Drewster67

For petes sake - it was a time trial. He was racing against himself and the clock.

In addition - have you ever been to a 24 hr lemons race? Its called lemons for a reason.

Also - its understood - if you going to race - **** will happen. It doesnt matter how much or how little one has invested. Its racing. What matters most is what happens after a accident or mishap - this is when being a gentle person comes into consideration. How you negotiate and communicate with the other driver is key or accepting fault if you messed up.

mark kibort

Ive raced against GT3s all the time in an old relec, $3000 928 with a big motor and some bolt ons. Hmm, running faster laps than many of them, and for example, just last weekend at laguna, quite a few GT3s came back with their noses busted up, rear lights bashed in and other damage. most self inflicted, but are you not ignoring the most important factor of risk? the driver?
Both Anderson and me have raced this crap-box. its not bad. its as safe as anthing out there on the track, just not that fast, probably enhancing its safety.
My car was put together in my garage with metwrench over the past 7 months. its cheap and fast compared to most anything out there. take one second off the time it runs now, and I could build it again for under $15k complete and still run a 1:39 at Laguna. Does this make it unsafe?
I think the guy that is racing the V8 powered Miata is the hazard. Heck, he had a wheel fly off the car. what if that happened into turn1 at laguna at the start? Now, thats the kind of stuff that scares the bejeezus out of me. a stripped down old supercar with good quality bolt ons, doesnt bother me a bit and if you took a look under this car, you would see that it is a safe track car. Not that terribly fast, but fun and safe

mk

Landseer

Funny.
Have some of the cabernet and settle down.

123

How much did he beat your time by?

rixter

who are you to determine "value" as a qualification for track worthiness?
that 928 was $45K 26 YEARS AGO! and a good 15-20 years ahead of it's time
your "concern" is that you and your buddies are getting your butts handed to you by a car you have no respect for

sorry, bad mood today... carry on

BC

Ah, okay. Tell you what - go to some other forum to argue with people who believe Lemons is the pinnacle of racing. Brian doesn't race Lemons anymore.

And to be very clear, the entire idea that a 911 still has its ***-engine behind the rear axle IS antique. Its an antiquated, out-of-date ideal that only a few hangers-on still believe is the way to race - simply based on blind-indifference to modern design and an ignorant slavishness to what Porsche stopped being good at 25 years ago - Racing. Porsche is being roundly trounced in any racing body current operating where it is not racing against itself. Why? Because it is using an ***-dragger design from 40 years ago.

Go be a fan-boi somewhere else.

danglerb

Race what you can afford, if you can't deal with a few dents in your car, time trial or find a cheaper car. Wheel to wheel racing has inherent touching of metal to metal from time to time if its really racing and not some water down spirited 9/10ths fun drive.

OBehave

Now that's funny right there I don't care who you are.

svp928

"Racer-x", I don't know you, or where you come from, but you seem to take yourself way too seriously... If you want to actually race, then you must do so with the understanding that your "investment" can be turned to junk in a second when you are on the track- whether its your fault or not...Anyone who goes on track worrying about what he spent to get there, should go home. You are racing cars, not wallets...

john bono

Let me guess. You were in the Cayman, right? Or was it the Evo?

IcemanG17

Racer X...while I completely understand the $ubstantial investment race cars are (BEEN THERE DONE THAT)... Do not think because I "Race" a $256 car that I would intentionally damage another car...never in a million years...in fact Lemons racing teaches you do have ZERO...as in nothing contact with other cars....touch a car...get a penalty...go even two wheels off track...get a penalty.....penalties pretty much kill the majority of the field....it pays to drive SUPER CLEAN in lemons..... since its an endurance race and the heavy penalities....it is far from a crash-up derby out there

The club I was running with and will run with again in the future is NCRC racing....which their motto is "personal responsibility".... and it WORKS....I was at a track day a while back when a total D!ck in a race prepped boxster was in Point By (2nd highest class) & he was SLOW....like a 10 car conga line slow and would hold everyone up in the corners then use his engine to hold people off on the straights (except for the ZR1 I was riding in :>) it was BAD...everyone in the pits was commenting...whats worse is the boxster had a full rig & crew with him...a big $$$ setup for sure.....you know what the race organizers did....KICKED HIM OUT.....they warned him once....then gave him the boot!! As it should be.....they also offered to drop him down a class where his dismal lap times were more appropriate but of course he didn't do it since he has a "Race" Porsche

IcemanG17

one thing I forgot.....the best advice I EVER got....

"never put a car on track you are not willing to LEAVE on track!"

Can I afford to stack up the lemons racer....sure...but it doesn't mean I want too....vs say my 2008 M3....I stack that up at the track and insurance won't cover it I'M SCREWED.....

mark kibort

No problem. Hey, let me tell you a story about WHY i have a race car rebuild program. 8 years of driving a pristine race car, evolving a little every season. a few dings here and there, but still a beautuful and great performing piece of porsche history. A guy with a bone stock Civic, with over 2 years of last place race experience, lost control on the last lap of our race, and came shoothing across the track, where with no chance of avoiding him, i hit him and then a wall. Both cars were toast. worst day of my life and almost ended mine. (cracked rib was my only injury). Your point is well taken though. some of the racers will put more emphasis on the race and position, than their safety. sometimes the look or quality of the car can determine this, but not always. We then have to develop skills to deal with those kinds of drivers. Unfortunaely, running in a class with a bunch of expensive cars, isnt always the safest place to be. I fel the safest with the SCCA ITE bunch for many years and then got taken out by the least likely suspect of the group. In racing, you never know what can happen. you can make your own luck to a point. my situation was a little odd and rare, as how does a front wheel drive civic, lose control of his car on a 60mph sweeper as we fly by going 100mph? just one of those things, I guess.
6 months of hard work later, and a lot of support from guys on this list, I have a replica car that could even be faster this time around.

as brian mentioned, we ran that Lemons racers with no incident. (well 3 out of 4 of us did) and it was the most traffic you would ever see on a race track 150 cars and not one clean lap in 2 hours of almost all out driving. Again, I never drove the car any different than i did my own car, so I dont think the car itself drove down my respect for other races, and again, I dont think the car was any less safe. the type of tires we all had to use, was the most risky factor in my opinon ( real street tires had to be used)
mk

928 at last

My guess, based on the comments from "Racer"
Is that it really irks him that a car with a retail value of 1/10 of the poser's wheels is fully competitive on a modern track with a competent driver behind the wheel. Wow. Sucks to be you. (And +/- $100 Gs poorer and no faster!).
Moving on to relevent topics and people now.

928 at last

OOps, forgot one thing...

Iceman,
Nice work!