tifosiman

Good article.

I like both cars a lot. They are both so good that really all it takes is personal preference to tip the scales in one direction or another.

I let my Excellence subscription lapse about 2 years back, and this article makes me want to renew again.

SeanR

Oh yes, I need someone to impress me with a 951 and you are the only one in the DFW area to stand up. That and you have a huge sig. lol

SeanR

And my hope is you can verify that all 928 guys are not old, fat, ex doctors. lol

Melchior

Quote: "Sure, the larger car (928) prefers fast sweepers to tight hairpins, and yes, getting the best from it requires attention, but it’s very satisfying to get a corner just right and then rocket out on a burst of torque. In direct contrast, the undeniably more nimble and well-balanced 944 can, at times, feel a bit too accomplished for its own good."

One question: What does too accomplished mean?

It's like watching a Notre Dame football game and hearing the ND-biased commentators describe ND's slow running backs as "Patient runners"...that actually happened.

Note to Porsche engineers: Turn down the accomplishment

333pg333

Darwantae951

Nah, you guys are cool. I'm DEFINITELY outnumbered here in DFW (928/951 is probably 5/1)

P.S. LEAVE MY SIG ALONE! I'm workin' on a new one.

333pg333

You know all of our experience is driven by our senses. One of them being aural. I bet that if you had a decent exhaust on the 951 it wouldn't sound so puny or 'accomplished' against the rich burble of the V8? Just an idea.

alxdgr8

I don't see how people can say the 928 looks better than a 951...I can't stand them, they are UGLY! I think it's the headlights as I don't really care for them on a 968 either.

Fogey1

"Performance" is a broad category. What work's best on the Dragon might not be ideal from Houston to Seattle. Not to mention from San Luis Obispo to San Francisco, where being able to put the top down adds 100% plus to the drive and can outweigh many other factors. There the 951 and 928 both lose to a, for instance, Convertible D. Or a (!!! heresy alert !!!) Caddy or Vette.

I.M.O.

Acetylene

Blasphemer

stout

996 Turbo was a good example of "too accomplished." It was fun, fast, and a stunning achievement, but you were often left with the feeling that it was the CAR doing the work, rather than you. Still, a DAMN good road car. 997 Turbo might have been "too accomplished," too, and in some ways, it is. But it's so far off the deep end towards comfort that it got pitchy, rolly, and divey. And the steering lacks feel. And the lag is terrible, VTG or no. Still, however, it is DAMN fast. But I'd rather have a base C2 with no options or a Cayman S if I had to leave it stock.

I see what Zach is trying to get at. The challenge to engineers is hitting all of the performance parameters laid down, while leaving some "sparkle," tingle, and challenge for "most" drivers. Figuring out what "most" means, and the threshold, is no small task. Rohrl said that was never tougher than with the C-GT. I'd say they nailed it with that car, but all the crashes might suggest otherwise.

What makes a car faster at the Ring does not ALWAYS translate into a better driver's car for the road. It is my feeling that Porsche has gotten this balance right more consistently than any other manufacturer -- and that this balance, consciously or subconsciously, is at the heart of why so many love Porsches so much.

You certainly see it in other cars, though. Early and current GTIs. Some WRXs. Many BMWs. A few Mercs. Sad thing is, many of the other cars that have it "right," we don't get here...

pete

toddk911

I've owned both and loved both. The 951 is far easier and cheaper to mod than the 928 though.

I guess the best approach would be to meld both together by going 928 and add a turbo/sc kit.

M758

Pete,
I read that article and also found that "Too accomplished" statement very odd. It was like saying the 951 is a better car in every respect, but I don't care cause I like the V8 sound.

It seems that 944 Turbo S takes it on shorts due to it being too good and therefore nor interesting enough to drive.

Well something is missing in that power delivery in the 928 makes it "easy" power, but you need to work in the 951. I found it strange to consier the 928 not too easy in power delievery.

I have a 88 Turbo S in stock form. No chip, stock wheels, stock suspension wit sport seats much like the test car. My parents have bone stock 91 S4 (auto). I have driven both cars on a 700 miles trip through some of the twistiest roads in Arizona. One section has 65 miles of 4000ft climb and maybe 800 corners. Just on this trip alone I learned the differene between the 2 cars.

928 - Fast and comfortable. I was crazy easy to cover large distances with no effort. Both fast straights and sweeping corners. In the tight corner it could forced into performing very well. Not nimble by any means, but the good news was there was enough torque that even with auto a slower apex speed could be countered by torque.

951S - Fast, but frankly not as comfortable as the 928. However just as fast in the sweepers. In the tighter corners the 951 was so much more tossable. It never felt like it needed to be manhandled to turn. However it major weakness was a few dead spots in the power band. If you are not on top of it all the time you can easly find your selft at 2200 RPM with no power to get out of a corner. This make the 951 much more of thinking man's car to drive. The power band is good, but anything below 3000 rpm and the car will not move. By contrast the 928 motor would pull from any RPM making it in fact easier to drive at more relaxed pace. The 951 you needed to be on your game.

So this one reason I find the 951 being "too accomplished" vs 928 to be soo odd. Handling wise the 951 is more nimble, but to be fast you need to stay on top of the motor and in right RPM range. Other wise you can be caught out. The 928 may require more muscle to toss in a corner, but the wide power band means you can easy do it a wrong gear and still pull on the way out.


Seems to me that if you work on keeping the 951 at 4000 to 6000 rpm the involvment level will go up by leaps and bounds.

BTW... while I like my parent's 50k mile 928 I still perfer my 135k mile Turbo S because I find it so much more intersting to drive. Although I do happen to get chills when hear the v8 rumble on start up. In end howver full boost 5000 rpm in the 951 is pretty cool too.

toddk911

If it's too easy to drive than he was not pushing it hard enough.

Just means the limits of the 951 or far exceeding those of the 928.

And I can attest that with my 3" cat back and flowmaster muffler, I get almost the same rumble/burble in my 951 as my old 928.

stout

From memory (it's been a while), 928 is harder to drive closer to its limits (i.e. less buttoned-down, esp in tighter turns) than 951. Fortunately, it's still fun to do that in the 928s I've driven and not "work" the way some challenging cars are in that way.

These are hard-to-define nuances. I "got" what Zach was trying to say, but I can see how others wouldn't. Clearly, the thought could have/should have been expanded/refined. Sorry!

pete