StanAE86

I finished installing and hardwiring a V1 to the car. I had the hardest time trying to find a stealthy place to mount it. I ultimately ended up chopping into the third brake light. After giving it a lot of thought, I decided that I wanted to keep it so that the brake light still worked. I ended up with a semi-stealth install.

The brake light was cut open to allow the V1 to slip in. The reflector was notched to allow the rear radar sensor to "see" through. I lot rear laser though, because the laser sensor is right behind the bulb. The mount is made of plastic which was heated and shaped. It's stuck on with double stick tape. V1 is in place with velcro since it sees double duty and goes between the Porsche and my daily driver S4 (suction cup mounted) and my wife's MDX (visor mounted), when we go on trips.

Overall, you don't really see it unless you're looking for it, which is what I wanted.

First pic is through the rear window. Since the 911 is low, you're slightly crouched down. (Car is usually cleaner, but was sitting out while I worked on the hardwiring.

Second pic is through the rear side window, looking upwards.

Third pic is through the driver's side window.

Fourth pic is the remote display.

wsybert

Very stealthy! Nice install.

TR6

I'll be curious to know if the extreme angle of the back window glass diminishes the effectiveness on laser detection from the rear. Don't know, just wondering...

Carrera GT

Looks like tidy work, but you might want to check to be sure that location works. I'd do a distance/sensitivity test with a friend with another V1. Just find a radar speed sign and compare.

When I had an RSA, my first modification was to remove that damn brake light, it obscures too much rearward visibility.

StanAE86

TR6: Rear laser is nill. The rear laser sensor sits right behind the lightbulb for the brake light, and I wanted to keep the brakelight working, so I didn't cut that part away. So the rear laser sensor is covered. Given the way laser works, I figured that if I really wanted a laser countermeasure, I'd have to get a front and rear jammer.

Carrera GT: I'm heading up to Thunderhill this Friday, so I'm going to try to borrow my friend's V1 and front windshield mount it to see if I notice a significant drop in sensitivity with front hits. We usually get about 4-5 CHP hits on the way up. So, that will be a perfect test.

I had thougth about that too, but when I took the third brakelight off, it turns out the glass is frosted black, all around the edges. Then the rear window has a "hole" where the brakelight is. Did you do anything with that?

Thanks.

Carrera GT

Keep in mind that the V1 does pass the RDD test, so it has a radar "signature" and will tend to interfere with other detectors. You'd literally have to A/B switch the two units so only one is on at a time. In short, the test would be prone to bogus bogies. : )

Right, it leaves a noticeable surround on the glass, but the rear glass on the 964 is pretty bad anyway. I was happier being able to see behind me with brake light out of the way. I was tempted to get some thin glass but never did get around to it. That's such a large pane of glass, I imagine it would save some rear-biased pounds. There's DOT thin glass now -- maybe there's a replacement available for the 964.

As for laser, I've had very few definitely legitimate laser detections but I have seen a cop pointing a lidar gun towards me, but didn't get a reading. I'm expecting we'll need a lot better laser countermeasures as the revenue potential of a motorcycle cop and a lidar gun comes into play.

StanAE86

Shucks. Thanks for the heads up. Sounds like running a front and rear for comparison won't work. Maybe I'll have to wait until I go up with somone else, and run behind them and compare on a two-way radio. I definately am concerned with lower sensitivity, but have seen several stealth installs at the rear, where the owner indicated that he was still getting good coverage. I would think the radar would enter the car as normal.

The thing with the 911 is the sloping roof. Mounted high on the front windshield, the rear sensor is obscured by the low rear roofline. Ideally, the thing would be mounted right under the rearview mirror, but it doesn't get more obvious that that. Plus, California doesn't allow objects mounted to the windshield except for Fastrak (bridge toll thingy), which was carved out with a specific exemption in the statutes.

BTW, I have an RSA too. What do you drive now?

andrew911

Slightly off topic- Just curoius, why do you mount the S4 with suction and the MDX with visor? If anything, isn't the MDX a higher car?

Thanks-
Andrew

Carrera GT

Some cars work well with a visor mount (eg. Prius, Range Rover) while other cars, the visor is either behind a metallic "stripe" across the top of the windshield or doesn't come down enough to line up front and rear.

Carrera GT

I had a white '94 (it looks like yours is a 94 too, based on the tear-drop mirrors) and I enjoyed it from '96 to '99. Various upgrades either induced terminal understeer at low speeds (Quaiffe diff) or helped it carry much higher cornering speeds (springs, dampers, sways) but I never had the finances to really get it fully sorted out, so I spent most of the time just adding lightness as they say. It didn't have a sunroof, but it did have a/c.

I just found a perfect '04 GT3 (in the same white with black cabin and red seat-belts with no sunroof, just A/C) and that complements the 993 Turbo perfectly. Best of both worlds ... wet and air.

I think I've seen your car -- not all black RSA's look alike.

As for testing the units. I think the idea of carrying a second unit on the windshield makes sense, it's just that the test could return false negative results, especially if the forward sensitivity of the rear-mounted unit seemed to be below the front unit or if the rear-sensitivity of the front unit seemed below the rear unit. If they both acquire sources at the same time, you could assume the "noise" or "leak" from each unit isn't enough to matter, if the two units don't behave identically, you'd have to at least suspect some interference. I'd suggest you run the test with the second unit and just see what happens.

Just as a matter of interest, after a few close calls on 505 when towing the RS on an open trailer, I decided to run a phone line from the unit on the windshield of the Turbo (facing backwards on the open trailer to improve weight balance) to the cabin of the tow vehicle (which was a supercharged Tahoe with its own V1) so I had better rearward coverage and could compare the front/rear sensitivity. Sure enough, the rearward detection was nowhere as good as the forward detection -- in other words, the tow vehicle would pick up sources from the front long before the Turbo on the trailer reported a "behind" arrow. And the Turbo would pick up a signal (including falsing) from behind (its "front" arrow) long before the tow vehicle would light up the rear arrow. If all that makes sense ...

Anyway, I have an enclosed trailer and recently updated to a diesel Excursion, so I have a "to do" to fit and wire a V1 to the back of the trailer along with a back-up camera. So many to-do's, so little track time ... : )

StanAE86

Hey Andrew: They say the higher up it's mounted the better. The V1 sees the least amount of duty in the MDX. I put it in there when I'm driving on a long trip in it. Otherwise, the wife uses it as her daily. In the S4, I'd like to do a stealth install, but since it's the daily, ease of removal was more important, hence the suction mount, which is actually illegal in California. Up at the very top of the windshield, it's not quite as obvious from the rear, but looking a the car from the front, it's not entirely "stealth".

I wanted it hidden in the 911 because I have a feeling that driving the 911 already gets me less chance of a warning...let alone if the cop sees the V1 sitting out. Also, since it's much more of a "high profile" car than the S4, I wanted to keep it away from prying eyes when I do drive it and park it some place.

Carrera GT: I think all RSAs came with the teardrops. Mine is a 1993 car. #164. No rear seats. It does have a radio, a/c and a sunroof. I could have done without the radio (like you can hear it anyway) and sunroof, but it was a nice car that I fell in love with when I saw it. I would have liked the LSD for the track, but they're expensive if you have to do them now.

If I can borrow a V1, I'll try to run it anyway then. We'll see what happens. Thanks for the input.

Carrera GT

You're right -- '93 was the year for the mirrors, '94 was the year for the RSA to get rear seats instead of the delete box.

I read somewhere Mike Valentine has a 993 and mounts his detector under the rear-view mirror in plain view and doesn't put much stead in how the police might react to seeing a detector.

The CA suction mount thing is bizarre -- I see cars with suction cup mounted note pads, GPS navigation, etc. Crazy. And how is something clipped to the visor less of a dangerous projectile than something sucked onto the windshield? As long as it's out of the line of sight of the driver, where's the danger?

StanAE86

My guess is that the legislation was designed and aimed at radar detectors...but I can't say for sure. Here is the whole thing, with the exemptions. Go figure...politics:

California Vehicle Code Section 26078:

26708. (a) (1) No person shall drive any motor vehicle with any
object or material placed, displayed, installed, affixed, or applied
upon the windshield or side or rear windows.
(2) No person shall drive any motor vehicle with any object or
material placed, displayed, installed, affixed, or applied in or upon
the vehicle which obstructs or reduces the driver's clear view
through the windshield or side windows.
(3) This subdivision applies to a person driving a motor vehicle
with the driver's clear vision through the windshield, or side or
rear windows, obstructed by snow or ice.
(b) This section does not apply to any of the following:
(1) Rearview mirrors.
(2) Adjustable nontransparent sunvisors which are mounted forward
of the side windows and are not attached to the glass.
(3) Signs, stickers, or other materials which are displayed in a
7-inch square in the lower corner of the windshield farthest removed
from the driver, signs, stickers, or other materials which are
displayed in a 7-inch square in the lower corner of the rear window
farthest removed from the driver, or signs, stickers, or other
materials which are displayed in a 5-inch square in the lower corner
of the windshield nearest the driver.
(4) Side windows which are to the rear of the driver.
(5) Direction, destination, or termini signs upon a passenger
common carrier motor vehicle or a schoolbus, if those signs do not
interfere with the driver's clear view of approaching traffic.
(6) Rear window wiper motor.
(7) Rear trunk lid handle or hinges.
(8) The rear window or windows, when the motor vehicle is equipped
with outside mirrors on both the left- and right-hand sides of the
vehicle that are so located as to reflect to the driver a view of the
highway through each mirror for a distance of at least 200 feet to
the rear of the vehicle.
(9) A clear, transparent lens affixed to the side window opposite
the driver on a vehicle greater than 80 inches in width and which
occupies an area not exceeding 50 square inches of the lowest corner
toward the rear of that window and which provides the driver with a
wide-angle view through the lens.
(10) Sun screening devices meeting the requirements of Section
26708.2 installed on the side windows on either side of the vehicle's
front seat, if the driver or a passenger in the front seat has in
his or her possession a letter or other document signed by a licensed
physician and surgeon certifying that the person must be shaded from
the sun due to a medical condition, or has in his or her possession
a letter or other document signed by a licensed optometrist
certifying that the person must be shaded from the sun due to a
visual condition. The devices authorized by this paragraph shall not
be used during darkness.
(11) An electronic communication device affixed to the center
uppermost portion of the interior of a windshield within an area that
is not greater than 5 inches square, if the device provides either
of the following:
(A) The capability for enforcement facilities of the Department of
the California Highway Patrol to communicate with a vehicle equipped
with the device.
(B) The capability for electronic toll and traffic management on
public or private roads or facilities.
(c) Notwithstanding subdivision (a), transparent material may be
installed, affixed, or applied to the topmost portion of the
windshield if the following conditions apply:
(1) The bottom edge of the material is at least 29 inches above
the undepressed driver's seat when measured from a point 5 inches in
front of the bottom of the backrest with the driver's seat in its
rearmost and lowermost position with the vehicle on a level surface.
(2) The material is not red or amber in color.
(3) There is no opaque lettering on the material and any other
lettering does not affect primary colors or distort vision through
the windshield.
(4) The material does not reflect sunlight or headlight glare into
the eyes of occupants of oncoming or following vehicles to any
greater extent than the windshield without the material.
(d) Notwithstanding subdivision (a), clear, colorless, and
transparent material may be installed, affixed, or applied to the
front side windows, located to the immediate left and right of the
front seat if the following conditions are met:
(1) The material has a minimum visible light transmittance of 88
percent.
(2) The window glazing with the material applied meets all
requirements of Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard No. 205 (49
C.F.R. 571.205), including the specified minimum light transmittance
of 70 percent and the abrasion resistance of AS-14 glazing, as
specified in that federal standard.
(3) The material is designed and manufactured to enhance the
ability of the existing window glass to block the sun's harmful
ultraviolet A rays.
(4) The driver has in his or her possession, or within the
vehicle, a certificate signed by the installing company certifying
that the windows with the material installed meet the requirements of
this subdivision and identifies the installing company and the
material's manufacturer by full name and street address, or, if the
material was installed by the vehicle owner, a certificate signed by
the material's manufacturer certifying that the windows with the
material installed according to manufacturer's instructions meets the
requirements of this subdivision and identifies the material's
manufacturer by full name and street address.
(5) If the material described in this subdivision tears or
bubbles, or is otherwise worn to prohibit clear vision, it shall be
removed or replaced.

Carrera GT

Big brother:

"
A) The capability for enforcement facilities of the Department of
the California Highway Patrol to communicate with a vehicle equipped
with the device.
"

But this particular code seems to apply (pun) mostly to window tint but makes a broad reference to anything with just the exception of a Fastrak transponder. Just pathetic.

porshah

Nice install. Did you tap off the brake light wires to power the V1? Or somewhere else? Any pictures of how/where you ran the wires to the remote display?