bhensarl

Jeff, what do you mean by "new rear clip"? Is that a part? I know, I'm ignorant.
I'll shoot an email over to the guys and gals in Jacksonville and see what they have to say. I'll definitely have a shop check out the frame. I'm sure they'll be able to see things much better when they pull off the destroyed bumper. Two more "looking on the bright side" notes: The driver's side bumper extension had a small abrasion at the bottom that was too deep to buff out (not related to the accident, it was thanks to a run in with a garbage can one morning, roommate put it out and I didn't look behind me). A new extension will get rid of that. Also, I'm thinking about going with a dual exhaust bumper. Or a euro style rear bumper. Or both. I don't know yet. Also, maybe I'll go for an RSA tail after all. I know it's heavier, but I'm not sure that I really care. Maybe one day when I start seeing a lot of track time I'll worry about the extra weight. Right now I'm just feeling like a kid in a candy store with so many options! Maybe I'm looking a little too much on the bright side...
Brian

Richard Curtis

Brian: (1) We're all glad you're okay; Porsche makes cars every day. Drivers are more difficult to replace. (2) If Progressive starts giving you grief about getting your car repaired, talk to an attorney. That's what I'd do. This isn't some 15-year-old Toyota the guy ran into and I suspect you've got a lot of records detailing how much the car cost you, how well it's been cared for, etc. That will stand up in small-claims court. While the insurance company undoubtedly has its own attorneys, they will hate to hear from another one on your side, especially if all you're asking for is the car to be put back like it was. I'd ask for all new body panels (both rear fenders and all the associated metal between them, new engine cover, etc. And like the other guys have suggested, yes, get it to a certified Porsche bodyshop and on a frame jig. And don't accept the car is there's much bondo on it (take a magnet with you when they say it's ready... if the magnet won't stick to any part of the car, don't accept it). Make sure they know upfront that you're very serious about getting the car repaired properly. Might help to see a doctor also; sometimes injuries don't show up for a while. (No, I'm not an attorney.) FWIW, I have all my "collectible" cars insured for full replacement value; surprisingly, it doesn't cost all that much more. Hope this helps and good luck.

Richard Curtis

One other thing: get at least 3 repair estimates but show only the highest-priced one to the insurance company. You can get it repaired wherever you like. And demand that the rental car is yours until your car is repaired. It's part of an insurance company's cost of business anyhow.

bhensarl

Thanks for the tips, Richard. I am deadly serious about getting this car repaired right, and put back the way it was. I was talking with a lady from USAA and she told me that Florida law doesn't have a "reduced value" clause, or something to that effect, meaning that they have to put the car back to its original value. Now, I have no experience with the ins and outs of car insurance policies, but I think that sounded like a good thing. She told me that they would attempt to find new parts, if they were available. Once again, a good thing, because if they can't find them I can just call Sunset or some other dealership and get the parts from them. Anyway, I'm just throwing things out here because I'm new at this and I want to make sure I'm hitting all my wickets. Thanks for all your help.
Brian

JasonAndreas

First they play stupid, then they'll tell you that the car is worth just as much as it was before the accident and then they'll ask for proof. You are going to have to get a detailed appraisal showing why you will no longer be able to sell your car for what you could before the accident. No matter how well the car is repaired you are out several thousand dollars on resale. That is property taken out of your pocket and dissolved into thin air. The situation can be different because of your policy if you are expecting your own insurance company to cover diminished value. But there is absolutely NO question when you are not the cause of the accident. This is a loss of value of property.


This means they plan to find parts at a wrecking yard. Not good. You will have absolutely no idea if a used part comes from a flood damaged car. Don't settle for used parts, demand brand-new original Porsche parts. "It is illegal in Florida for an insurance company to require the use of aftermarket crash parts in the repair of an automobile unless the parts are at least equal in kind and quality to the original parts in terms of fit, quality and performance". Lots of OEM Porsche parts are not up to the same quality as the original "bought at the dealer" parts. There is always some little tiny thing that you don't notice until two years later when the part rusts or leaks, etc.


Insurance companies are the almost the lowest of the low! Don't expect them for one second to act to your benefit. Don't roll-over and don't be a push-over. The less you know the more money they make and the worse off your car will be. You need to educate yourself quickly. Start at I-CAN and work from there.

Jeff Curtis

FIRST and foremost, find out if they will in fact, pay to FIX the car.

THEN get all paranoid and crazy about proving everything.

Take 10 deep breaths and let things attempt to fall in place first.

When I had my, uh, er...incident...I was crazed with ideas of what would happen. It was simple, they insurance adjuster came out, said I needed a new quarter panel welded on, a new door, new front fender and front bumper cover - then asked what body shop would be repairing it.

It's 30+ hours per quarter panel, you got AT LEAST 60hrs of work there!! What I mean by a new rear clip is that if you look on PET, there's all kinds of sections of the body you can get ahold of, from the front suspension pan and fron panel to just a fender or door. Both of your quarter panels are beyond repair (IMHO) and will require replacing...I would imagine your doors don't open/close too well either?? ...sounds like B-pillar "tweakage" to me, if so.

That rear panel and engine support is an integral part of your car and is the major support for both your drivetrain and rear suspension.

It's possible we're talking rear clip replacement here...although that's pricey as hell. It's VERY possible that they will total the car, just my opinion - after all, I'm looking at pics on a monitor with HORRIBLE resolution (at work), posted on the web...I'm no "body pro" nor can I be right there to give my direct opinion from what I see.

Relax, see what the insurance company says, if they want to pay to fix it, get the details on WHAT that entails...REPLACEMENT, pull it out or TOTAL.

While I think it's very possible it's a total, if they go for replacing the rear clip items, or at least the quarter panels (just talking the major components here) and pulling out the rear support, etc. - then we're on the right track to getting that particular vehicle straight again.

OF COURSE they'll pay for time on the frame machine!! DUH.

Check with local frame machine shops, don't go for the "Grabber" system, go for a shop that has the jigs and a "table" setup...any frame shop would know what I mean by that. Some frame shops will have to weld tabs onto your chassis in order to secure it in certain spots, a few have the factory jigs...I can find out which place it is, I recall Southern Florida...a local who totalled a C2 Turbo sent his car down there to get well again, but it cost a pretty penny.

Do your homework, but avoid getting wound up and paranoid, until there's reason - I believe, for the most part, that they're not "out to get you".

bhensarl

Update:
I called the local POC and they suggested a certain body shop here in town. When I had first talked to the insurance adjustor he had given me a number of body shops here that they work with, and told me that if I went with any of those shops all the work was guaranteed for the life of the car. The shop the dealership pointed me to was one of the shops on Progressive's list. One step in the right direction. Since the car is undrivable I can't take it around to get estimates on it, and I've released it to the body shop that the dealer/Progressive recommended. Once they get the bumpers off and take some of it apart I'll get an estimate. I'm going to head over to the shop today to check it out and get some face time with the guys that work there so they'll know that I'm serious about getting this fixed correctly. I'm optimistic that this will be a good shop since the dealer recommended it. I'm sure that to get it fixed correctly will take some time and effort on my part, but it's worth it.
Brian

splattergasted

Be sure to bring the camera and give us updates!

Almost had the same thing happen on Saturday! I stopped at a light and about two seconds later, some guy in an SUV slammed on the brakes, skidded; but, luckily veered into the adjacent lane. I guess he was memorized by the spoiler going down or the curvaceous rear end (the car that is).

It’s pretty nerve-wracking when you can see what's going on in the rear-view mirror; but, powerless to do anything (cars were stopped in front of me).

bhensarl

So I went by my chosen bodyshop and I feel a bit better. It seems to be a well run shop, and I talked to Travis, one of the managers. He accomodated all my questions, which included asking about where he would try to source parts (his answer was the local Porsche dealership!). I also asked him about putting the car on the jig to make sure it was straight. He told me that it would be, and that once they were finished the car would get a four wheel alignment, so that's encouraging. They're taking it over to the bodyshop on a flat bed today, and I'm going to stop back by there tomorrow to see how it's going. Thanks for all the info, everyone.
Brian

John Boggiano

Your car is soon going to be looking great again, Brian.

Arjan B.

If you want this repair the good way, then you have to replace the rear fenders..... Repair the hurt ones is possible, but I wouldn't do that. Drill the orignal weldings and replace the rear fenders is the best way to keep the car in original condition.

It's your choice [and of course the insurance company]........

bhensarl

Update 20OCT:
The bodyshop received my car today and they said it's on the "priority" list to be taken apart tomorrow. The adjustor took a look at it today without it being taken apart and made a few observations: 1. Placed the value of the car at 20k to 21k, which I agreed with. 2. Said the damage that he could see looked like about 8k to 9k. I was also told that the car wouldn't be totalled unless the damage came to 80%, so I seem to be under that so far. I also learned from the manager at the body shop that the guy's policy will only cover the first 10k of damage, and it's looking to exceed that. I called my insurance company and they said that since it's a no-fault accident on my end they would collect what they could from Progressive and pay the rest of the repairs on my behalf. They also recognized and sang the praises of this bodyshop, so I'm hopeful that this really is a good shop. I am going back tomorrow to see what things look like, and I'm going to get a list of parts from them before they start ordering from the dealer in Mobile to see if I might be able to get them myself and save some money. Also, it sounds like they're going to completely disassemble the back end, including looking at the engine bits, though not disassembling the engine I'd assume, to make sure nothing there got smashed. I'll know tomorrow.
Brian

springer3

Brian:

The body shop will make your car look better than new, and it sounds like you found a really good one. Just be sure to take a lot of pictures, and keep the receipts. A well-documented repair harms resale value very little. I stay away from cars that have undocumented collision repairs, because many body shops repair only the cosmetics, and neglect the corrosion and structural issues that are more important in the long run.

Wachuko

So far all I have read relates to body damage... what about mechanical damage? Will you get the Porsche shop to look for any mechanical damages from this accident or are you positive there are none?

Carrera51

Brian:
You have USAA. Let them handle it and recoup from the other guys insurance. They'll get their money.

I have USAA as well. A few years ago my old 944 was hit and the other driver had Allstate. The Allstate adjuster low-balled the estimate and gave me the run around. I politely told him I would be calling USAA and letting them handle the claim and therefore his services were no longer needed. His tone changed real quick, but I still let USAA handle it. The car was repaired correctly and to quote the USAA adjuster I talked to, she said, "oh don't you worry, we will get our money."