Notices
928 Forum 1978-1995
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by: 928 Specialists

The Head Case (has soft-core parts porn)

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 05-14-2010, 06:58 AM
  #1  
ptuomov
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
 
ptuomov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: MA
Posts: 5,610
Received 81 Likes on 64 Posts
Default The Head Case (has soft-core parts ****)

This is the post-mortem for the porting and polishing thread: https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...ee-thread.html

For a number of reasons, most likely including the recession and less than stellar business acumen, the person porting my heads went out of business and closed his shop last year while in the middle of the job of porting my heads. This was a cluster-f of epic proportions, of course. There are multiple potential fail-blog entries in the saga, including lost parts, missing persons, etc. On the positive side, to my knowledge, the Mexican mafia was not involved.

Don't have your heads ported by Don Redmon!

Hence the title of this thread, The Head Case.

So that's the bad news. The good news is that Jim Morton really did me a solid. He (a) extracted the heads from a rather random location where they had ended up in because of the business failure and (b) completed the job. Furthermore, these heads look like they'll work out in the end. So a happy ending is in the horizon.

Some photos:

The valves are by Ferrea. Close to stock sizes and weights, but should be able to handle the turbo heat.

Name:  IMG_1224.jpg
Views: 396
Size:  121.6 KB

The springs are custom load beehives from PAC. The seated load is about 85 lbf and the spring rate is a bit above 300 lbf/inch. Because of the lower valvetrain mass and higher spring load, the simulations say the heads would be good for over 8000 rpm without valve float with the selected cam profile.

The cams that will be run in these heads are the S3->S4 cams with reground lobes, made by Dema Elgin and Jim Morton. Those are the same cams that are run in Dennis Kao's 5.0 screamer motor. Since Dennis Kao's engine made over 380 rwhp NA with those cams and shaved heads (https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...and-video.html), it'll be interesting to see how these cams will work with twin gt3071r turbos strapped on. I have certain expectations... ;-)

Name:  IMG_1225.jpg
Views: 334
Size:  125.0 KB

Another beehive shot. The valves have single-groove keepers that don't butt, so that connection should hold up as well.

Name:  IMG_1227.jpg
Views: 337
Size:  84.9 KB

The head castings are the fourth casting revision, manufactured some time in the early 1990's I bet.

Last edited by ptuomov; 05-14-2010 at 01:02 PM.
Old 05-14-2010, 03:30 PM
  #2  
danglerb
Nordschleife Master
 
danglerb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Orange, Cal
Posts: 8,575
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Default

Looks pretty, when does it get bolted to a block?
Old 05-14-2010, 03:46 PM
  #3  
karl ruiter
Rennlist Member
 
karl ruiter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Honolulu and sometimes L.A.
Posts: 3,338
Received 183 Likes on 120 Posts
Default

There was a well known Porsche machine shop in Pasadena, called Precision (something I cannot remember). I dropped off my heads there one a Wednesday and was supposed to pick them up Friday. Friday morning I could not find the shop. I had only been there once before to drop off the heads so it did not suprise me that I might have to drive up and down the street a few times to find it again, but I just could not find it. Finially I noticed the wisps of smoke still coming up from the now empty lot. Glad to hear you had a better result.
Old 05-14-2010, 04:17 PM
  #4  
123quattro
Drifting
 
123quattro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 2,973
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

Tuomo,

Glad you got your heads back. Sucks about the original work. What kind of head gaskets are you going to use?
Old 05-14-2010, 04:30 PM
  #5  
BC
Rennlist Member
 
BC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 25,132
Received 72 Likes on 53 Posts
Default

Can you pust some info on the retainers and keepers? They do not look stock.
Old 05-14-2010, 04:32 PM
  #6  
BC
Rennlist Member
 
BC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 25,132
Received 72 Likes on 53 Posts
Default

I can see that the exhaust ports were changed slightly. Does Jim Feel that the exhaust port needed more volume because of the increased flow from the cams? Can you state whether the intake port was enlarged or simply smoothed on transitions, etc?
Old 05-14-2010, 05:27 PM
  #7  
ptuomov
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
 
ptuomov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: MA
Posts: 5,610
Received 81 Likes on 64 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by danglerb
Looks pretty, when does it get bolted to a block?
Best case this weekend.

Originally Posted by karl ruiter
There was a well known Porsche machine shop in Pasadena, called Precision (something I cannot remember). I dropped off my heads there one a Wednesday and was supposed to pick them up Friday. Friday morning I could not find the shop. I had only been there once before to drop off the heads so it did not suprise me that I might have to drive up and down the street a few times to find it again, but I just could not find it. Finially I noticed the wisps of smoke still coming up from the now empty lot. Glad to hear you had a better result.
I guess they bolted your heads on, and the engine become so powerful that it was able to move the entire building thru time, a little like this:



Originally Posted by 123quattro
Tuomo, Glad you got your heads back. Sucks about the original work. What kind of head gaskets are you going to use?
Stock Porsche thick gaskets, since it's the stock 100mm bore. For this engine, everything is relatively conservative, so no heroic experimentation with MLS or anything like that. Saving those mistakes for the next round!

Originally Posted by BC
Can you pust some info on the retainers and keepers? They do not look stock.
The tiny retainers are half the trick in the beehives. The springs and retainers are mod Ford beehive springs from Peterson American Corporation with custom reset load. They are steel retainers, but since beehive allows them to be small, they are AFAIK lighter than dual spring titanium retainers.

Originally Posted by BC
I can see that the exhaust ports were changed slightly. Does Jim feel that the exhaust port needed more volume because of the increased flow from the cams? Can you state whether the intake port was enlarged or simply smoothed on transitions, etc?
The grinding job itself was done by Don, everything fell apart only after the heads were almost done. I think the end outcome is quite reasonable, but who knows?
Old 05-14-2010, 05:27 PM
  #8  
Jim Morton
Three Wheelin'
 
Jim Morton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,663
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

disclaimer... I had nothing to do with the porting or chamber work on these heads. I "rescued" them for Tuomo and had my shop complete the valve job, check install heights and did the deck work.

The porting work was done by Don a while ago and I think Tuomo posted his flow results. IMHO, the porting work looks very basic and I would have concerns about the exhaust porting if this engine were going to be run normally aspirated.
Old 05-14-2010, 06:10 PM
  #9  
ptuomov
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
 
ptuomov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: MA
Posts: 5,610
Received 81 Likes on 64 Posts
Default

Jim -- Thanks for saving those heads. Indeed no good deed goes unpunished if you have now become associated with Don's porting work! ;-) Best, Tuomo


Originally Posted by Jim Morton
disclaimer... I had nothing to do with the porting or chamber work on these heads. I "rescued" them for Tuomo and had my shop complete the valve job, check install heights and did the deck work.

The porting work was done by Don a while ago and I think Tuomo posted his flow results. IMHO, the porting work looks very basic and I would have concerns about the exhaust porting if this engine were going to be run normally aspirated.
Old 05-14-2010, 09:56 PM
  #10  
Yoakim Larson
Intermediate
 
Yoakim Larson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Sweden
Posts: 28
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Tuomo are you going to do the GTS exhaust mod, I notice you have two out of four hole drilled.
Old 05-14-2010, 11:50 PM
  #11  
ptuomov
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
 
ptuomov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: MA
Posts: 5,610
Received 81 Likes on 64 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Yoakim Larson
Tuomo are you going to do the GTS exhaust mod, I notice you have two out of four hole drilled.
Yes, those were just drilled and now match the new-style gaskets.

Name:  Gaskets.jpg
Views: 329
Size:  68.7 KB

Name:  DrilledHead1.jpg
Views: 273
Size:  58.8 KB

Name:  DrilledHead2.jpg
Views: 313
Size:  59.1 KB

Last edited by ptuomov; 05-15-2010 at 10:59 AM.
Old 05-15-2010, 01:49 AM
  #12  
BC
Rennlist Member
 
BC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 25,132
Received 72 Likes on 53 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Jim Morton

The porting work was done by Don a while ago and I think Tuomo posted his flow results. IMHO, the porting work looks very basic and I would have concerns about the exhaust porting if this engine were going to be run normally aspirated.
Meaning....that they are augured out too much?
Old 05-15-2010, 02:20 AM
  #13  
slate blue
Addict
Rennlist Member

 
slate blue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,315
Received 10 Likes on 8 Posts
Default

Hi Tuomo are you going to show pics of the ports?

Cheers Greg
Old 05-15-2010, 10:50 AM
  #14  
ptuomov
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
 
ptuomov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: MA
Posts: 5,610
Received 81 Likes on 64 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Greg Gray
Hi Tuomo are you going to show pics of the ports Cheers Greg
Those photos are in the porting and polishing thread.
Old 05-15-2010, 12:25 PM
  #15  
Rick Carter
Rennlist Member
 
Rick Carter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 10,133
Received 68 Likes on 44 Posts
Default

What are the part numbers for the valves, did you do anything with the valve seats?


Quick Reply: The Head Case (has soft-core parts porn)



All times are GMT -3. The time now is 06:56 AM.