Red Car FIRE
08-02-2016, 01:32 PM
#31
Rennlist Member
Terrible to see, but I hope it is not the end of the story, whether it is salvaged or broken for parts. It must have been hard to let us all know what happened, and I appreciate that and hope you will keep us in the loop.
08-02-2016, 01:35 PM
#32
Rennlist Member
Van, really, really sorry to see this. That was a beautiful car.
It depends... There was enough heat in the left-side wheel well to melt the aluminum fender (outside the engine bay), but the hood looks intact. The plastic engine parts, wiring and paint are going to be toasted but the engine itself may be OK.
I think not opening the hood was smart. From the first pic there was obviously a lot in the engine bay that wanted to burn, but with the hood closed there is not much ventilation-- couldn't really get going. So it might be better than you think. Only one way to find out...
I would avoid the pressure washer, the water might do more damage than good.
Jim
I think not opening the hood was smart. From the first pic there was obviously a lot in the engine bay that wanted to burn, but with the hood closed there is not much ventilation-- couldn't really get going. So it might be better than you think. Only one way to find out...
I would avoid the pressure washer, the water might do more damage than good.
Jim
08-02-2016, 02:47 PM
#36
Sorry to see this.
What is the actual ignition source for these fires? Certainly leaked fuel, oil or power steering fluid are fire hazards, but what is hot enough in the engine compartment of a 928 to ignite even gasoline fumes?
Maybe I am wrong about things not being hot enough to spontaneously ignite, but I have seen a couple of cars, not 928s, with scary fuel leaks on the engine that were disasters waiting to happen but had not burned.
A possible source of ignition, at least in the later cars, could be the open nature of the distributors on the camshafts: the rotors and electrodes are in the plenum of the timing belt which is vented by air from the engine compartment that could carry flammable fumes.
The above is just a theory, but 928s have more engine fires than seems reasonable. Does anyone know if the earlier cars with "normal" distributors have the same fire problem as the later cars, or have an explanation?
What is the actual ignition source for these fires? Certainly leaked fuel, oil or power steering fluid are fire hazards, but what is hot enough in the engine compartment of a 928 to ignite even gasoline fumes?
Maybe I am wrong about things not being hot enough to spontaneously ignite, but I have seen a couple of cars, not 928s, with scary fuel leaks on the engine that were disasters waiting to happen but had not burned.
A possible source of ignition, at least in the later cars, could be the open nature of the distributors on the camshafts: the rotors and electrodes are in the plenum of the timing belt which is vented by air from the engine compartment that could carry flammable fumes.
The above is just a theory, but 928s have more engine fires than seems reasonable. Does anyone know if the earlier cars with "normal" distributors have the same fire problem as the later cars, or have an explanation?
08-02-2016, 03:13 PM
#39
Rennlist Member
Very sad sight, I'm always nervous having my young kids in the back as I dread to think how long it would take for them to get out of the car in that kind of situation. Hope you're able to get it back on the road, it looked a lovely car.
08-02-2016, 03:19 PM
#40
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
In my opinion and loosing a lot of sleep over this last night, I think it was the new injector that I installed.
I bought 8 new or rebuilt 24# injectors that I installed. They all worked except for one. I was told that if you whack on it with a metallic object that it will make it work. I did this and it worked. I think it was still a bit stuck and when driving the car on a road test it went from 7cyl to 8 all was good, then it went back to 7. I could smell fuel and I was pulling over but not soon enough.
When you have injectors cleaned or buy rebuilt ones the water based material they use dries up after a few days. They need to be pre started before you install them. I know this now.
Why do I learn these things after the fact?
I bought 8 new or rebuilt 24# injectors that I installed. They all worked except for one. I was told that if you whack on it with a metallic object that it will make it work. I did this and it worked. I think it was still a bit stuck and when driving the car on a road test it went from 7cyl to 8 all was good, then it went back to 7. I could smell fuel and I was pulling over but not soon enough.
When you have injectors cleaned or buy rebuilt ones the water based material they use dries up after a few days. They need to be pre started before you install them. I know this now.
Why do I learn these things after the fact?
08-02-2016, 03:25 PM
#42
In my opinion and loosing a lot of sleep over this last night, I think it was the new injector that I installed.
I bought 8 new or rebuilt 24# injectors that I installed. They all worked except for one. I was told that if you whack on it with a metallic object that it will make it work. I did this and it worked. I think it was still a bit stuck and when driving the car on a road test it went from 7cyl to 8 all was good, then it went back to 7. I could smell fuel and I was pulling over but not soon enough.
When you have injectors cleaned or buy rebuilt ones the water based material they use dries up after a few days. They need to be pre started before you install them. I know this now.
Why do I learn these things after the fact?
I bought 8 new or rebuilt 24# injectors that I installed. They all worked except for one. I was told that if you whack on it with a metallic object that it will make it work. I did this and it worked. I think it was still a bit stuck and when driving the car on a road test it went from 7cyl to 8 all was good, then it went back to 7. I could smell fuel and I was pulling over but not soon enough.
When you have injectors cleaned or buy rebuilt ones the water based material they use dries up after a few days. They need to be pre started before you install them. I know this now.
Why do I learn these things after the fact?
08-02-2016, 03:39 PM
#43
Rennlist Member
Depends on what it sprays on. ATF spraying on a hot exhaust manifold can and has started engine fires. Certainly if fuel landed in a similar place, that would be hot enough.
Sorry to see this.
What is the actual ignition source for these fires? Certainly leaked fuel, oil or power steering fluid are fire hazards, but what is hot enough in the engine compartment of a 928 to ignite even gasoline fumes?
Maybe I am wrong about things not being hot enough to spontaneously ignite, but I have seen a couple of cars, not 928s, with scary fuel leaks on the engine that were disasters waiting to happen but had not burned.
A possible source of ignition, at least in the later cars, could be the open nature of the distributors on the camshafts: the rotors and electrodes are in the plenum of the timing belt which is vented by air from the engine compartment that could carry flammable fumes.
The above is just a theory, but 928s have more engine fires than seems reasonable. Does anyone know if the earlier cars with "normal" distributors have the same fire problem as the later cars, or have an explanation?
What is the actual ignition source for these fires? Certainly leaked fuel, oil or power steering fluid are fire hazards, but what is hot enough in the engine compartment of a 928 to ignite even gasoline fumes?
Maybe I am wrong about things not being hot enough to spontaneously ignite, but I have seen a couple of cars, not 928s, with scary fuel leaks on the engine that were disasters waiting to happen but had not burned.
A possible source of ignition, at least in the later cars, could be the open nature of the distributors on the camshafts: the rotors and electrodes are in the plenum of the timing belt which is vented by air from the engine compartment that could carry flammable fumes.
The above is just a theory, but 928s have more engine fires than seems reasonable. Does anyone know if the earlier cars with "normal" distributors have the same fire problem as the later cars, or have an explanation?
08-02-2016, 03:48 PM
#45
Rennlist Member
Even the "Witch Hunter" site says that they should be stored in an air tight bag so they do not dry out, a little WD helps w/ that.
IMO the "whacking" w/ whatever could have caused a leak at the plastic to metal bond, I've see this on old Injectors I've installed (had 3 leak all over a fresh engine once).
Now I always pressure test them before installing them, and even then let the engine run up to temp under supervision before putting the Fire extinguisher back in the car
Pic 1 shows one leaking at seal
Pic 2 shows a pressure test w/ a 12v batt, to trigger the injector (work them a few time each, still no guarantees, I think that's one reason they went to solid plastic as well as for heat transfer.
Edit: So sorry for the loss of your 928, she was really nice, if the interior and windshield were not damaged, then it would be possible to rebuild, as said it all depends on whet melted under there, block off any openings w/ plastic bags, etc.. before attempting to power wash under the hood, if you go that route.
IMO the "whacking" w/ whatever could have caused a leak at the plastic to metal bond, I've see this on old Injectors I've installed (had 3 leak all over a fresh engine once).
Now I always pressure test them before installing them, and even then let the engine run up to temp under supervision before putting the Fire extinguisher back in the car
Pic 1 shows one leaking at seal
Pic 2 shows a pressure test w/ a 12v batt, to trigger the injector (work them a few time each, still no guarantees, I think that's one reason they went to solid plastic as well as for heat transfer.
Edit: So sorry for the loss of your 928, she was really nice, if the interior and windshield were not damaged, then it would be possible to rebuild, as said it all depends on whet melted under there, block off any openings w/ plastic bags, etc.. before attempting to power wash under the hood, if you go that route.
