Landseer

There are markings on the cam gears. Can't not be. Because only porsche 928 gears will work.

Take closeups of the gears. Notches are saw kerf width. Gotta look down, between gear and rear backing plates, to see the singular notch on each cam gear.



Sorry I edited re: distributor.

When cap is off, and rotor is pointing approx forward at the notch on the distributor base, the cam gear notch on the driver's cam gear will line-up with the backing plate arrow.

The distributor is run from a gear off that drivers camshaft.

In proper setup, with timing belt on --- the other camgear notch will also match its backing plate arrow on pass side. And, the crank pulley will be on O/T. And if your were to reach into the #1 cylinder through the spark plug hole with a straw, piston would be found full-up.

Landseer

here are some old pictures that might help

jpitman2

Pic in post #32 just shows the V nick in the rear face of a cam gear. Keep looking, they are quite small, but they are there. Also note that with driver side cam gear lined up with mark, and belt on, the pax side gear will NOT exactly line up when the belt is engaged properly - this IS normal - the WSM says to turn the cam anti-clockwise(IIRC?) until it engages the belt. Some of this error will come out as the engine warms. Read some of the timing belt & waterpump notes here several times, and you will gradually soak up everything and the fog will clear...
jp 83 Euro S AT 54k

Settin03

Landseer - Those close up pics are worth a million! Thanks.
I started to feel that our 16v were to shy to be photographed. I have only come across 32v pics so far while searching.
Ok so now I understand that the cam on the drivers side is what controls the distributor. ( I thought the crankshaft did ) So I will use a straw to determine TDC/OT when turning the crank and line up the cam notches when placing the belt back on. ( Sounds about right )

jp - I will locate the V nick today and the TDC. Then I can make my own marks at those points. What should I use to mark that will stay? I finally recieved the WSM on CD from Germany but I can't seem to find the TB write up. It's a bit confusing but definitely indepth. Again I thank all you that have contrinbuted to this thread. I can't wait to share that joy of completion with you guys.

settin03 83 928s 5spd Custom widebody.

Landseer

Shouldn't really need to use the straw in cylinder.

The orange harmonic balancer, when mounted so that its normally positioned for reading when you stand in front of car facing engine, is keyed to crankshaft so that pointer will line-up with O/T mark "if and only if" #1 piston is at TDC. (Only exception --- if harmonic balancer is damaged such that perimeter has rotated relative to keyed core --- unlikely)

If the belt is still on your car, and harmonic balancer is on correctly and not flipped, then simply rotating crank to O/T with a big socket wrench should also get cam gears to the right place, so notches are visible.

If you do this and the notches aren't visible, then they will be 180 deg off. If not visible, rotate crank one more rotation and the cam notches will come into view as the orange harmonic balancer O/T mark aligns again with the waterpump pointer. (Cam gears turn only one half revolution for every revolution of the crankshaft). TDC with respect to the #1 piston occurs on every crank rev, but TDC with cam/valves in correct postioning for firing, ie technical true TDC #1, occurs every 2 rotations of crank/harmonic balancer.

And like a f'ng Rubiks cube, eventually you will visualize it all clearly.

And buy more 928's to fix.

Settin03

I see the balancer from underneath nw that it's daylight again. I s the O/T and another marked white line to the (R) of the O/T SO I assume it's the 4/5 I see talked about. Being that I have the 16v Do I pay attention to the white marked line or just us the O/T and line up the cams all the same?
Enjoy the pics of what I'm abot to get into.

PorKen

...although, it may be at TDC #6, sometimes.

Settin03

Ok, Cam (L) Drivers side has a notch opposite the indicator. (LAST PIC) The cams snap ( Not sound snap but push like it's going over a hump and falls in the rigde ) It won't stop on #1cylynder. It stops on #3. As seen in pic with screwdriver to mark #1 cylinder. Then cam on (R) side (Pass side) has a burr made into the cam which only lines up as seen in pic. Both cams do the snap thing where you turn it and it gives resistance until you past that point and it pushes you into the groove so to speak.
I know it sounds jumbled but can't find another way to explain it now..
All the plugs are still in the car, none removed at this time. ( Not sure it matters or is the cause but wanted to mention in case it did.) I rotated the crank to O/T. Put gear in 2nd to see if I could leave car ingear to loosen bolt but it still rocks the car when I try. I don't have a crank stopper.

PorKen

Valve spring pressure will the move the cams unless the belt is put on.

Put it in 5th gear and block the rear wheels.

Lizard928

You DESPERATELY need new cam gears,
Do not reuse those cam gears.

jeff spahn

You need to join as a member to do this. It is cheap and a very good investment as you are seeing from the advice others are giving you. Spend the money and join today.

Landseer

New cam gears.

And while they are off, remove the backing plates so you can reseal the cam shafts where they pass-through those plates. And, there are a few seals behind the plates themselves. This should stop the majority of oil leaks that are visible through the gears. There are a series of O-rings and seals --- roger can list them for you. Cost is in neighborhood of $60 for all of them. Gears are more. Chances are 95% that the crankshaft steel gear and oil pump drive gear will also need replacing.

Your old O-rings, around / in the cam noses, might likely seem like carbon and need to be chipped out of their respective grooves.

Looks exactly like my '84 USA 5 speed did.

namasgt

Make sure when you buy a new pump, buy from our vendors. There are some cheap ones on ebay you want to avoid, just search for "water pump failure" on this forum and you will find enough info. Hopefully the impeller has not damaged the block. I would personally only buy a brand new plastic impeller pump, avoid the rebuilt ones. Roger (928sRUS) sells the new plastic impeller pumps, you should give him a call or email him, he can help you decide on which pump to get and other parts you may need. I just installed a new one yesterday on my car.

Podguy

Wow. I have not been keeping up with this. Looks like you are on the right path. I second the advice on the seals - cam, oil pump and front crank seal - and the o-rings. The cam gears are shot. This could be high wear but is more common from over tightening the belt. The 83 US model is prone to breaking cams so getting the measurement right is important. If you can find cam gears from an 85 up they are variable and the timing can be dialed in for fine tuning. Ken can help you with this.

I wrote up a list of things that can go wrong.

http://www.kondratyev.com/porsche/te...elt_-78-84.htm

Good luck.

Settin03

I will look into the cam gears and those seals to purchase. The oil pump gear is actually in great condition. I have not seen the crankshaft gear as yet. I actually lost 5th gear as my rear coupler is worn. I need to change the coupler so I can put it in 5th gear to take of the crank pulley. I have an account with 928int, so I will be giving Mark & Tom a call today!

The engine actually has only about 80,000 on it. The belt was on really tight by PO as well. Your write up is a great piece of information. I will be printing it out.

Appreciate all the help. I will also become a paying member this week. It's well worth it!!