Metal Guru

Doing a top end on an engine is a fussy, detail-orientated job, where you check everything you do 3 times. It will be somewhat challenging, very satisfying but one thing it won't be is a piece of cake....

kfitzpat9

Hey,

I agree that taking off the heads will NOT be an easy job and although I am a "novice" at turbos, I did split the case on my 1980 911SC just for fun and after putting it all back together with only a small freezer bag full of parts, I was shocked when it started and had zero oil leaks! I did have some help with the cam timing, the machining of the heads, mic'ing the crank, etc. from people WAY smarter than me (not hard).


So today, I did another leak down test and below are the results.

Cyl 1- 15%
Cyl 2- 27%
Cyl 3- 14%
Cyl 4- 15%
Cyl 5- 12%
Cyl 6 -14%

The above is based on 15 PSI and follows the instructions indicated on the leak down tool I bought. I've done it 3 times now and have gotten fairly consistent results. I did check that there was "play" between the valves and rocker arm to ensure the valves were seated properly.

In addition, I did a 100 PSI approach with a numerical guage on both sides. This approach yielded results that were different and much "better" than the 15 PSI approach. Basically, when looking at it numerically, nearly all the cylinders were spot on, with the exception of the number 2 cylinder which had a minor loss (5%) but was hissing big time from the exhaust port.

Anyway, I'd appreciate your advice on this and more pictures to come!

As a sidenote, the last picture is of a "parting gift" I gave to my friends that are moving to Bogota, Colombia. We had a party with them and 50 of their closest friends last night and thought this gift would get them out of trouble should they have any issues with the authorities.

Gandara

LOL !

Metal Guru

Make sure that you don't have some carbon jamming that valve open and giving you the high leakdown before you tear down.

kfitzpat9

I went by the Porsche dealership today to talk to the top mechanic that had done some work on my brakes in the past. I let him know what was going on with the car and as he is a good guy and true Porsche enthusiast, he offered to come by and take a look at my engine to offer his advice.

He is a gold meister mechanic, one of only 27 in the nation, and therefore knows what he is talking about. He brought his own leak down test kit, as well as a boroscope to look into the cylinders and valves. The bottom line is that although the exhaust leakage is not major right now, he recommended that if I am going to keep the car for awhile (which I plan to do), then go ahead and get it fixed properly.

Now, some people would be disappointed with this news and the time and $ associated with it, but quite frankly, I'm excited and am salivating at the chance to make the engine perfect.

You may be wondering, why would a gold meister mechanic come by my house to help out? Well, I offered to pay him and he said he could not accept. I then offered him and his wife a gift certificate to his favorite restaurant but again, he politely said "no thanks" as it interferes with his day job. The bottom line is that like you, he has a love for Porsche's and wants to help those who share that same passion.

It's either that, or he thinks my wife (shown below) is really hot and needs a reason to stop by. Behave boys and trust me, she has no interest in you unless you have a 959, 73 RSR, 917 or gmund 356 parked in your garage.

Vifa

You just described my garage ! - Let her know that I have all 4

kfitzpat9

I let her know......now she's asking about your total income, size of house, age, weight, etc.

I think I may have to start posting on pelican parts....

Good one, however

Gandara

Is this truth you speak of? You dang liar! Good luck with the top end. I got lucky as mine was done before I purchased the car.

Metal Guru

Here's one of my wife

Boeing 717

Is that a pic of the night you proposed???

kfitzpat9

I got motivated tonight and made some good progress on the top of the top end. As you can see, after removing the intake, there are many blocks of wood holding it up. Therefore, I am playing "jenga" with the manifold and the myriad of hoses associated with it. As there are very few manuals on how to take apart the 964 turbo motor, I thought I would create a "mock up" as I disassembled it so I could remember what I did. I felt the idea of creating a game that combined a Porsche engine rebuild with the Jenga blocks would be revolutionary and would make me billions of dollars! I immediately called my patent attorney to see what I needed to do to ensure noone else had come up with my superior business concept. Shockingly, no one esle had!

Although he is a very positive thinker, he did remind me that the world-wide market of 3.6 turbos consisted of only 1,600 cars and that most of those owners didn't have the time, interest, or knoweldege to rebuild their motors. More importantly, he discovered that most of them hated the game of Jenga as they had an aversion to light weight rectangular wood shapes.

Anyway, below is my progress and more pictures to come.

That's my daughter holding a 50MM wrench (really) in front of the punch list that we created together. For the record, she loves Jenga.

kfitzpat9

I'm making some nice headway and below are the latest pictures. You'll see some colored tie raps in some of the pictures as this is what I'm using to help remember which wires/hoses go where. Thanks to Gandara for sending over some engine dismantling pictures and he also helping with the 964 turbo manuals!

I'm getting ready to order a bunch of parts and would be curious to see who/what you guys recommend. I'm in California and the major stuff I'm looking at getting is below:

Top end rebuild/gasket kit - $425 from Pelican
Pressure plate- considering reusing as it looks fine and is big bucks $725?
Half shaft- I have ticking noise on the driver side-have repacked it to no avail.
Clutch disc & T.O. Bearing- definitely
Senders - oil temp/pressure
Seals not included in above-front/rear/turbo oil line
Pistons Rings-may wait on this as the car only as 60K, but they are cheap.
Cam Chain rails-
Belts Smog-Power St./sparkplugs/ other maint stuff

Also, I dont want to get done and have ANY leaks, so whatever it take to achieve that.

fritz k.

i would guess that the chain railes look fine too.

it is recommend to have a look at the outlet valve guides (clearance), the only weak point of these engines.

fritz

Metal Guru

Actually, it was taken the night I told her I wanted to buy a Turbo

Metal Guru

You are doing a top end, correct? You might consider replacing your rod bolts (another weakness) with ARP bolts without splitting your case. You can access the rod bolts once the cylinder are removed.
You should replace the head studs with ARP or Supertech so if you want to run a little more boost, your heads won't lift.
Porsche recommends replacing the pressure plate when changing the clutch as the dual mass Luk plates cannot be re-surfaced.
If you are replacing rings (you should definitely check for cracked rings) the cylinders will need to be reconditioned.
I'd shop parts prices as Pelican, while they have outstanding service, aren't the lowest price in town. PM me with your email address and I will send you a spread sheet with prices and vendors that I made last winter.
You will need machining services. I'd recommend Supertech in California. Henry has an impeccable reputation for quality work. Send him the pistons and cylinders as well as the heads so that he can see if they are still in spec.
I'd also recommend some light porting of your heads to improve flow. Specifically, the step between where the factory cut the valve seat relief and the port can be blended for a surprising flow gain.