Breather Venting, weight reduction and other ramblings.
03-11-2009, 07:41 AM
#31
Drifting
No, all cars don't have the small bottle for intensive wash (as the cup, RS use instead of the stock bottle). It was an extra option, but stock on certain markets. My car didn't have it but I installed one and deleted the big one. The bottle, cap and bracket is still avalible from Porsche and the parts are cheap. You need to weld the bracket though. then I re-routed the cables so I can use the lever on the steering hub as normal.
Last edited by ThomasC2; 02-22-2010 at 03:03 AM.
03-11-2009, 06:33 PM
#32
demon - IMHO you are doing things the right way, because you are doing them YOUR way. I look forward to hearing (and seeing!) more of your car as it evolves. 
My car is coming back this weekend, so I should be able to post some pics next week, and I can give you details on the rear lid/wing.
Jeff - I'm not using anything in place of the bumper beams or supports. I too am concerned about protection for the engine, but I'm playing the odds that since my car only sees 5K miles, or so, a year, no rush hour madness and moderate DE use, I won't have to experience the "down side". My goals for weight reduction have overruled my caution. Time will tell if I've made an 'error in judgement'.
Now for the good news, you can't remove the pass. side air bag unit from behind/beneath the dash.
Those funny fasteners you mention happen to be the nuts for the bolts that hold the unit in place, which are accessed from the FRONT of the dash. I was able to loosen the panel in front of the airbag, and pry GENTLY up on it to get a small box-end wrench up behind the dash face to loosen the bolts.
All I can say is, make sure you're in a frame of mind to be patient...
Regards,
Dave
My car is coming back this weekend, so I should be able to post some pics next week, and I can give you details on the rear lid/wing.
Jeff - I'm not using anything in place of the bumper beams or supports. I too am concerned about protection for the engine, but I'm playing the odds that since my car only sees 5K miles, or so, a year, no rush hour madness and moderate DE use, I won't have to experience the "down side". My goals for weight reduction have overruled my caution. Time will tell if I've made an 'error in judgement'.
Now for the good news, you can't remove the pass. side air bag unit from behind/beneath the dash.
Those funny fasteners you mention happen to be the nuts for the bolts that hold the unit in place, which are accessed from the FRONT of the dash. I was able to loosen the panel in front of the airbag, and pry GENTLY up on it to get a small box-end wrench up behind the dash face to loosen the bolts.All I can say is, make sure you're in a frame of mind to be patient...
Regards,
Dave
03-16-2009, 08:25 AM
#33
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Hi gents,
read this thread with interest as i really want to shift some weight out of my C4. I love the car but it does feel heavy for a sports car and weight loss is definitely the way to go to improve that sporty lightness feel and power to weight ratio.
I have been straining my brain for ages about whether to sell my C4 and hunt out a C2 before embarking on a lot of mods but really cant decide if i would really tell the difference between the two without driving it utter b*lls-out on the limit. I have even considered buying an older 911 for the lighter weight but like the 964's mix of classic looks and some modern features.
I do intend to do trackdays but still need to keep it semi sensible for the road trips/touring/missus.
The obvious first route of stripping weight seems to be to lose the rear seats and maybe replace the heavy carpets with some lightweight RS ones, door panels etc.
Maybe also that lower dash.
I wouldnt mind losing all the A/c as it never works anyway and not a lot of use for it in England !
Is there a table/list of weights about anywhere to see the merits/worthyness of removing certain elements from the car?
How much weight do you need to lose from the car to make it noticeable ?
I have already dumped the secondary muffler by installing the g-cup bypass. The old part weighed a blinking ton ! So i guess replacing the CAT would be another good weight saver ?
read this thread with interest as i really want to shift some weight out of my C4. I love the car but it does feel heavy for a sports car and weight loss is definitely the way to go to improve that sporty lightness feel and power to weight ratio.
I have been straining my brain for ages about whether to sell my C4 and hunt out a C2 before embarking on a lot of mods but really cant decide if i would really tell the difference between the two without driving it utter b*lls-out on the limit. I have even considered buying an older 911 for the lighter weight but like the 964's mix of classic looks and some modern features.
I do intend to do trackdays but still need to keep it semi sensible for the road trips/touring/missus.
The obvious first route of stripping weight seems to be to lose the rear seats and maybe replace the heavy carpets with some lightweight RS ones, door panels etc.
Maybe also that lower dash.
I wouldnt mind losing all the A/c as it never works anyway and not a lot of use for it in England !
Is there a table/list of weights about anywhere to see the merits/worthyness of removing certain elements from the car?
How much weight do you need to lose from the car to make it noticeable ?
I have already dumped the secondary muffler by installing the g-cup bypass. The old part weighed a blinking ton ! So i guess replacing the CAT would be another good weight saver ?
03-16-2009, 08:49 AM
#34
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Mark
Theres a post on here somewhere that lists how much certain parts weigh.
I've taken away from my C4 soundproofing, cat, primary silencer, aircon, rear seats, sunroof, bumper bars, big washer bottle, non needed plumbing and wiring stripped out, rear wiper and seat belts.
Aded rs door cards, harnesses and guide bar, cup owing eye, strut brace and cobra seats. Carpet replaced with a lightweight set.
No idea what it weighs but it does feel a lot more agile on track.
Theres a post on here somewhere that lists how much certain parts weigh.
I've taken away from my C4 soundproofing, cat, primary silencer, aircon, rear seats, sunroof, bumper bars, big washer bottle, non needed plumbing and wiring stripped out, rear wiper and seat belts.
Aded rs door cards, harnesses and guide bar, cup owing eye, strut brace and cobra seats. Carpet replaced with a lightweight set.
No idea what it weighs but it does feel a lot more agile on track.
03-16-2009, 09:24 AM
#35
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thanks Rob. If anyone knows where that list is, can they link to it please?
How easy is it to remove the soundproofing? Is there a recommended sequence of weight removal? Any handy 'how to do' posts & pics anywhere?
What about the rear undertray? Is it wise to leave it on or take it off and save the weight?
How easy is it to remove the soundproofing? Is there a recommended sequence of weight removal? Any handy 'how to do' posts & pics anywhere?
What about the rear undertray? Is it wise to leave it on or take it off and save the weight?
03-16-2009, 10:28 AM
#36
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To be honest, soundproofing was easy enough to do, just time consuming and a few knuckle scrapes. Strip seats out, take out old carpet (which was held down by 17 year old glue) take out sound proofing and try and remove as much as the adhesive holding that on. I initailly wanted a stripped interior but geting down to bare metal was a pita hence the new carpet set. Ground out all the brackets not needed such as seat belt, rear wiper, shelf mounts. Trimmed back the wiring for everything not being used and stuff that comes as part of the generic loom.
I did use a lightweight padding around the centre console and rear self to level out the bumps (camping rolls) then install new carpet from appbiz, which was fairly easy when thomas sent me his guide to.
Rear undertray - never had one so don't miss it.
Link to the weight table post
https://rennlist.com/forums/964-foru...ision+bar+door
So from that, given that the car is factory supplied without sunroof and aircon, I've removed about 230 lb from the car.
I did use a lightweight padding around the centre console and rear self to level out the bumps (camping rolls) then install new carpet from appbiz, which was fairly easy when thomas sent me his guide to.
Rear undertray - never had one so don't miss it.
Link to the weight table post
https://rennlist.com/forums/964-foru...ision+bar+door
So from that, given that the car is factory supplied without sunroof and aircon, I've removed about 230 lb from the car.
Last edited by 964rh; 03-16-2009 at 10:37 AM. Reason: Adding link
03-16-2009, 10:33 AM
#37
Nordschleife Master
Mark, your aims sound a bit like my own. I'm not as hardcore as Rob or Matt when it comes to track prepping and wanted to keep mine 'road friendly'. So my own weight loss has consisted of:
Remove rear back rests
No undertray
Cup pipe in place of primary silencer
Replaced heavy soundproofing in all foot wells with foam (camping bed roll stuff)
Recaro pole positions in place of the standard electric seats
Removed brake dust shields (they were rotten anyway)
I then put a little weight back by adding a carbon fibre strut brace and a harness guide bar (with 4 point harnesses).
Even these small changes lead to a discernable feel in the seat of my pants in the agility and acceleration of the car.
Remove rear back rests
No undertray
Cup pipe in place of primary silencer
Replaced heavy soundproofing in all foot wells with foam (camping bed roll stuff)
Recaro pole positions in place of the standard electric seats
Removed brake dust shields (they were rotten anyway)
I then put a little weight back by adding a carbon fibre strut brace and a harness guide bar (with 4 point harnesses).
Even these small changes lead to a discernable feel in the seat of my pants in the agility and acceleration of the car.
03-16-2009, 07:41 PM
#38
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Thanks again Rob and Boxsey. Thats a good weight saving Rob from just stripping the interior down.
wow that weight list is a real eye opener and confirms my feelings. 69Ilbs worth of carpet and soundproofing !
I like the idea of stripping out all that s/proofing, i hate modern sports cars extra unnecessary baggage when it comes to 'refinement' (rolls-eyes). I have read several times now that the glue is a real pita to get off, is it possible to get work like re-carpetting done in the UK somewhere?..ie leave them the car to clean up with their specialist industrials disolvents and re-carpet in RS lightweights ?
Boxsey, did you leave the rear seat bottom halves in place then? Is the floor too ugly with them gone as well?
Those Recaros sound interesting. I know the standard electric seats are pretty heavy so was wondering what the best options were for replacement seats. Something along the styling lines of those fitted in the RS seem to be the way to go? Again, i want the weight reduced but cannot go too hardcore as the car will still be used for touring. What are my options on the seats ?
Glad to see ive already shaved off 36Ilbs without trying too hard by just removing the 2nd muffler and tray
wow that weight list is a real eye opener and confirms my feelings. 69Ilbs worth of carpet and soundproofing !
I like the idea of stripping out all that s/proofing, i hate modern sports cars extra unnecessary baggage when it comes to 'refinement' (rolls-eyes). I have read several times now that the glue is a real pita to get off, is it possible to get work like re-carpetting done in the UK somewhere?..ie leave them the car to clean up with their specialist industrials disolvents and re-carpet in RS lightweights ?
Boxsey, did you leave the rear seat bottom halves in place then? Is the floor too ugly with them gone as well?
Those Recaros sound interesting. I know the standard electric seats are pretty heavy so was wondering what the best options were for replacement seats. Something along the styling lines of those fitted in the RS seem to be the way to go? Again, i want the weight reduced but cannot go too hardcore as the car will still be used for touring. What are my options on the seats ?
Glad to see ive already shaved off 36Ilbs without trying too hard by just removing the 2nd muffler and tray
Last edited by Mark J; 03-16-2009 at 07:58 PM.
03-16-2009, 08:21 PM
#39
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honestly, if you want seats comfortable for touring... you need to spend the money.
Sounds strange, but i spent about three hours at demon tweeks sitting in seats reading magazines making sure they are comfortable.
either that or go for sports recliners.
Sounds strange, but i spent about three hours at demon tweeks sitting in seats reading magazines making sure they are comfortable.
either that or go for sports recliners.
03-16-2009, 08:23 PM
#40
Nordschleife Master
Boxsey, did you leave the rear seat bottom halves in place then? Is the floor too ugly with them gone as well?
Those Recaros sound interesting. I know the standard electric seats are pretty heavy so was wondering what the best options were for replacement seats. Something along the styling lines of those fitted in the RS seem to be the way to go? Again, i want the weight reduced but cannot go too hardcore as the car will still be used for touring. What are my options on the seats ?
The Recaro PPs have proved to be good on long journeys and make a world of difference on the track. As you've mentioned these seats are the same as the RS without the provenance or the price tag
03-17-2009, 04:51 AM
#42
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The recaros do look the nuts...nearly spat my tea out when i saw the cost of them though ! Do they need subframes or sidemounts etc ? And do they have any adjustment for getting stuff in and out of the back of the car or height adjustment?
Just replacing the two front seats saves something like 21kg in weight too Though at the price its a costly £ v Kg equation.
Really fancy a set of them with the harnesses after seeing your interiors. Those and a nice RS alacantra steering wheel.
Ive got a black leather interior too so it should all look rather tasty. I just need to rob a bank before i head down to Le Mans this year!
One other hefty piece of weight in the car that no one seems to be mentioning is the battery ! Is there a racing battery lightweight alternative? Or are they deemed not powerful enough for cars to be used in everyday environments ?
Just replacing the two front seats saves something like 21kg in weight too
Though at the price its a costly £ v Kg equation.Really fancy a set of them with the harnesses after seeing your interiors. Those and a nice RS alacantra steering wheel.
Ive got a black leather interior too so it should all look rather tasty. I just need to rob a bank before i head down to Le Mans this year!
One other hefty piece of weight in the car that no one seems to be mentioning is the battery ! Is there a racing battery lightweight alternative? Or are they deemed not powerful enough for cars to be used in everyday environments ?
Last edited by Mark J; 03-17-2009 at 05:07 AM.
03-17-2009, 05:44 AM
#43
Nordschleife Master
The recaros do look the nuts...nearly spat my tea out when i saw the cost of them though ! Do they need subframes or sidemounts etc ? And do they have any adjustment for getting stuff in and out of the back of the car or height adjustment?
Just replacing the two front seats saves something like 21kg in weight too Though at the price its a costly £ v Kg equation.
Just replacing the two front seats saves something like 21kg in weight too
Though at the price its a costly £ v Kg equation.. Matt's are bolted directly to the floor.There are 3 bolt holes in the front of the mounts to set the rake of the seat when you install them. My two seats including mounts and sliders came to about £1300.
03-17-2009, 06:10 AM
#44
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I went for Cobra imolas (cause I'm a tight git) paid £535 for two seats, mounts and one subframe (passenger side is hard mounted to the floor) but this was a while ago.
If I was buying again, I'd have got the wider passenger seat as the imolas are quite tight. Had an instructor sat on top of the seats once as they were to tight for his ****.
Pics here.
https://rennlist.com/forums/964-foru...stripdown.html
Stripping out the soundproofing is a pita but satisfying when you get it done. I heard of a adhesive remover would would've made the job a lot easier (too late), mate of mine used on removing the sound pad from his RS's engine bay. I think Soutbound is the place in the UK to get a RS carpet set from, I brought mine in from the states (Appbiz) sent him my old RHD set and got a cracking deal ($265). Not as good quality as the SB stuff but light!!
You can get a lightweight battery as used in the RS's, less ampage I think (35ah)?
If I was buying again, I'd have got the wider passenger seat as the imolas are quite tight. Had an instructor sat on top of the seats once as they were to tight for his ****.
Pics here.
https://rennlist.com/forums/964-foru...stripdown.html
Stripping out the soundproofing is a pita but satisfying when you get it done. I heard of a adhesive remover would would've made the job a lot easier (too late), mate of mine used on removing the sound pad from his RS's engine bay. I think Soutbound is the place in the UK to get a RS carpet set from, I brought mine in from the states (Appbiz) sent him my old RHD set and got a cracking deal ($265). Not as good quality as the SB stuff but light!!
You can get a lightweight battery as used in the RS's, less ampage I think (35ah)?
03-17-2009, 07:55 AM
#45
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Nice job on that interior rob, looks great. I am unfortunately pretty cack at DIY, not to mention short of patience when it comes to jobs like that.. and would therefore probably have to pay a coach fitter to do the work.
Thanks for the links.
As for the battery, the stock one is listed as 46Ilbs which seems to weigh as much as the whole aircon system !! So could be worth investigating the RS lightweight option.
Thanks for the links.
As for the battery, the stock one is listed as 46Ilbs which seems to weigh as much as the whole aircon system !! So could be worth investigating the RS lightweight option.