Anyone ever bought a new wastegate from Porsche?
02-16-2010, 07:36 AM
#31
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Brian, are these plates manufactured? Will they bolt on to the stock piping? I really like the New MVS. Smaller and lighter.
02-16-2010, 10:38 AM
#32
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I ran a stock wastegate at around 20 psig for many years on the street/track.
When I rebuilt the engine, the only reason I changed the wastegate was to humor my son who insisted I get an electronic boost controller and I installed a LR dual-port.
The Greddy boost controller was a piece of *-/** junk and I went back to an MBC and, knowing what I know now, i could have used a stock wastegate again. It's just a 2-way valve in a hot corrosive atmosphere and materials and construction on current wastegates are very similar to the OEM unit, no matter what the advertising says.
When I rebuilt the engine, the only reason I changed the wastegate was to humor my son who insisted I get an electronic boost controller and I installed a LR dual-port.
The Greddy boost controller was a piece of *-/** junk and I went back to an MBC and, knowing what I know now, i could have used a stock wastegate again. It's just a 2-way valve in a hot corrosive atmosphere and materials and construction on current wastegates are very similar to the OEM unit, no matter what the advertising says.
02-16-2010, 11:02 AM
#33
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I ran a stock wastegate at around 20 psig for many years on the street/track.
When I rebuilt the engine, the only reason I changed the wastegate was to humor my son who insisted I get an electronic boost controller and I installed a LR dual-port.
The Greddy boost controller was a piece of *-/** junk and I went back to an MBC and, knowing what I know now, i could have used a stock wastegate again. It's just a 2-way valve in a hot corrosive atmosphere and materials and construction on current wastegates are very similar to the OEM unit, no matter what the advertising says.
When I rebuilt the engine, the only reason I changed the wastegate was to humor my son who insisted I get an electronic boost controller and I installed a LR dual-port.
The Greddy boost controller was a piece of *-/** junk and I went back to an MBC and, knowing what I know now, i could have used a stock wastegate again. It's just a 2-way valve in a hot corrosive atmosphere and materials and construction on current wastegates are very similar to the OEM unit, no matter what the advertising says.
I have to wonder what you'd do knowing what you do now.
When I swapped from oem to the DP LR unit I immediately noticed a complete change in how the car spooled up. I had a friend get in who didn't know I even did anything and he said it felt immensely better.
02-16-2010, 07:01 PM
#35
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The hate on for the stock wastegate just gets repeated from mouth to mouth and then it gets taken as gospel.
The truth is there's nothing wrong with the stock wastegate. The reason people don't like it is because it has a soft spring and therefore could open a tad prematurely and increase spoolup time and/or cause boost drop off at higher RPM.
It has nothing to do with any kind of Porsche old school engineering, or outdated technology. They did this on purpose to work with the CV and the KLR. So, you might not agree with this design concept, and that's fine; I'm not even saying I disagree, but that doesn't mean it's a piece of junk.
A side benefit to the stock wastegate is Porsche's way of keeping the relationship between the intake manifold pressure and cross-over back pressure in check. High back pressure in the cross-over will immediately manifest itself in the way of reduced boost. An aftermarket wastegate might make the reading on the boost gauge look great but could be hiding a turbo inefficiency problem.
To the original poster; I bought a brand spanking new oem wastegate.
But not from Porsche; a retired 951 racer was cleaning out his garage, advertised in Panorama. I snapped it up for 400 bucks.
I have it now for 7 or 8 years and second car. With my home made boost control it works flawlessly and holds any amount of boost to my rev limit.
All this being said, most oem wastegates are getting a bit long in the tooth. So, if we have to replace, sure, let's go the Tial route. That doesn't mean they do the job any better.
Wastegates don't make power; engines and turbos do.
The whole herd of sheep may flame away.
The truth is there's nothing wrong with the stock wastegate. The reason people don't like it is because it has a soft spring and therefore could open a tad prematurely and increase spoolup time and/or cause boost drop off at higher RPM.
It has nothing to do with any kind of Porsche old school engineering, or outdated technology. They did this on purpose to work with the CV and the KLR. So, you might not agree with this design concept, and that's fine; I'm not even saying I disagree, but that doesn't mean it's a piece of junk.
A side benefit to the stock wastegate is Porsche's way of keeping the relationship between the intake manifold pressure and cross-over back pressure in check. High back pressure in the cross-over will immediately manifest itself in the way of reduced boost. An aftermarket wastegate might make the reading on the boost gauge look great but could be hiding a turbo inefficiency problem.
To the original poster; I bought a brand spanking new oem wastegate.
But not from Porsche; a retired 951 racer was cleaning out his garage, advertised in Panorama. I snapped it up for 400 bucks.
I have it now for 7 or 8 years and second car. With my home made boost control it works flawlessly and holds any amount of boost to my rev limit.
All this being said, most oem wastegates are getting a bit long in the tooth. So, if we have to replace, sure, let's go the Tial route. That doesn't mean they do the job any better.
Wastegates don't make power; engines and turbos do.
The whole herd of sheep may flame away.
02-16-2010, 07:51 PM
#37
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The hate on for the stock wastegate just gets repeated from mouth to mouth and then it gets taken as gospel.
The truth is there's nothing wrong with the stock wastegate. The reason people don't like it is because it has a soft spring and therefore could open a tad prematurely and increase spoolup time and/or cause boost drop off at higher RPM.
It has nothing to do with any kind of Porsche old school engineering, or outdated technology. They did this on purpose to work with the CV and the KLR. So, you might not agree with this design concept, and that's fine; I'm not even saying I disagree, but that doesn't mean it's a piece of junk.
A side benefit to the stock wastegate is Porsche's way of keeping the relationship between the intake manifold pressure and cross-over back pressure in check. High back pressure in the cross-over will immediately manifest itself in the way of reduced boost. An aftermarket wastegate might make the reading on the boost gauge look great but could be hiding a turbo inefficiency problem.
To the original poster; I bought a brand spanking new oem wastegate.
But not from Porsche; a retired 951 racer was cleaning out his garage, advertised in Panorama. I snapped it up for 400 bucks.
I have it now for 7 or 8 years and second car. With my home made boost control it works flawlessly and holds any amount of boost to my rev limit.
All this being said, most oem wastegates are getting a bit long in the tooth. So, if we have to replace, sure, let's go the Tial route. That doesn't mean they do the job any better.
Wastegates don't make power; engines and turbos do.
The whole herd of sheep may flame away.
The truth is there's nothing wrong with the stock wastegate. The reason people don't like it is because it has a soft spring and therefore could open a tad prematurely and increase spoolup time and/or cause boost drop off at higher RPM.
It has nothing to do with any kind of Porsche old school engineering, or outdated technology. They did this on purpose to work with the CV and the KLR. So, you might not agree with this design concept, and that's fine; I'm not even saying I disagree, but that doesn't mean it's a piece of junk.
A side benefit to the stock wastegate is Porsche's way of keeping the relationship between the intake manifold pressure and cross-over back pressure in check. High back pressure in the cross-over will immediately manifest itself in the way of reduced boost. An aftermarket wastegate might make the reading on the boost gauge look great but could be hiding a turbo inefficiency problem.
To the original poster; I bought a brand spanking new oem wastegate.
But not from Porsche; a retired 951 racer was cleaning out his garage, advertised in Panorama. I snapped it up for 400 bucks.
I have it now for 7 or 8 years and second car. With my home made boost control it works flawlessly and holds any amount of boost to my rev limit.
All this being said, most oem wastegates are getting a bit long in the tooth. So, if we have to replace, sure, let's go the Tial route. That doesn't mean they do the job any better.
Wastegates don't make power; engines and turbos do.
The whole herd of sheep may flame away.
I guess that people who have it "all figured out" must be a part of a select few smart people in the world, while everyone else is just so lost...
The newer wastegates definitely do the job better. I'm sure you think carbs are still better than fuel injection, also. I don't even know why people are moving to direct injection, I mean heck the old system worked just fine!
02-16-2010, 08:06 PM
#38
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I have thought about buying a new one. About 6 years ago a shop installed a Lindsey Club Gate for me because they said my stock one was defective. A few years later it crapped out on me . . stuck open, maybe 3 years of moderate use. To repair my car I installed the OEM WG off a wrecked '89 951 (sitting in garage, off my father's car). Car is still going strong on this now 22 year old part. Maybe one of these days I will call Lindsey and see if they can do something with their broken Club Gate I have.
02-17-2010, 12:52 AM
#41
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Someone disagreeing with you doesn't make them a sheep....
I guess that people who have it "all figured out" must be a part of a select few smart people in the world, while everyone else is just so lost...
The newer wastegates definitely do the job better. I'm sure you think carbs are still better than fuel injection, also. I don't even know why people are moving to direct injection, I mean heck the old system worked just fine!
I guess that people who have it "all figured out" must be a part of a select few smart people in the world, while everyone else is just so lost...
The newer wastegates definitely do the job better. I'm sure you think carbs are still better than fuel injection, also. I don't even know why people are moving to direct injection, I mean heck the old system worked just fine!
Relax, man;
seems like you feel you're being addressed: talking about carbs and direct injection; changing the subject to throw up a smokescreen; silly
At least come up with an intelligent rebuttal.
Anyway, I never said that a newer wastegate wouldn't be a viable option (heck, when the time comes, I'll probably get one myself).
It's just that the general consensus seems to be: if you want more power get the Tial.
Well, I know someone who was given that advice when he was complaining about low/dropping boost. He swapped out a perfectly fine oem unit only to find out after that he was actually dealing with exhaust obstruction (his boost did go up, though, after the wastegate swap)
This is just an example of how operators could possibly use an aftermarket gate as a bandaide solution for a possible inefficient turbo system.
By the way, 951 RS;
a properly working OEM wastegate starts to open at 4psi (not 1 psi). With shims, as much as 6psi. If your gate is opening at 1 psi, it's either broken or you have a serious back pressure problem.
02-17-2010, 01:38 AM
#42
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Another not so well known option is JGS Precision Turbo wastegates.
I'll be using their 40mm model that bolts up using the same adapters as a Tial 38mm
They've got 40mm, 50mm, and 60mm models with v-band options also.
They are really popular with mustang and nissan guys.
JGS vs OEM:
I'll be using their 40mm model that bolts up using the same adapters as a Tial 38mm
They've got 40mm, 50mm, and 60mm models with v-band options also.
They are really popular with mustang and nissan guys.
JGS vs OEM:
02-17-2010, 01:56 AM
#43
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Relax, man;
seems like you feel you're being addressed: talking about carbs and direct injection; changing the subject to throw up a smokescreen; silly
At least come up with an intelligent rebuttal.
Anyway, I never said that a newer wastegate wouldn't be a viable option (heck, when the time comes, I'll probably get one myself).
It's just that the general consensus seems to be: if you want more power get the Tial.
Well, I know someone who was given that advice when he was complaining about low/dropping boost. He swapped out a perfectly fine oem unit only to find out after that he was actually dealing with exhaust obstruction (his boost did go up, though, after the wastegate swap)
This is just an example of how operators could possibly use an aftermarket gate as a bandaide solution for a possible inefficient turbo system.
By the way, 951 RS;
a properly working OEM wastegate starts to open at 4psi (not 1 psi). With shims, as much as 6psi. If your gate is opening at 1 psi, it's either broken or you have a serious back pressure problem.
seems like you feel you're being addressed: talking about carbs and direct injection; changing the subject to throw up a smokescreen; silly
At least come up with an intelligent rebuttal.
Anyway, I never said that a newer wastegate wouldn't be a viable option (heck, when the time comes, I'll probably get one myself).
It's just that the general consensus seems to be: if you want more power get the Tial.
Well, I know someone who was given that advice when he was complaining about low/dropping boost. He swapped out a perfectly fine oem unit only to find out after that he was actually dealing with exhaust obstruction (his boost did go up, though, after the wastegate swap)
This is just an example of how operators could possibly use an aftermarket gate as a bandaide solution for a possible inefficient turbo system.
By the way, 951 RS;
a properly working OEM wastegate starts to open at 4psi (not 1 psi). With shims, as much as 6psi. If your gate is opening at 1 psi, it's either broken or you have a serious back pressure problem.
02-17-2010, 04:50 AM
#44
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okay ladies, let's dial it down a notch.
1. There is no reason to spend 1300 ANYTHING on ANY wastegate.
2. The OEM wastegates are old and show it.
3. By comparison to a 23 year old WG, they all seem to be great.
4. On an unmolested 951, a "proven good" stock WG is great for the assigned application (though not for 1300.00!)but with any modification, the recipe is bound to be skewed.
1. There is no reason to spend 1300 ANYTHING on ANY wastegate.
2. The OEM wastegates are old and show it.
3. By comparison to a 23 year old WG, they all seem to be great.
4. On an unmolested 951, a "proven good" stock WG is great for the assigned application (though not for 1300.00!)but with any modification, the recipe is bound to be skewed.
02-17-2010, 05:12 AM
#45
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20+ year old oem wastegates do bleed boost it's not a myth but a known fact. After 20+ years the spring is tired that's why many shim their oem wastegate to make them work as their supposed to, whoever don't understand this concept is either retarded or Canadian whichever comes first.