jeff spahn

You need an optical tach? I have one I can ship you.

Jeff

Champagne

I can play with the components to make the function clearer, but for the reasons I listed above, I would rather not introduce color. The whole pictograph is one color and illuminated. With this design, adding color would require laser cutting color filters to introduce into the laminates. Not especially difficult, but still more time consuming, and we do want these components to remain at a low enough price point.

Paul

hans14914

I can appreciate the above comments. I personally have never had an experience like that, so it never occured to me that a timer would be a problem. Now that we have identified that there is an issue, how would you propose it be addressed aesthetically? You had a great suggestion for the climate symbol, and suggestion for the defrost mode implementation?

If we can find an attractive way of adding a dedicated defrost button, I would take it into account (it would actually simplify my code requirements). Would just shortening the timer count on the button be sufficient? I innitially selected 5sec just to make sure it wasnt accidentally engaged, but it could be reduced as low as 2-seconds, I would imagine, without getting weeded out by the debounce processing.

Thanks,
Hans

Alan

....Consider your life flashing before your eyes as you hurtle at high speed into an abyss... nothing... you are braking fast but can't even see how to stay on the road. I think there is no answer but 0 delay that works.

So how ?

I'd use a rotary control for the flaps and a dedicated button for DEF - but that doesn't match your plan.

Perhaps easiest for you would be to have pressing both defroster vent and footwell vent buttons at the same time trigger DEF mode - then cancelling could be any individual button press. Given a suitable active indicator and labelling I think this could be OK (and easier for you too). The buttons would need to be adjacent - but they already are.

Just a rough idea...

Alan

The other attractive option would be to have a switch on the fan position pot/encoder (pull switch or full clockwise switch) that triggers DEF (use central display for indication).

hans14914

Alan,

The reason I am not using a rotary for the vents, is because it doesnt allow for discrete selection - a feature I recall you were in favor of earlier. I personally think pressing two buttons simultaneously is more difficult then pressing and holding one for 2-seconds. Obviously, the best solution is a discrete button for the emergency mode. I am looking at a way of adding it. I think it can be done and still look good if I find another feature worth adding a button for on the other side (thinking something to better interface the rear AC). I will let you know what I come up with in the next couple hours. Just need to think it over in CAD so I can see how much real-estate we have to work with.

Thanks for the useful constructive criticism. You dont happen to have any supplementary voltage/current information on the temp-sensor feedback loop handy do you? I was planning on doing some data-logging this weekend weather permitting, but if those figures on handy, it would save a couple hours.

Thanks
Hans

Aloysius

+1 Re: Alan and S4ordies comment above. i might simplify things, keep all white on black and make it something like this:

hans14914

I still woudl like to see a 2d black and white version of this graphic. I think it is very complimentary to the fan icon.

Champagne

I think this version look good. Well balanced on the button and certainly self-explanatory:



Paul

Aloysius

something like this - did this quickly but it gets the idea. i can do a more detailed one per the graphic found on previous post. it needs some more finesse to work with the rest of the symbols, but it does keep it a little less cluttered. . . . POLL! Still, with the rest of the buttons, Paul C.'s graphic above looks convincing!

DR

Hi Paul,

Looking GOOD!!!

One suggestion, the Fan **** looks unbalanced with the Temp now due to the arrows etc.. I would do arrows on both , or neither???

Champagne

You're right. Working on it

Paul

Jadz928

This is a really cool development here. Great work, Hans and Paul

Looking at your layout begged me to consult my vintage ca. 1992. Human Factors Design Handbook

I'm going to excerpt in no particular order, and ask questions here and there...

Grouping Pushbuttons: Distance btw buttons (left to right) 5/8"-7/8", center to center

Pushbutton Diameter: 1/4" MIN, 1/2" preferred

**** Sizes (convenient operation for volume and illumination potentiomenter controls):
Preferred MIN - 1/2" Dia x 1/2" Deep, 4 in/oz resistance
Recommended for common applications - 1"-2" Dia x 3/4" Deep, 4-10 in/oz resistance

Are you rotary encoders dented (to allow for indexed scaling)? If so, where is the readout of the scaling (temp is clear, but were is fan speed)

Have you spec'd your "control/display ratio" (CD)?

General H.F. guidelines for controls:
- If rotatable, the symbol should be placed on the panel next to the control rather than on the control so that the label will always appear upright
- Place symbol above control if below eye level
- Do not place symbol where it could be blocked by hand when control is in use.
- Motion control expectancy for rotary ***** is increase = CW, decrease = CCW

Hard to tell general scale from your layout, but it appears some of your symbols (ie fan) may be on the small side. It may be that some may "look" out of proportion with the **** and switch sizes.

In no way is this a critique, just some food for thought. I applaud all your efforts!

F451

I just came out of a 1/2 day graphical design course, part of which covered brainstorming.

We should have had you guys conduct the course.

Nice work, some great ideas guys.

Jadz928

Hans,
Could you tell me more about the functionality of the the center rotary (w/ the volume symbol)? I read this is for the carputer. Is it multifunction or multi-stage?

The reason I ask is I'm curious if it will have the ability to scroll (using CW/CCW rotation) and select (when pushed)

I tried to read the whole thread, but may have missed this. I apologize in advance if that's the case. If so, just reply with a link to the post. Thanks.

Alan

Hans - I added some comments back my last post above ...

A rotary selector can for sure give you all the discrete flap modes.

Consider a 4 way vent selector like this one pictured below (was a candidate donor panel - now dropped)

It has console/door vent only, defroster vent, footwell vent and combination (all open).

In fact I am looking to use an early console with the 2 level auto vent control and a 6 way rotary selector:

Console (100%) vents only
Console (100%) + defrost
Console (50%) + defrost
Console (50%) + defrost & footwell
Console (50%) + footwell
Console (100%) + footwell

In fact I also have an override planned that allows for manual/auto control of the console vent so it can also be fully closed or set to maximized in any mode e.g. there are 3 positions Closed /Auto / Max - the Auto case is what is modelled above in the table.