951 Exhaust Hardware *LIST FINISHED*
#61
Artie - $0.25ea is correct for the copper 8mm locknuts with 12mm flats. I will also check the availability of 6mm locknuts just-in-case.
Go ahead and count me in for 6 of those stainless cap screws for the x-over pipe, but that's all I'll need as I already have the copper nuts and 16 Saturn studs (cleaned out my local dealer ).
Go ahead and count me in for 6 of those stainless cap screws for the x-over pipe, but that's all I'll need as I already have the copper nuts and 16 Saturn studs (cleaned out my local dealer ).
#64
Originally Posted by Crazy Eddie
Hi Guys
I just saw this thread
Just an FYI, Brian ( z3bra )He knows his ****, mentioned to me when I did all this, that I should probably stay away from SS as it had a tendency to soften over time with heat cycling.
I would stick to 8.8 or 10 hardness bolts if I were you guys. But that's MHO
I had a list as well but have been away from Rennlist for some time now
Good luck and best regards
Ed
I just saw this thread
Just an FYI, Brian ( z3bra )He knows his ****, mentioned to me when I did all this, that I should probably stay away from SS as it had a tendency to soften over time with heat cycling.
I would stick to 8.8 or 10 hardness bolts if I were you guys. But that's MHO
I had a list as well but have been away from Rennlist for some time now
Good luck and best regards
Ed
#65
Originally Posted by Crazy Eddie
Hi Guys
I just saw this thread
Just an FYI, Brian ( z3bra )He knows his ****, mentioned to me when I did all this, that I should probably stay away from SS as it had a tendency to soften over time with heat cycling.
I would stick to 8.8 or 10 hardness bolts if I were you guys. But that's MHO
I had a list as well but have been away from Rennlist for some time now
Good luck and best regards
Ed
I just saw this thread
Just an FYI, Brian ( z3bra )He knows his ****, mentioned to me when I did all this, that I should probably stay away from SS as it had a tendency to soften over time with heat cycling.
I would stick to 8.8 or 10 hardness bolts if I were you guys. But that's MHO
I had a list as well but have been away from Rennlist for some time now
Good luck and best regards
Ed
#67
Here is some quick info on fastener materials:
http://www.boltdepot.com/fastener-in...Materials.aspx
I am not a fastener expert by any stretch of the imagination. I do know that Porsche used those specific grades for a reason. I can't think of any SS fasteners in our engine bay off the top of my head. I know that the exhaust system won't need the kind of strength that suspension bolts would need, but SS is pretty weak. I would rather have zinc-plated hardened fasteners up to the specs from the factory.
http://www.boltdepot.com/fastener-in...Materials.aspx
I am not a fastener expert by any stretch of the imagination. I do know that Porsche used those specific grades for a reason. I can't think of any SS fasteners in our engine bay off the top of my head. I know that the exhaust system won't need the kind of strength that suspension bolts would need, but SS is pretty weak. I would rather have zinc-plated hardened fasteners up to the specs from the factory.
#68
Here is some info from BoltDepot.com
"Stainless Steel
Stainless steel is an alloy of low carbon steel and chromium for enhanced corrosion characteristics. Stainless steel is highly corrosion resistant for the price and because the anti-corrosive properties are inherent to the metal, it will not loose this resistance if scratched during installation or use.
It is a common misconception that stainless steel is stronger than regular steel. In fact, due to the low carbon content, stainless steel can not be hardened. Therefore when compared with regular steel it is slightly stronger than an un-hardened (grade 2) steel fastener but significantly weaker than hardened steel fasteners."
Heres a link to the Grade markings and tensile strengths, 10.9 is 50% stronger than SS if I am reading this right. http://www.boltdepot.com/fastener-in...ade-Chart.aspx
I have seen a few posts on some random hot rod forums where people complain about twisting the heads off SS header bolts after they have been heat cycled a lot. I wonder if 10.9 is a superior choice...there must be a reason Porsche didn't use stainless.....?
"Stainless Steel
Stainless steel is an alloy of low carbon steel and chromium for enhanced corrosion characteristics. Stainless steel is highly corrosion resistant for the price and because the anti-corrosive properties are inherent to the metal, it will not loose this resistance if scratched during installation or use.
It is a common misconception that stainless steel is stronger than regular steel. In fact, due to the low carbon content, stainless steel can not be hardened. Therefore when compared with regular steel it is slightly stronger than an un-hardened (grade 2) steel fastener but significantly weaker than hardened steel fasteners."
Heres a link to the Grade markings and tensile strengths, 10.9 is 50% stronger than SS if I am reading this right. http://www.boltdepot.com/fastener-in...ade-Chart.aspx
I have seen a few posts on some random hot rod forums where people complain about twisting the heads off SS header bolts after they have been heat cycled a lot. I wonder if 10.9 is a superior choice...there must be a reason Porsche didn't use stainless.....?
#71
Brian is your man
Also, Brian mentioned that you don't want to use SS on the block ( i wanted to use it where the front water neck is because the bolts there have a tendency to rust and that area is known for coolant leaking out where it joins the metal and rubber hoses there.
He said the SS can bond to the aluminum block. So I nixed the SS idea
Also, When I removed my Exhaust bolts I had used a air gun at the end and if you think that the SS will stand up think again .....
I went for 10.9 hardness on a # of pieces and also went with what is referred to as flange bolts because I wanted the larger surface area ( they were pretty pricey )
and finally I went with the standard lengths i.e. 40 mm vs 37 mm there is really no difference They will work fine
Regards
Ed
He said the SS can bond to the aluminum block. So I nixed the SS idea
Also, When I removed my Exhaust bolts I had used a air gun at the end and if you think that the SS will stand up think again .....
I went for 10.9 hardness on a # of pieces and also went with what is referred to as flange bolts because I wanted the larger surface area ( they were pretty pricey )
and finally I went with the standard lengths i.e. 40 mm vs 37 mm there is really no difference They will work fine
Regards
Ed
#72
Just for the record, I'm up for whatever metal type the group decides it's best. Too slammed right now to give myself a short course in metallurgy.....sorry
PS- "flange bolts" ARE nice!
PS- "flange bolts" ARE nice!
#74
Here is the thread with Z3bra's bolt dissertation:
https://rennlist.com/forums/944-turbo-and-turbo-s-forum/214504-fastener-grades-question.html
https://rennlist.com/forums/944-turbo-and-turbo-s-forum/214504-fastener-grades-question.html