hemismith

Hello everyone -- I'm brand new here and apologize for barging in but could use some advice. In the 90's I owned a 944 and then a 968 and was quite active on Rennlist, but haven't had a Porsche since. I've been looking for a new car and an 87 928 came up locally. I've always wanted one but this one is a tough decision. It's a unique color in good condition with 83k miles on it. But it doesn't have a lot of records and it apparently hasn't been driven much if at all (except for recently) in 6+ years. I figure I would need to do the complete timing belt, tensioners, seals, water pump job, along with auxiliary belts, fluid changes etc. The ECU, an injector, and fuel pump were just replaced and it runs well. The A/C also doesn't work but I'm not sure what the problem is yet. I'm waiting for an estimate from a local shop but I figure it could need several thousand right off the bat, plus perhaps tires. Note that it's an automatic car; I always wanted a manual but for a couple reasons an auto is better for me right now.

I generally shy away from things like this but is there a price at which this might be worth it? Or should I just walk away?

Thanks. It's exciting to see how Rennlist has evolved and how much activity there is here.

Craig

Bill Ball

Get a PPI. If the car is near Salt Lake, give Motorsport Inc a call.

2128 Richards St
Salt Lake City, UT 84115
(801) 487-6733

Randy V

Read the New Visitor FAQ post at the top of this forum.

tkrtape12

Sounds like my project car... I sold my totally finished 951 and had no thoughts of another Porsche project then this one came up locally ..also very little records but body and interior are spotless so I figured if I got it at a deep enough discount I would be ok... We're never going to get our money back out of these things but my 9 year old loves the car and it's a great project... Completely dif from my 951 but I really like mine...good luck...just my 2 cents...the guys here on this side of the board are great and super informative...send some pics after you buy it..

G8RB8

You came to the right place, but too late. You need to spend some time here reading everything you can about these cars before you jump in. JMHO

WallyP

Buying any used car is a crap-shoot. Records help a little, but they really don't change very much. There seems to be a religious belief on here that you must have records, but few 928s have any meaningful records.

So you have a record that says that Jimmy's P-Car Garage put a new timing belt and water pump on 800 miles ago - did Jimmy check the tensioner arm bushings? Did he check the coating on the cam sprockets? Did he use an Autozone rebuilt pump? Did he replace the three bolts that he broke off?

I consider what I can see to be more important than a stack of bills...

The best thing that you can do is to have someone who really knows the 928 to do a PPI.

docmirror

Check
TBF!

hemismith

I apologize, I knew better, I was a bit overzealous. But thanks for all the replies. In order:
1) Thanks for the recommendation. I was planning on getting a PPI if I determined the car was worth pursuing and had heard of them, but wasn't sure how much 928 experience they had.
2) I read the new visitor FAQ as well as the 928 PPI article, thanks.
3) Thanks, yeah, it's true these cars can never be sold for what is put into them, but my experience with my previous Porsches was that it wasn't too bad and totally worth it as long as I got a good enough price up front.
4) I apologize, I used to know a fair amount about them but spent just a few hours reading and searching here. I found very little relevant to my main question although I did find some good info about the A/C; I have never found forum search functions to work very well and gave up. Unfortunately it would take a year to read everything.
5) Thanks, I agree. Unless I had documented evidence that everything was done by a reputable shop that was needed I am more comfortable just doing it (or having it done) myself.
6) Thanks for the reminder about the thrust bearing.

It's a little frustrating that people try to sell cars with so many things that need to be done. When it's 90 degrees outside it's nice if the A/C works during the test drive, for example. At any rate, thanks again. I'm a little discouraged now though and will probably just forget the whole thing, so I won't be a future bother. I am starting to remember how my life used to revolve around this list and can't really spend that kind of time any more. So if anyone wants a Nougatbraun S4 for about $8k there's one in Salt Lake City.

docmirror

The car has been discussed here before. I don't think it's a lost cause, but wil require some diligence. Understand about the time involved. I"m bringing a 968 back from 7 years of deferred mx, and I've spent about 80 hours so far, and still have more to do. Meh - if I wasn't out there hacking at a car, or plane, I'd be inside watching football or baseball. Hey that's what I'm doing now!

hemismith

Interesting, good to know, thanks. I see the thread where it's mentioned. At the time that person looked at it it wasn't running. When it was first consigned after they replaced the ECU etc they were asking over $13k, so that's why it's been out there for so long. (And on my computer the pictures looked pink, which I thought might be a deterrent.) The price is finally getting to what I thought was reasonable; I was thinking that if I got it in the 7's it might be worth it. But who knows. I have asked the place to get an estimate on fixing the A/C and they said they would, so we'll see.

James Bailey

Ah ....."It's a little frustrating that people try to sell cars with so many things that need to be done." ACTUALLY THAT IS WHY they are trying to sell them.
Typical cycle is they stop fixing stop waxing stop washing then look at it and decide that they NEED a new car ! Because they WANT a new car and let the old beater go as a perfect excuse for getting a new car.

hemismith

Good point! But I'd think they'd want to at least make what they're selling attractive -- in the winter no a/c is fine but it sure makes a bad impression in the summer. This is the 3rd German car I've looked at this summer with no a/c. There have been 3 with airbag lights on as well; I don't think it can be registered that way. But I understand how they can get tired of fixing things.

tv

Regarding AC. I removed mine on purpose. Never a big fan of it in general. But my 928 is strictly for fun and sitting in traffic in hot weather is not fun. I would drive mostly at night on hot days with the windows somewhat open. I prefer driving like that anyways.

In the 928 a strange thing happens at least on mine. Unlike most cars when the windows are down, my 928 does not buffet me with wind or noise, the aerodynamics are such that it is pleasant. I also have an extremely enjoyable exhaust system that I love to listen to. Owning a 928 is a hobby, a good part of that is working on it. Exclusive of the always increasing parts prices, that should be viewed as fun and rewarding.

My .02. Never buy a 928 as transportation, buy it because you want one and have the time, interest, and pocket change for a great hobby. If you understand this and like a particular car, get it if the PPI comes back w/o major items.

docmirror

It's like we all say, the deferred mx tells the story. This example is a good teaching moment for new 928 buyers. When the car will not run, someone asks $6k for it, thinking it's a $110 fix. The final repair bill just to make it move under it's own power is prolly over $1000. Now, it's running, but the AC won't work. Well, it left the factory with a working AC and that's something that most of us would require in a touring car. Again, the seller thinks it's only a $80 part away from working perfectly. The reality is that to get the 928 AC working right usually again comes in near $1000. The head unit has to be modified, the leaks need to be addressed, new compressor, dryer, maybe the blower resistors, front fans and controller, then fill it with R-12, or go for the conversion and spend as much or more.

That's why these cars need to be in the hands of DIY kind of people. Greg could fix all the stuff on a 928, but the final price would be so high as to make it a waste of time and money. It'll never recover the market value.

I love buying up these old, neglected cars. They usually have good 'bones' to start with, but need a lot of small love in many different areas. Once you do all that work, you've got a nicely sorted semi-vintage, almost super car. The key is to buy it right. Even at $7k, unless every bit of labor is done by the new owner, it quickly gets way too expensive to bother with. And Greg will quickly tell you that we absolutely shouldn't be working on our own cars, cause all we do is screw them up worse!

hemismith

I agree that listening to the exhaust note with the windows down would be quite enjoyable. It's good to know that it doesn't buffet. Where I'm originally from in California this could be done most of the year without a/c or heat.

I have seen that cars that don't get driven much seem to have more problems though. I had a friend who drove an old Ferrari daily for 4 years and never had any issues.