Picking up the 928
07-12-2015, 11:25 PM
#91
Rennlist Member
I feel entertained at least now.
If a buyer doesn't like it, and isn't gonna finger the seller, the seller should feel happy about that.
I hope the seller realizes that he got off easily and can work on the issues quietly..given the respectful anonymity the buyer offered them.
If a buyer doesn't like it, and isn't gonna finger the seller, the seller should feel happy about that.
I hope the seller realizes that he got off easily and can work on the issues quietly..given the respectful anonymity the buyer offered them.
07-12-2015, 11:47 PM
#92
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Undisclosed issues are still undisclosed issues, period. And doubly so when the facts of the inspection seem to be at odds with a verbal presentation. Without reasonable and honest disclosure from a seller any potential buyer is forced to assess the car on "as-is" presentation, and their own ability diagnose and repair any possible future problems. Not everyone is a hobbyist / mechanic who is ready to take on a car "as-is" with a large number of potential question marks, or at least things they feel are question marks.
When I evaluate a car, I first talk with the seller and get the history of the car, and it's current condition. Then I go see the car. If what I see matches up with what I have been told, then I can usually assume the seller has tried to be honest and forthright. If there are small details that that the seller may not have been aware of, I can probably assume it was probably something they didn't know about, or didn't understand was a potential issue.
However if the car presents differently than I was told, and I am immediately faced with a number of unexpected additional issues, then I simply assume that seller is intentionally being dishonest, or at least unwilling to look at their own car realistically, and assume everything is is "as-is where-is; buyer beware". On a car like that I usually just walk away. If I feel it still has some potential, I may negotiate from the perspective I cannot trust anything the buyer has told me. But usually, even then, I end up walking away without buying.
When the seller fails to offer a reasonable level of disclosure, the seller's own behavior puts me in a position where I have to limit any offer based on the basis of much larger potential risk.
Also, I had considering picking apart a number of details in the various pictures outside of the the "focus your attention here" green circles. But I have no interest in the car. I would suggest that a potential buyer have the car checked over closely by someone who is knowledgeable about the specific flavor of 928 in question. Both the both body and interior pictures leave me with questions.
When I evaluate a car, I first talk with the seller and get the history of the car, and it's current condition. Then I go see the car. If what I see matches up with what I have been told, then I can usually assume the seller has tried to be honest and forthright. If there are small details that that the seller may not have been aware of, I can probably assume it was probably something they didn't know about, or didn't understand was a potential issue.
However if the car presents differently than I was told, and I am immediately faced with a number of unexpected additional issues, then I simply assume that seller is intentionally being dishonest, or at least unwilling to look at their own car realistically, and assume everything is is "as-is where-is; buyer beware". On a car like that I usually just walk away. If I feel it still has some potential, I may negotiate from the perspective I cannot trust anything the buyer has told me. But usually, even then, I end up walking away without buying.
When the seller fails to offer a reasonable level of disclosure, the seller's own behavior puts me in a position where I have to limit any offer based on the basis of much larger potential risk.
Also, I had considering picking apart a number of details in the various pictures outside of the the "focus your attention here" green circles. But I have no interest in the car. I would suggest that a potential buyer have the car checked over closely by someone who is knowledgeable about the specific flavor of 928 in question. Both the both body and interior pictures leave me with questions.
07-12-2015, 11:47 PM
#93
Picking up the 928
FWIW I've had odo gears break minutes before a customer was to pick up the car, right after I filled it up for them and reset it. Happened a few times actually so this wouldn't surprise me at all.
Thanks for an entertaining thread.
Thanks for an entertaining thread.
07-13-2015, 12:07 AM
#94
Shameful Thread Killer
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I have two broken cars right now, or I'd make a marginal offer for it. Wondering about the won't idle situation. It could be $60 fix or a $1200 fix. Broken odo gear is broken odo gear. I don't know when it broke, so have to assume the worst.
Ext cosmetics are normal for that vintage. Bit here, bit there. Int appears above average. But running is important, and if it won't run right, that's a bad hit I'm afraid.
Since the contact info requested was never forthcoming, I guess I'll be on my way.
Ext cosmetics are normal for that vintage. Bit here, bit there. Int appears above average. But running is important, and if it won't run right, that's a bad hit I'm afraid.
Since the contact info requested was never forthcoming, I guess I'll be on my way.
07-13-2015, 12:36 AM
#96
Shameful Thread Killer
Rennlist Member
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I'm sure it'll sell any second now.
any second - now.
any - second - now.
any --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
second -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- now.
any second - now.
any - second - now.
any --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
second -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- now.
07-13-2015, 01:29 AM
#97
Rennlist Member
doc... please read the posts.
I am acting as the RL rep for this seller.
The current photos are from me -in person with the car;
and reviews from my actually driving the car
(I own an '88 auto, so familiarity is solid).
PM me with an offer to relay to the seller.
The idle issue appears to be more of a vacuum issue.
Intake gaskets recently replaced and it is suspected
(not just by me -but another RLister that accompanied me)
that a vacuum hose under the intake may have been compromised.
With that said, there is also a K&N air filter on it.
We first suspected the MAF went bad -but I have had to replace my own MAF
and mine would not drive at all.
This one does drive -and very well- outside of idling.
So, I do not believe it to be the MAF.
My '88 was purchased for $5k and was 10 times worse than this one is being claimed to be.
What should a 1 of 30 (some say 1 of 23 from '87-'88) Cassisrot in mid-8's out of 10 condition be worth?
In the car world, this would be called a 'survivor' in every sense of the word!
He is not even asking NADA retail pricing.
Finger? Hell, he tried to bend him over and F**K him...
and then left negative eBay feedback because he wouldn't swallow...
the lowball offer.
If somebody doesn't take a stand against the raping of 928 owners/sellers -who will?
Michael Wilhoit can't do it all by himself.
-that were not bug splatter or pollen dust- whether slider saw them or not...
in the interest of disclosure.
But in the short time you've been on RL,
you probably see more things than an actual 928 owner in person would -right?
'mkay.
07-13-2015, 01:44 AM
#98
Rennlist Member
What's the measurement on crank play?
From the pics, the buyer was clearly in the wrong on the aesthetic complaints. For the price, even if it was dirtier for the transaction, it sure cleans up well.
Do you have any pictures of the front seats full-on? Every one you posted is obscured somehow. What condition are the bolsters and bottom cushions in?
But it was poor form to say something like "car needs nothing" in the ebay listing when it won't idle. Why won't the seller fix the idle issue and then list it for what it's really worth?
From the pics, the buyer was clearly in the wrong on the aesthetic complaints. For the price, even if it was dirtier for the transaction, it sure cleans up well.
Do you have any pictures of the front seats full-on? Every one you posted is obscured somehow. What condition are the bolsters and bottom cushions in?
But it was poor form to say something like "car needs nothing" in the ebay listing when it won't idle. Why won't the seller fix the idle issue and then list it for what it's really worth?
07-13-2015, 02:09 AM
#99
Rennlist Member
What's the measurement on crank play?
I believe that is in the maintenance folder.
From the pics, the buyer was clearly in the wrong on the aesthetic complaints. For the price, even if it was dirtier for the transaction, it sure cleans up well.
It sure does -buyer didn't want to mess up his nail polish.
Do you have any pictures of the front seats full-on? Every one you posted is obscured somehow.
I needed to take some pics in shade... reflection off windshield was really bad
What condition are the bolsters and bottom cushions in?
Actually very good, no rips or tears.
Some minor cracking of vinyl piping.
Driver seat is a tad darker from being used more.
I will do the hour drive each way again to get more pics.
But it was poor form to say something like "car needs nothing" in the ebay listing when it won't idle.
I agree. Seller was a little enthusiastic there.
Why won't the seller fix the idle issue and then list it for what it's really worth?
That is what is really at heart here... determining the value.
Anybody interested will nickel-n-dime the price down for anything -bug splatters, water spots from washing, stones in the tire treads, etc.
Even if they do their own work -they will try to deduct full retail and labor of the worst case scenario... even if they know what the issue really is.
Age-old practice here on RL.
I believe that is in the maintenance folder.
From the pics, the buyer was clearly in the wrong on the aesthetic complaints. For the price, even if it was dirtier for the transaction, it sure cleans up well.
It sure does -buyer didn't want to mess up his nail polish.
Do you have any pictures of the front seats full-on? Every one you posted is obscured somehow.
I needed to take some pics in shade... reflection off windshield was really bad
What condition are the bolsters and bottom cushions in?
Actually very good, no rips or tears.
Some minor cracking of vinyl piping.
Driver seat is a tad darker from being used more.
I will do the hour drive each way again to get more pics.
But it was poor form to say something like "car needs nothing" in the ebay listing when it won't idle.
I agree. Seller was a little enthusiastic there.
Why won't the seller fix the idle issue and then list it for what it's really worth?
That is what is really at heart here... determining the value.
Anybody interested will nickel-n-dime the price down for anything -bug splatters, water spots from washing, stones in the tire treads, etc.
Even if they do their own work -they will try to deduct full retail and labor of the worst case scenario... even if they know what the issue really is.
Age-old practice here on RL.
07-13-2015, 02:50 AM
#100
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The color matched steering wheel is a bit of a gem.
It looks like it's a 930 style wheel in the correct color.
From my experience, that is a pretty rare find (and a nice detail)...
It looks like it's a 930 style wheel in the correct color.
From my experience, that is a pretty rare find (and a nice detail)...
07-13-2015, 02:59 AM
#101
Rennlist Member
Absolutely! The 3-spoke 930 design is what should have been on 928's all along... thank you for the nice comments!
07-13-2015, 11:17 AM
#102
Scared to Look
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Picking up the 928
Since this Gentleman White Lightning continues to defend the sellers tactics and belittle me at every opportunity I think a bit more disclosure is in order. One of the things he slammed me on was that I only offered $6000 not the $6500 that I offered after driving 3.5 hours to see the neglected mess of a 928.
Here are the texts from that night, and the follow up car fax he felt compelled to send me that proves the odometer did not stop the day of delivery.
Here are the texts from that night, and the follow up car fax he felt compelled to send me that proves the odometer did not stop the day of delivery.
07-13-2015, 11:19 AM
#103
Nordschleife Master
Undisclosed issues are still undisclosed issues, period. And doubly so when the facts of the inspection seem to be at odds with a verbal presentation. Without reasonable and honest disclosure from a seller any potential buyer is forced to assess the car on "as-is" presentation, and their own ability diagnose and repair any possible future problems. Not everyone is a hobbyist / mechanic who is ready to take on a car "as-is" with a large number of potential question marks, or at least things they feel are question marks.
When I evaluate a car, I first talk with the seller and get the history of the car, and it's current condition. Then I go see the car. If what I see matches up with what I have been told, then I can usually assume the seller has tried to be honest and forthright. If there are small details that that the seller may not have been aware of, I can probably assume it was probably something they didn't know about, or didn't understand was a potential issue.
However if the car presents differently than I was told, and I am immediately faced with a number of unexpected additional issues, then I simply assume that seller is intentionally being dishonest, or at least unwilling to look at their own car realistically, and assume everything is is "as-is where-is; buyer beware". On a car like that I usually just walk away. If I feel it still has some potential, I may negotiate from the perspective I cannot trust anything the buyer has told me. But usually, even then, I end up walking away without buying.
When the seller fails to offer a reasonable level of disclosure, the seller's own behavior puts me in a position where I have to limit any offer based on the basis of much larger potential risk.
Also, I had considering picking apart a number of details in the various pictures outside of the the "focus your attention here" green circles. But I have no interest in the car. I would suggest that a potential buyer have the car checked over closely by someone who is knowledgeable about the specific flavor of 928 in question. Both the both body and interior pictures leave me with questions.
When I evaluate a car, I first talk with the seller and get the history of the car, and it's current condition. Then I go see the car. If what I see matches up with what I have been told, then I can usually assume the seller has tried to be honest and forthright. If there are small details that that the seller may not have been aware of, I can probably assume it was probably something they didn't know about, or didn't understand was a potential issue.
However if the car presents differently than I was told, and I am immediately faced with a number of unexpected additional issues, then I simply assume that seller is intentionally being dishonest, or at least unwilling to look at their own car realistically, and assume everything is is "as-is where-is; buyer beware". On a car like that I usually just walk away. If I feel it still has some potential, I may negotiate from the perspective I cannot trust anything the buyer has told me. But usually, even then, I end up walking away without buying.
When the seller fails to offer a reasonable level of disclosure, the seller's own behavior puts me in a position where I have to limit any offer based on the basis of much larger potential risk.
Also, I had considering picking apart a number of details in the various pictures outside of the the "focus your attention here" green circles. But I have no interest in the car. I would suggest that a potential buyer have the car checked over closely by someone who is knowledgeable about the specific flavor of 928 in question. Both the both body and interior pictures leave me with questions.
07-13-2015, 11:41 AM
#105
Scared to Look
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Picking up the 928
I have purchased a 911, Cayenne S , Mercedes, Toyota Mr2 Spyder And Sequoia on EBay and was very happy with each transaction as the cars were for the most part as advertised when I went to pick them up. My expectations are not too high. All I expect is an honest description of the vehicle being offered.