johntorg

I am building a track car based on an 86 turbo, that I own. I am currently runing DEs in my street 951 and would like to start using the track car next season. I would like to build it so that it could be raced in Nasa or PCA events if an when my skill level improves. So far I have the following parts:

1986 951 Roller with stock suspension with Konis 119K miles
Used 1986 engine 80K miles
1 Kirkey driver's seat (new)
1 Sparco passenger seat (used)
1988 transmission w/LSD
Autopower bolt-in roll cage
assorted early offset wheels
2 simpson FIA 5pt harnesses
Front and rear 968 M30 Sway bars.
Slightly used HD clutch

I plan to buy the following:

Tow eyes front and rear
AC delete bracket
Window Net
Battery disconnect

I have $1600 in the Roller and Engine, and about $3500 in the rest of the parts and planned purchases. Frankly, this doesn't leave me with too much to spend for the suspension and brakes. I am currently using PFR pads and stock calipers for DEs and will probably use this setup to get started in the track car.

I would really like some advice on what components give the most bang for the buck in the Suspension area.

I don't mind doing a phased approach on spending for the suspension, but don't want to throw out components that I buy now, if and when I upgrade the suspension in the future. I will most likely only race the car locally so it doesn't have to be super competitive, but I don't want it to be embarrassingly slow. It will only be used for the track, so comfort on the road is not an issue.

Based on hands-on knowledge of what works in a race car, what do you recommend for a parts budget of around $2500 for the suspension? I will buy good condition used parts if they are available.

jerome951

Skip the AC delete. If you race PCA that puts you in GT class where you will get your a$$ handed to you.

Honestly, with a stock or mildly upgraded suspension you'll be at the back of the pack in PCA F class anyway. Here's my advice, for what it's worth.

Spend your money on safety equipment (good suit, HANS device, etc.) and reliability upgrades (initial maintenance, control arms, oil cooler, etc.). Racing is no fun if you're hurt or the car breaks down. Consumables (tires, pads, etc.) are expensive so budget for those.

You've already got the 968 sways, which is a good first upgrade. If you think you might want to do this more often in the future and be competitive, save your $$ for a couple years and dump it into a good suspension setup after you've learned how to race (which is different from DE'ing).

87924GT

Damn good advice Jerome. It's likely not you want to hear John, but when it comes to saftey there is no subsitute!
Steve Ed

sawood12

Sounds like sound advice to me as well. And once you've got your safety equipment sorted and have some races under your belt when it comes to performance you are probably best off looking to take weight out of the car before going for the expensive power upgrades. Weight benefits the car in more ways than just making it go faster - it will brake better and handle better. Power hikes should be the last job on your list.

333pg333

All of the above + time on the track and get some instruction or tuition. Then save as you go through the first couple of seasons as you'll have to budget for general stuff like tyres, pads, oil, fuel etc..then you'll have a much better idea of where you want to go and how to get there. Keep the car reliable and safe. There are a lot of very fast cars on the sidelines or the workshop. I'd rather be in the middle or even the back of the pack instead of watching from the stands.
Good luck and have fun.

johntorg

Thanks for the advice on getting started. I guess I should have made it clearer. I will never race a full season due to other commitments. I expect to race 4 or 5 times a year. The engine will be basically stock with a chip, MBC and larger exhaust. (whatever the class allows). Nasa is more likely than PCA. I believe the class will be 944 SuperCup. There are usually only 4 or 5 entries in that class in the South East, but since they run with NA 944s, there should always be someone to race with. The safety advice is good as is the advice on consumables. That is budgetted. I am currently running DEs with Konis and stock springs and am not that happy with the setup (I haven't installed the sway bars yet). Lots of understeer on street tires. I bought 8 Kumho V700s for $80 each from Tirerack to get me started.

The reliability issue is one that I haven't given much thought to and would be interested in opinions on what the first steps should be in that area. I will be installing new belts, water pump and rollers as well as rod bearings. I was planning on using stock A-arms and not lowering the car too much initially. Later I might use welded steel arms. Charley arms are clearly not within the budget.

I still have about $2500 that I can spend on the suspension. Where should I start? Some ideas I have are the following setups:

From Paragon


Coil-Over Kit, Koni 944 Double Adjustable Strut Set $790.00

Coil-Over Kit - Springs, Hypercoil 2.5" $120.00

Coil-Over - 2.5" Upper Spring Perch, Racers Edge $35.00

Bump Rubber $22.48

Torsion Bars - rear $266.00

Strut Brace - KLA $134.95

Camber Plates $499.00

Shocks - Koni Sport, rear $262.54

Total $2,129.94

From Ground Control and Paragon

Link http://www.ground-control-store.com/...hp/II=696/CA=7


Coilover struts, camber plates and rear shocks $1349.00

Torsion Bars - rear $266.00

Strut Brace - KLA $134.95



Total $1749.95

Beyond this I would be buying bushings. There appear to be three types (in order of cost) Weltmeister, Delrin and Racer's Edge spherical.

I assume that upgraded bushings in some area's of the suspension are more important than others any input will be greatly appreciated.

Fishey

30mm Torsions
Paragon CoilOvers 400#
M030 Swaybars
monoball front struts
Solid mount everything you can afford (Engine, Trans)

jerome951

Careful w/ the power upgrades like the MBC & chip (which I think adds 100# in Supercup; I think the MBC is illegal). Check the rule book for what is legal.

The understeer can be eliminated by a good competition alignment even w/ stock suspension. The larger torsion bars (or coil-overs) and heavier springs w/ the Paragon kit are a good decent upgrade, but don't have any allusions of running at the front (unless you are a very talented driver) w/ that setup.

Chipster

Jerome is right-on. Make sure you read the rules very carefully for the class you want to race in. I went this route myself and there is a lot of trial and error involved. Every time I race, my list of changes I need to make to the car grows. Experience is the best teacher. First make sure the car is mechanically sound, install all the best safety stuff you can afford, then start getting as much track time as you can.

TD in DC

Well, it is a little over your budget, but I have a set of brand new in the box JRZ triples that I paid over 6K for and I would sell for 4,750. Oh yeah, the price for the triples has gone up since I bought. So, PM me if you are interested.

M758

That is nice for a budget set-up. Not as fast as it could be, but still resonably fast/fun.

The 944 spec car set-up is very similar. In out class we strip the car and run with Koni's and 250-400lbs front springs and stock to 30 mm t-bars. We use rubber/plastic/delrin or bushings (no metal). Rest of the car is stock or very very close to it.

Due to the lighter weight and the small 225/50 R15 tires they are quick, easy on consumables and reliable. For a track car there lots fo things you can do it make it fun and fast. The issue is when racing some of thse thing are just not allowed or not competetive.

Fishey

I have found that you can spend $20,000 on a suspension or $2,000 but its all in the setup and adjustments. I have rode in FULL BLOWN race cars that have drive like SOAP because they have no idea how to sort the suspension out.

TD in DC

All private messages returned.

Setup is important . . .

BTW Fishey, I think you are thinking about this the right way: either replicate a "spec" suspension OR go big and do it all the first time (so that you do not end up upgrading the car multiple times over the years).

944CS

look at elephant racing also when looking for solid bushings

porschefig

Has anybody used those ground control coilovers??
http://www.ground-control-store.com/...hp/II=696/CA=7