Spokes

Looks like the same as FVDs. https://www.fvd.net/us-en/9643470580...-monoball.html

I used the FVD, works well, and easy to adjust.

cjoenck

If you buy them for export, you can save almost 20% VAT since the price quoted includes tax as it always does in Europe. No tax on exports to outside the EU. On the other hand shipping might eat the difference.

phil_m

I've only encountered one person who replaced the bearings in my ventures. There's an article floating around about it and it required several custom tools. Appeared to be such a pain that sourcing a used torque tube would make more sense. Although I think we can all agree that rationality is only one variable to consider when it comes to 964...And it often loses out to our baser instincts.

A composite torque tube is an interesting premise. Although with the amount of time and money to properly engineer/build one you may be better off upgrading to the 993 torque tube and front diff (the 964 pumpkin in the front has some serious weight to it). I've read the 993 system offers significant weight savings, but only have experience with the 964 so can't confirm or deny.

Either way, I'm in for the madness! Always enjoy your threads.

phil_m

BBI appears to be very similar for $300 USD.

Goughary

Phil- can't imagine the 993 c4 torque tube and front diff would marry to our transaxle and front end, but the idea to try is actually very interesting. I'd love to weigh the parts and see the difference.

I have a 964 front diff and torque tube arriving here in a couple weeks. I'll need to look at the bearings and such. I plan to refresh those and swap them to my car.

I'd love to just cut out portions of the steel on the torque tube and replace with composite, but I'm not an aerospace engineer. Where is Robert Linton when you need him!

Tomfun

I'll be following with interest. My car has a torque tube with bearings that I suspect are shot, creating an annoying whining sound above 50mph - very annoying if I have the shift boot off. Black Sea R&D is setup to replace them for what seems like a reasonable cost, however I'm still somewhat in denial and plan on exploring all other options before shipping a heavy torque tube across the country. One of those options is the front diff - I've been toying with the idea of buying a used one in eBay to try swapping it, but if you're going to tear into one maybe I'll use that as a guide and pull mine apart.

Tom

misteralz

Yep, it's the same one. Interestingly listed as 263mm with an M14 thread on the inner. Same as this:

https://www.bestpartstore.co.uk/7023...-inner-tie-rod

Now, what's stopping me finding an appropriate rod end and saving me 350€ ?

964C2Touring

@Goughary
Hi Rob,

I had the chance to drive a C2 last Friday which had Bilstein B6 with H&R green.
Also had new (oem replacement by JP group) drop links, tie rods, spring plates.
Not sure if control arm bushings and top mounts were new.

The car was on 18 inch BBS lookalike wheels.

Compared to my stock M030 sport suspension car with oem cup1, I was really impressed on how much better the car felt. much more compliant and comfortable.

I believe it was around RS ride height, maybe even lower. see link below for pics.
Did not drive it fast, but was not expecting this much of a difference.

Gear changes were way smoother as well. How come my gear changes don't feel as smooth?
Engine felt much stronger and smoother.

wow, I have nothing else to compare with except my own car, but wow, it was great.

this is the car btw, no affiliation
https://www.legendaryclassics.com/en...condition-1990

so I was sold on the b6 and eibach, but am now wondering what (according to your own feeling) the main differences are between the eibach and h&r green spring caracteristics (pros cons).

thanks for your input.

ZG862

Check your engine mounts. Worn ones cause the back of the engine to droop which does nothing for the alignment of the linkage.

964C2Touring

engine mounts were recently replaced with prekom rs version with the softer rubber.

Goughary

Kind of impossible to tell what would be the difference between the two cars. Every 964 seems to feel a little different one to the other when driving around town.

What i can say is the gear shift thing- has nothing to do with the springs.

On your car, if you want better shifting, make sure your engine mounts are new, and preferably a little stiffer than oem, Wevo, RS and the like, tend to hold the engine in place and therefore, alignment, a little better.
Make sure the front mount is "new enough", again for alignment sake. Then go through all the shift bushings and renew those.
Once all that has been done, you should be using the correct fluid. I prefer redline 75/90ns for the moment, until i find something better.
....and thennnnnnn, if you still have notchy shifting, there are things that can be done prior to a rebuild, but do the basics first.

(I didn't mention clutch and pedal stuff, cuz we will assume that is a problem for another day!)

As to the struts and springs. Iirc the hr springs are linear and the eibach are rising rate. Even if I'm wrong about the hr, i know the eibach will feel totally different- i had eibach and b6 combo on my car. I've also has the green and b6 combo. Generally i like the hr green and b6 more. But the eibach are more comfortable. But the rising rate springs when you are driving hard, are a little mismatched farther up to the limits. Maybe they overwhelm the rebound at higher rates or something- i have no idea, but my memory tells me i felt more secure and confident w the greens and b6 combo.
That said. I prefer pss10 to that combo and further prefer struts that are a big step up from all of those, which can be had for a few k more. And while a few k can be a lot of money, a few k for the transformation to a totally different and much better car, in the end, is not much money.

Sooooooo
If you are buying today and want to go on the lower side in terms of cost. B6 w green. If you want to step slightly over those, bilstein pss10, and if you want to go over those I'd have suggested ohlin, but those are now discontinued, so maybe a motion control setup would be in your future!

Governor

I have everything soaking in pb blaster. So didn't get far today. Wheels off, Hub nuts cracked with my favorite tool- 1:3 torque multiplier...cracks hub nuts like they are quarter drive...

964C2Touring

Any input on alignment for a 91 c2 with 22mm sway front and 20mm back (m030 chassis)?

Car is (finally) currently at the shop for:
bilstein + hr red
Front control arms sport rubber
top mounts oem front + rear
Spring plates oem
Rs tie rods complete
Ball joints

am hoping for rs+10mm with rs alignment but shop has concerns about suspension travel.

Any input much appreciated.

Thanks.

Goughary

Assuming you have stock tire sizes of 225/45/17 and 255/40/17 front to rear (yes i known 205 is stock...but not really)
And assuming you haven't spaced them out so far as to create fitment issues....

Rs+10 and the rest as RS spec is fine. You won't have travel issues.

What you might find, relative to your tires, temperatures, road types etc, that on the street, on street tires, that you don't have enough grip to warrant the RS alignment, and you may find you have too much negative camber, particularly in the front.

For street use, i keep camber down to a small roar, -0.5 degrees front. -1 or just under that in the rear. Reason being, relative to my setup, this is well balanced for me in terms of understeer. I have big sway bars and on coos street tires, the car barely leans, so my setup is where i find max grip. I prefer the stock rs toe settings for street...but truely if i wanted to "drive" all the time, i actually prefer a little tow out. But i don't pay attention anymore enough to warrant those things...so i like it a little easier. My car is very well behaved.

Bottom line...yea you can do rs specs. But if you find the front camber a little pitchy or tram-line-ish...dial that back. You'll have to drive the car hard to really get a sense for what gives better grip. Dead stock alignment is fine for all-around, but i find i need to either add grip to the front or take away from the rear, in general, to get the car balanced out. And the stock alignment and car setup leaves me with way too much understeer. On both c2 and c4

will1831

@964C2Touring
I would say that you should be able to trust your shop. Especially if you told them your concerns and what target you want. It's quite an overhaul with all the replacement parts you mentioned. The feeling will change and they should get the best alignment out of your setup. Even with mods or the m030.
Where did you drop the car?