Turbo Advice- BorgWarner & Garrett
02-16-2012, 03:27 PM
#121
Burning Brakes
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Don't get me wrong I want you to get there and beyond but as you know as well going from the 120's to the 130's isn not like going from the 110's to 120, you start hitting the brickwalls a lot sooner .
I agree on the real life on the road statement, from a roll even a stock 951S is very quick, with mods you can take down some big dogs or much better drag cars similar to the Audi B5S4, another underrated when modded highway monster.
The Germans know how to build a powerband, no surprise becuase over there the Autobahn is the D**k measurement not the strip.
I agree on the real life on the road statement, from a roll even a stock 951S is very quick, with mods you can take down some big dogs or much better drag cars similar to the Audi B5S4, another underrated when modded highway monster.
The Germans know how to build a powerband, no surprise becuase over there the Autobahn is the D**k measurement not the strip.
02-16-2012, 05:17 PM
#122
Rennlist Member
So excluding fitting issues, what turbos do you guys seeing as being ideal for various applications?
1) 2.5 street
2) 2.5 street/track/drag
3) 2.5 race
4) 3L street
5) 3L street/track/drag
6) 3L race
1) 2.5 street
2) 2.5 street/track/drag
3) 2.5 race
4) 3L street
5) 3L street/track/drag
6) 3L race
02-16-2012, 05:53 PM
#123
Race Car
I'd like to see some others opinions on this. I will throw my .02 out after seeing some others thoughts. I'd also like to see why on each level.
02-16-2012, 08:19 PM
#124
Rennlist Member
1) 2.5 Street - TO4E DBB .50 trim garrett turbo with a replica KKK#8 turbine housing. This turbo is almost a direct bolt on, easily can delivers 350 rwhp, and can spool up the same as a k26/6. IMHO this is a pretty ideal 2.5L street turbo 
02-16-2012, 08:28 PM
#125
. Refresh I am in live with your car's setup and pretty much plan to do the same thing. But will definitely see what the others have to say. It seems most of the discussion is around big power... I'm happy with 300rwhp but nice quick spool. If you made 350 at 18psi on E85 then I have to imagine your setup on 93 octane and 14psi should be pretty close to 300.... Perfect. Fast enough to be fun but not blowing the tires off at 50mph either
02-16-2012, 08:51 PM
#126
I am watching this thread closely . Refresh I am in live with your car's setup and pretty much plan to do the same thing. But will definitely see what the others have to say. It seems most of the discussion is around big power... I'm happy with 300rwhp but nice quick spool. If you made 350 at 18psi on E85 then I have to imagine your setup on 93 octane and 14psi should be pretty close to 300.... Perfect. Fast enough to be fun but not blowing the tires off at 50mph either
. Refresh I am in live with your car's setup and pretty much plan to do the same thing. But will definitely see what the others have to say. It seems most of the discussion is around big power... I'm happy with 300rwhp but nice quick spool. If you made 350 at 18psi on E85 then I have to imagine your setup on 93 octane and 14psi should be pretty close to 300.... Perfect. Fast enough to be fun but not blowing the tires off at 50mph either Is the consensus we can't get a faster spooling turbo that is bolt on? I'm guessing that is due to the type of turbos we run stock?
02-16-2012, 09:12 PM
#127
Rennlist Member
Remember guys, the hp number is just that, a number. It's the curve that is important for each application.
02-16-2012, 09:52 PM
#128
Race Car
For the bolt on, I'd say that the 50 trim dbb is about as good as it gets. I am working on a bolt on Holset that I can't say much about, but it should be not only quick spooling, but also durable and rebuild able.
For absolute best spool and power, a gt2871 would be my choice. Even better would be the GTX 2871 with twin entry and use a qsv. I could see full 15 psi at 2000 rpm. This turbo is supposed to maintain to 450hp due to the billet wheel and turbine wheel. From what I've seen with the Audi's it can spool instantly and holds tq even w/o the qsv on a 2.0 none the less.
For absolute best spool and power, a gt2871 would be my choice. Even better would be the GTX 2871 with twin entry and use a qsv. I could see full 15 psi at 2000 rpm. This turbo is supposed to maintain to 450hp due to the billet wheel and turbine wheel. From what I've seen with the Audi's it can spool instantly and holds tq even w/o the qsv on a 2.0 none the less.
02-17-2012, 05:41 PM
#129
The humble feedback I can give for a 3.0 8V is a GT30R/KKK hybrid with a modified compressor trim and a modified genuine KKK #10 hotside.
How "modified" I couldn't tell exactly but it performs the way I specced it to SPS (UK) - quick spool, excellent fat and wide midrange torque, and still here up top. Peak torque seems to be around 4200rpm.
Can get 19psi at 2700rpm if I want but it makes the engine work harder for no apparent performance gain, so I prefer to let it spool with a flat boost ramp until where the engine can actually make the boost into power.
Stock intake/cam/headers.
For a street turbo I see no objective reason for willing to try anything else, it just feels at one with how I set up the engine. I have often found myself trying to grab a virtual 6th gear when accelerating flat out in 5th.
How "modified" I couldn't tell exactly but it performs the way I specced it to SPS (UK) - quick spool, excellent fat and wide midrange torque, and still here up top. Peak torque seems to be around 4200rpm.
Can get 19psi at 2700rpm if I want but it makes the engine work harder for no apparent performance gain, so I prefer to let it spool with a flat boost ramp until where the engine can actually make the boost into power.
Stock intake/cam/headers.
For a street turbo I see no objective reason for willing to try anything else, it just feels at one with how I set up the engine. I have often found myself trying to grab a virtual 6th gear when accelerating flat out in 5th.
Last edited by Thom; 02-17-2012 at 08:31 PM.
02-17-2012, 06:07 PM
#130
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02-17-2012, 06:39 PM
#131
Burning Brakes
The humble feedback I can give for a 3.0 8V is a GT30R/KKK hybrid with a modified compressor trim and a modified genuine KKK #10 hotside.
How "modified" I couldn't tell exactly but it performs the way I specced it to SPS (UK) - quick spool, excellent fat and wide midrange, and still here up top. Peak torque seems to be around 4200rpm.
Can get 19psi at 2700rpm if I want but it makes the engine work harder for no apparent performance gain, so I prefer to let it spool with a flat boost ramp until it where the engine can actually make the boost into power.
Stock intake/cam/headers.
For a street turbo I see no objective reason for willing to try anything else, it just feels at one with how I set up the engine. I have often found myself trying to grab a virtual 6th gear when accelerating flat out in 5th.
How "modified" I couldn't tell exactly but it performs the way I specced it to SPS (UK) - quick spool, excellent fat and wide midrange, and still here up top. Peak torque seems to be around 4200rpm.
Can get 19psi at 2700rpm if I want but it makes the engine work harder for no apparent performance gain, so I prefer to let it spool with a flat boost ramp until it where the engine can actually make the boost into power.
Stock intake/cam/headers.
For a street turbo I see no objective reason for willing to try anything else, it just feels at one with how I set up the engine. I have often found myself trying to grab a virtual 6th gear when accelerating flat out in 5th.
02-17-2012, 08:35 PM
#132
Well yes Nick, I did supply Simon with a #8 KKK hotside and when I got the turbo from him and compared its hotside with a turbonetics #10 housing (from Vitesse Stage 3) and a standard K26/8 it did look different from both.
This year I intend to measure backpressure in the crosspipe to see how it compares with what others have reported with standard KKK housings or replicas, but from how the turbo spools I feel it should return better results.
You know it already, but I like to repeat it really does perform very well indeed from what I can tell.
This year I intend to measure backpressure in the crosspipe to see how it compares with what others have reported with standard KKK housings or replicas, but from how the turbo spools I feel it should return better results.
You know it already, but I like to repeat it really does perform very well indeed from what I can tell.
02-19-2012, 10:09 AM
#133
Burning Brakes
Well yes Nick, I did supply Simon with a #8 KKK hotside and when I got the turbo from him and compared its hotside with a turbonetics #10 housing (from Vitesse Stage 3) and a standard K26/8 it did look different from both.
This year I intend to measure backpressure in the crosspipe to see how it compares with what others have reported with standard KKK housings or replicas, but from how the turbo spools I feel it should return better results.
You know it already, but I like to repeat it really does perform very well indeed from what I can tell.
This year I intend to measure backpressure in the crosspipe to see how it compares with what others have reported with standard KKK housings or replicas, but from how the turbo spools I feel it should return better results.
You know it already, but I like to repeat it really does perform very well indeed from what I can tell.
02-19-2012, 07:54 PM
#135
It's Refresh's curve that I love the most. Solid power all the way to redline. When the 26/6 gives out - the 50-trim just keeps on going!
For the few DE's I do each year, having that extra fatness in the power band would be SWEET! Made the mistake of taking a ride around a local track in a buddy's 944 Turbo Cup - where I'm short shifting to 4th at 5500 cuz I'm out of steam, he runs his all the way up to 7,000 - and it makes power there. Love that... want that.