bronto

Thus the photo. Not only that they have a signed receipt that heads were returned, but a photo showing which heads were returned. Pretty smart of them I'd say, and suggests that they thought something was up that they'd have to protect themselves from.

But, FWIW, I wasn't saying it was "pretty clear" what happened, but that motorsport's position was clearly explained. The rest is up to the lawyers to straighten out.

Big Dave

Every once in a while, a warning comes along on this forum about who's a good fellow to do business with, and who might not be. Maybe they heard such a warning here.

S4ordie

[QUOTE=bronto;6745370]Thus the photo. Not only that they have a signed receipt that heads were returned, but a photo showing which heads were returned. Pretty smart of them I'd say, and suggests that they thought something was up that they'd have to protect themselves from.
QUOTE]

I don't think anything is clear in the respones. Read the post again to understand the ambiguity ....

Delivered by whom? He never says "we" or SLC Motorsports, or.... I read this as it could also mean other things. But, even if it meant "we" or Motorsport, were the parts in question the ones returned? No clarification here....

Then there is the issue of they have many sets of heads...

Wow, I thought, as I am sure most everyone on this forum, that GT heads, cams, parts were in very short supply. I guess we all know where to get these plentiful items at low cost as Motorsport seem to sell them for minor profit.

So, sometime in the future, the truth will be known. For now it is all conjecture...

My gut tells me the parts in question were delivered to Motorsport from GG in Austraila. They sat on the shelf while the ill customer (don't know how to refer to them in any other context) made up their mind as to what to do with them. After an extended period of time the ill person asked for their stuff. It was packaged up, some photos (would love to see those) were taken and the ill person signed a receipt for them. I suspect these parts sat around awhile, perhaps in unopened boxes, before the ill person discovered the heads/parts in the box were not the GT components from Greg Gray but some other lesser parts. So in the interst of trying to prove what really happened Greg Gray started this thread with the hopes of uncovering the missing heads through some unwitting Rennlister who may have purchased them. In so doing, there would be direct evidence of fraud and theft by SLC Motorsports. But because they have pics and a signed receipt (though the parts returned may not have been the original GT parts, just not noticed by the ill person at the time... why would they suspect otherwise, I wouldn't), they, at the moment, are legally protected.

This is why there is mystery and vagueness in all of these posts.

Tuomo - just because the law declares someone not guilty, often only means there was not enough evidence to prove guilt.

I'm really not playing judege or jury here. I have had no dealings with any of these parties. It is my fervent hope that nothing nefarious happened here but just the parts were misplaced and the ones returned to the ill person were indeed the ones SLC Motorsports thought they were....

GG - good on you for trying to help. But next time I suggest you provide more basic details behind your requests A simple:

"I'm trying to help a friend track down a set of missing GT heads/cams. They may have been sold to someone here on Rennlist, possibly by accident. Here are some pics and serial numbers and descriptions of unique identifying characteristics. Thanks so much for any information you can offer.

Simple, easy to understand, doesn't even introduce the drama that is unnecessary.

ptuomov

This is why Greg Gray is perfectly right and doing all not-guilty parties a favor by trying to find the heads. When the heads are found, the buyer of the heads will tell us all who sold them to him. Tracing back the chain will land someone in the slammer if this case makes it to the feds' radar screen before that point.

heinrich

Maybe the heads are the originals, but the components are not. Having photos of the complete GG heads at Motorsport Utah's facility proves one thing, namely that they at one time had possession of the GG heads, complete. It does not prove that they were sent. I have come across this issue myself in the past ... I bought a perfect dash. It arrived and was a POS. How does the seller prove he shipped me the good dash? A photo of a perfect dash at his place does not prove what he sent me was that dash...

Big Dave

While we're diving into hypotheticals, what if the correct products were in fact shipped back, but an unscrupulous customer fabricates a story that he received a box of garbage instead?

heinrich

Thius is not what Greg asked us to do. We were asked to look out for parts. Greg:

What EXACT parts are we looking for:

GT heads, ported and polished?
cams?
valves?
covers?

Big Dave

Correct. Debating the issue will go no where. Greg just wants to know if anyone has seen the parts. I hope he finds them.

bigs

I think it's pretty clear from Dave's language that the parts have been delivered to the person who originally ordered them from Greg.

That's who the "person in question" is. That's why Dave has chosen not to identify that person.

There's no need to protect Greg's identity - he has already come out into the open.

And there's no need to protect Dave or Garrity's identity - they've also come out into the open.

So the only remaining "person in question" is the person who purchased them from Greg.

bronto

OK, maybe I was jumping to conclusions. My first read of the "clear" response was that they returned the heads to the customer, took a photo of the heads, attached the photo to the receipt and had the customer sign the receipt that essentially said "yes, these are the heads I have just received". Perhaps I am reading my own business experiences into their behavior, not feeling good about a particular situation and wanting proof positive that everything was done properly. Like I said, if this is what actually happened then motorsports was pretty danged smart and probably thwarted a fraud attempt. I have no idea who the unnamed customer is, I've only been around here since 2006 and don't remember early dramas, but the other parties have stepped forward into the light of day. The supposedly injured party was reluctant to report or follow up on it. For all we know, he is blaming motorsports in order to save face with Greg.

bigs

To the best of my knowledge, they not only have pics of the customer receiving the parts, they have video of the customer receiving the parts. And a signed receipt.

Edit: This was not the first time they had dealt with him.

docmirror

I don't think there's any question that a set of 'heads' were delivered to a truculent 'customer'. I believe the question may be were the 'heads' delivered the same 'heads' that left GG so long ago.

Inquiring minds want to know.

bigs

That's a question I can't answer. Only Dave and Garrity can. But I will say this - I have had extensive dealings with Dave and Garrity for nearly 6 years. I know those guys pretty well. I would be completely astounded if any parts were switched, regardless of who the customer was.

Tim Murphy

+1

john gill

Who the hell videos a customer receiving their goods , sounds like a lot of trouble to go to