Jack Riffle

Just got my Porken 32VR from Roger. Thanks Roger and Ken. Before I do my top End refresh on my 87 S-4, I wanted to check the valve timing to see if it is contributing to the cars lack of low end power. I think I can put that theory to bed. It ABSOLUTELY is!!! The question is.....Is the TB one tooth off or can I adjust this much difference out? The pics show the Porken tool in the "0" hole for reference.

Both pics were taken with the crank in O/T position and it was exact.

SeanR

Looks like both cams are one tooth off.

Jack Riffle

Here's something I forgot to mention!!! The marks on the cam gears are in perfect alignment with the marks on the rear of the timing covers. Should I adjust the cams as much as possible before attemting to run the belt correctly?

Garth S

Not really sure what you are saying: regardless, set the tool aside and assure that crank TDC index and the two cam gear indicies are simultaneously lined up ..... this provides correct valve timing. If not correct, correct by restringing the TB. One tooth off is 7.5 cam deg, or 15 crank deg - which is a lot.

Once this is done, you can then use the tool to play with cam timing if you so choose. These refinements are well within a 7.5 cam deg. window .... at least AFAIK, so the TB must be corrrect prior to dicking around with the cam gear position on the cam.

SeanR

So, crank is at TDC, both cam gears are showing TDC correct? Did you just do a TB replacement with new cam gears?

If that is the case, the cam gears themselves just need to be adjusted. 30mm and a 17mm are required. I'm not sure if the positions on there are showing retarded timing or not, don't have the 32vr instructions in front of me. I'd go for setting the cam gears at TDC with the 32vr, and then advance as you want.

Hope that helps.

Jack Riffle

I guess what I am saying is this....If I took off the belt right now....And then lined up the crank to O/T and the cam gears with the marks lined up with the back of the timing covers, and then re-installed the belt....It would be no different from the way it is now.....all the marks are where you would put them if you were putting on the belt. BUT.....you can see what the PORKEN tool is showing..........Something is surely not right!!!!

PorKen

That's a lazy low end right there, boss. It's easy to get a tooth off retard by not taking all the slack up between the oil pump gear and the 5/8 gear.

Where are the rotor bolt holes in the slots? In the center, or jammed all the way CW? Sometimes folks will try and 'fix' the problem without removing the belt.

The 32V'r is a better indicator when stringing the belt. The cam gear slots allow the belt to be at least one tooth off the small cam gear notch.

Jack Riffle

That's just it. I have no idea when the timing belt was done last. But the belt is properly tensioned, checked by Andrew Olson and then by myself.........AND all the timing marks are exactly where they should be.........If I took everything apart , put on a new belt, and then put everything into time...I would hope to have the marks as close as these are.......and it would apparently be way off......how do I correct this?

PorKen

Take off the clamp rings, and post a pic of the slots.

Jack Riffle

OK Ken, I'll try and take a pic.....it's gonna be a little while tough.....Dinner time! Are you thinking it may be possible to adjust this much difference??

borland

I think PorKen means..... first torque the cam sprocket bolt, then remove the tool and photo the slots.

Isn't this the wrong tool for the job? I mean, how does the PorKen tool replace the WSM method? I see nothing about using the tool to replace the WSM method in the PorKen tool manual, it only prescribes making advance/retard settings from initial factory settings.

Been away for awhile, am I missing something ????

Jack Riffle

OK, The pic would be un- seeable without the bolt in the slot to illustrate the position......and from the looks of it, maybe I can adjust it correctly.

the flyin' scotsman

I think someone installed the belt wrong and tried to correct the prob with moving the cams.

With the crank at TDC #1 can you take a pic of the cams without Kens tool...............like to see a starting point.

SeanR

If the notches in the cam are lined up with the TDC mark, then the gears were installed correctly, unless there is no woodruf key there.

From the last pictures, it looks like the cams gears are adjusted wrong on the cam. Move the cams and you should be ok.

They are installed at the bottom end of the adjustment, move 'em and I think things will be correct.

Jack Riffle

OK, I held the needle directly above the cam gear mark to show how well it lines up with the mark on the back of the timing belt cover. This is the driver side, but the passenger side is just as good. The crank is at 0/T. Now, I didn't put this belt on and I don't know who did, or even when, but I do know that I would have tried to do it exactly like they did, if I was to do it.