KaiB

I can tell you that, after long conversations with our own Peter Krause ("ProCoach" on RL) I ended up with Traqmate (without the fancy dash) - which links and syncs to my Smartycam setup.

At this point, I've not had the desire to link up the four available analog inputs (for throttle position, brake pressure, etc) as the data available to me in the simple velocity v time or velocity v position still provide me with much to work on.

Having the camera was HUGE for me. The first time I viewed myself, I caught several things which I was easily able to alter - and noted in several of the big fast, scary corners - that the car was doing NO work whatsoever. That alone gave me confidence to go faster in these spots - backed up by data.

The entire system cost me less that two pro coach days and has paid off in spades.

tahoelife

Thanks Kai I think I may pursue a traqmate then. How do you feel about trying to compare data with cars that are not quite the same? IE the former cdi and current CDI for our region both have traqmate data for the tracks we run however one car is a very well setup 996 and the other is a extremely well setup cayman s both cars at one point were in the same "class" as mine is now but they both have more power but are heavier than mine? Is the corner entry,mid corner and exit speed worth trying to emulate? (they both hold the current track records for my car class)

KaiB

Always and everytime! (edit: This allows you to virtually sit in their cars without barfing!!!)

Let's not get into the bowels of data interpretation here, as this thread should remain true to its nature, but...

Using the plots and tables avail on TQM allows you to easily compare so many parameters that differences become obvious - where did you lift, who is braking a bit deeper, throttling out earlier, asking for more Gs both lat and long and who carries a different line (yes, that can be seen also).

The basic unit need not be expensive, and even a simple camera (edit-show the driver and with sound) makes a huge difference - it need not be synced with the TQM. Speak with Peter and say hi.

tahoelife

Hello Kai hope your season is going great. We just had our second DE/TT CR of the year and it went well for me and my car it was only my second time at this track and sadly we only run it once a year so big time in between (6.5 hr drive for me to get there) with that said I endend up taking a 3rd OA and setting a new TR for my class. Here is 4 laps not my absouloute fastes but they are all within 7 tenths in traffic and I over drove when I started to chase our CDI. I would like feed back on how I can improve reducing the mid corner power on understeer I am inducing. I tried to trail brake more in the second to last lap and have a small tank slapper. it is only really bad in the two slowest corners where I am trying to get back on the power sooner.

KaiB

Heath, congratulations.

I'm seeing pretty good driving, smooth in general and will have to watch the video carefully before we PM some details.

My first impressions suggest that you hit the nail on the head with your own words "...the mid-corner power on understeer THAT I AM INDUCING..." Perhaps it's the jiggly video, but I'm seeing a few (several) instances of overly aggressive turn-in, a bit of early apexing and then reluctance to unwind as the power comes in.

Because we've turned in a bit early and come onto the throttle, our track out will be limited. Same thing will be true if we nail the apex, but get giddy turning in as the car won't settle and the front end can't do its thing.

I think you're getting good and can get a lot faster. I also KNOW that as we begin getting serious about racing and TT that we tend to begin to "boss" the car around (i.e. slip backwards in our training) in an effort to go faster (now that we're in competetion, we HAVE to go faster, unlike a DE, huh?) When we boss the car around, we tend to.....get aggressive with the steering, turn in too early and hang on too hard.

I have video of my first two races - at my home track which illustrate exactly this. In some cases it's brutally obvious, in others - much like your video, it's more subtle - but subtle is the first thing to go when we get a bit excited behind the wheel.

First impressions, anyway...whe I get a chance, perhaps we can go over this corner by corner and see how close I am to correct.

Cheers, good job. Records are fun - huh?

race911

I don't think this conversation can go much of anywhere without acknowledging what a mess the surface of Buttonwillow has become. Last time I bothered to go there was 2005, where I broke an axle on the Radical from not dodging potholes on line in the hard braking zones.............

What I can say is that you're probably running on pace that I was with the RSA ~10 years ago when the surface was only 8 years old, and passably usable. (Compare SCCA SFR, and how they've maintained Thunderhill, versus SCCA Cal Club and their substandard maintenance.)

Ultimately, what am I saying here? That you'd likely have to work with a chassis expert to get a proper shock package to run what's basically an off road course. I'll absolutely wager your same approach to same speed corners at Sears/Laguna/Thunderhill (hell, even a new track like Chuckwalla) will show your car and driving shine.

tahoelife

Thanks Kai I agree with your first impressions as I know I was a bit im patient in some spots trying to "hurry around" .... I am trying to figure out how to get the video to be more stable. the track we were on is very bumpy surface. The mount I used on my roll bar is solid I am going to look for one that has some rubber dampening? If you feel so inclined I could send you my TM data files as well?? I am new to it as only two posts ago you recommended it

tahoelife

Ken I agree that the surface there is crazy bumpy and I did make major adjustments to my suspension to find a compromise I destroyed a set of front tires trying to brake into "star mazda / turn 11) and finally had to just brake early then float down in to it. I will be at Thunderhill in July :0 but not sure my car is going to like the heat. Side note I did turn a 2:07.1 as a personal best but sadly my card was full on the gopro but I did get the traqmate data.

KaiB

Send the TM data for the session videoed above to me....that would be fun.

kai at bugtussleok dotttttt netttttt

We'll figure out what to do to go faster the way you're setup right now...which seems fine. Later we can set the car up looser: More work, more skill, a bit more "busy" in the cockpit, but mo' faster.

boxsey911

Nice video and fun to watch. Some nice examples where you are using all the grip available and right on the edge. The corner where you turn in at 3.42 in the video is a great example of this. I think I learned something there.....keep it smooth to keep it under control.

tahoelife

Yes smooth is faster and the prime example of not as smooth is the same corner at 5:50 where i rushed then created to much slide creating a "save" in stead of just carrying slip angle

race911

You guys should have seen what V1.0 version of that turn was when they first opened the track--brake to a stop and (basically) pivot the car around a cone.

m3vs911

I reckoned if I hold the throttle before going out the corner the car is more stable.
what do you mean by once the car turn-in ? after the apex point?

KaiB

Typically (until we get to VERY advanced techniques), we want the car to be "loaded" at all times. You're correct, the car is more stable under throttle "before going out of the corner".

For basic condtions and for most drivers what we're saying here follows this path:

Approach corner, head and eyes out, brake while car is still straight to obtain proper turn-in speed.

Softly end braking phase, allow car to settle, turn in to apex and immediately roll onto throttle to help "set" the car (this is called maintenance throttle).

Once the cars attitude is established and once we know the apex can be realized, we roll further into the throttle so that as we cross the apex and begin to unwind the steering, we can be on full throttle at or just after the apex.

It really is all about weight transfer - and the throttle does this for us.

Jaye Bass

I just bought a 964 last week. 92 C2 Coupe...first 911, first Porsche. I've been driving modified Miata's for the last 5 years or so. I still have one to sell to make room for the 964.

That comment really resonated with me in terms of trusting the car. Focusing primarily on getting traction from the outside rear tire has given me a bit more confidence. The reason why - besides it making sense given the architecture of the car - is that most of my racing experience is in two stroke sprint karts (RMax). That advice just clicked cause that is exactly the mind set when setting up and driving a kart. In fact, if you do it just right you can lift the inside front wheel giving one a little extra clearance over the curbing. I don't race karts anymore but that tip sure made sense.

I think subconsciously I've been expecting the traction to be felt as coming from the front tires and that was really messing with my mind. That mental picture was not squaring with the experience I had while driving it the first couple of days. Now the Porsche makes a little more sense.