accident damage. I love the polish all over the engine bay. Three of the four wheels appear to have been rebuilt. The valve stems are in the wrong place. Not to mention the gray centers look like crap. The stickers in the engine bay along with the option sticker appear to be reproductions. The rubber tail is in awful shape and shows signs of sitting outside for years. Door jam paint is not great for a 9.5 out of 10. Appears to be a Pilkington aftermarket windshield. There is an indent on the drivers side door card that would make me suspect possible twist to the frame. The only time I have seen that before is with a damaged car that was T-boned and improperly repaired.
Again only speculation a through PPI is a must.
I agree about the stereo but I have to admit that is far better than some of the butcher jobs I have seen. Although what is up with the crappy radar install in the front bumper and I had that same mobil phone in my 1987 Nissan Pathfinder. Panasonic got sued for it and it is analog and unusable. I don't understand why you would spend so much on stereo upgrades only to use a crappy Porsche head unit.
I didn't see where it said heated mirrors I am not sure of an option or existence of them and this has to be one of the lowest optioned cars I have seen. Only options are sunroof and supple leather front and rear.
I also don't know where he is getting his production numbers from. Why not use US spec delivery which is far more impressive?
Is it me or why does the paint look like standard black vs metallic or is L729 different than L738? Not sure if I have seen L729 before and is not a standard 92 color code. If so and it is special order that is a big selling point he has omitted.
Speculating here but I suspect considerable paint work at one time possible accident damage. I love the polish all over the engine bay. Three of the four wheels appear to have been rebuilt. The valve stems are in the wrong place. Not to mention the gray centers look like crap. The stickers in the engine bay along with the option sticker appear to be reproductions. The rubber tail is in awful shape and shows signs of sitting outside for years. Door jam paint is not great for a 9.5 out of 10. Appears to be a Pilkington aftermarket windshield. There is an indent on the drivers side door card that would make me suspect possible twist to the frame. The only time I have seen that before is with a damaged car that was T-boned and improperly repaired.
Again only speculation a through PPI is a must.
I agree about the stereo but I have to admit that is far better than some of the butcher jobs I have seen. Although what is up with the crappy radar install in the front bumper and I had that same mobil phone in my 1987 Nissan Pathfinder. Panasonic got sued for it and it is analog and unusable. I don't understand why you would spend so much on stereo upgrades only to use a crappy Porsche head unit.
I didn't see where it said heated mirrors I am not sure of an option or existence of them and this has to be one of the lowest optioned cars I have seen. Only options are sunroof and supple leather front and rear.
I also don't know where he is getting his production numbers from. Why not use US spec delivery which is far more impressive?
Is it me or why does the paint look like standard black vs metallic or is L729 different than L738? Not sure if I have seen L729 before and is not a standard 92 color code. If so and it is special order that is a big selling point he has omitted.
Last edited by cobalt; 01-06-2017 at 12:54 PM.
01-06-2017, 01:42 PM
#86
Rennlist Member
The first picture of the window sticker says "Heated Mirrors/Washer Nozzles" - about the 5th line down in the center box.
Good catches on many of the other things. That is why you are so valuable to this forum Cobalt!!
And yes I see where it lists "Satin Black Metallic - $712" on the window sticker, and also has L729 on the frunk sticker.
I agree it looks like stnd black,... but again the pictures are of terrible quality, and none of them close-up enough to really tell whether it is metallic or not.
either the seller is just a terrible marketeer,... or it was all done on purpose. Either way it does not instill confidence.
Good catches on many of the other things. That is why you are so valuable to this forum Cobalt!!
And yes I see where it lists "Satin Black Metallic - $712" on the window sticker, and also has L729 on the frunk sticker.
I agree it looks like stnd black,... but again the pictures are of terrible quality, and none of them close-up enough to really tell whether it is metallic or not.
either the seller is just a terrible marketeer,... or it was all done on purpose. Either way it does not instill confidence.
01-06-2017, 03:50 PM
#88
Rennlist Member
Thnx Paul. I don't have the original window sticker for my car,... so I am intrigued as to what Porsche wrote / included on them.
The only thing I have to go on with my car, is my frunk sticker & COA. So things that came standard are good for me to read about.
Btw, I can now see the Metallic in the picture of the jam plate. Plus the writeup says it has XPEL over the entire car,... which probably masks visibility of the metallic in their pics too.
The only thing I have to go on with my car, is my frunk sticker & COA. So things that came standard are good for me to read about.
Btw, I can now see the Metallic in the picture of the jam plate. Plus the writeup says it has XPEL over the entire car,... which probably masks visibility of the metallic in their pics too.
01-06-2017, 03:53 PM
#89
Rennlist Member
My window stick reads the same way. I'm assuming it is a mistake on PCNA's part there was a lot of false info from that time period. The PET shows two types of aero mirrors. Powered and manual for the RSA/RS. I can only assume they are not heated.
Last edited by cobalt; 01-06-2017 at 04:12 PM. Reason: Edit add info regarding PET