Dan87951

Sorry to hear about your frustrations. Spending that kind of money on a supercharger kit is nothing to bark over. It’s unfortunate about the missing parts. I do want to point out though installing one of these kits on a 20 year old car cannot be a rush job. You should be a little reasonable with yourself and allow ample time for a perfect running car. Unfortunately every car’s state of tune is different especially being 20+ years old now so simply bolting this kit on and expecting a perfect running specimen doesn’t seem possible. Every performance kit I have bought has always required some type of fine tuning. Good Luck with kit. I’m actually sitting on the side lines because I’m curious how this all turns out. From what I hear these guys are great to deal with.

Kevin Michael

M y 2cents. Both Tim and Konstantinin are great guys and for those without the whole story don't jump on either because you will look foolish. K talked to me about this at Hershey and he has legit gripes. Tim WILL straighten this out of that I am sure. I as well had the surging overheating problem as well. Guys you can't rule out the fan as compared to stock because the SC compresses alot of air and that air is damn hot. Will affect engine temp for sure. My car never moved off 5/8 on the guage since I owned it after the kit 3rd line +. Guess what? New Spall pusher up front and I run at the 2nd line now. Also checked with pyro. The surging was solved in my car by many different adjustments of the charge tube that runs into the Maf boot(elbow.) Ihave found that too far in and the thing stumbles under load and surges. Welded 6 small beads around the leading edge, inserted 3/4 inch , clamped her down and it went away for the most part.( I shoved back in far for testing and symptoms returned BTW) The issue is completely gone after my intercooler install. You'll need to think about that one! Anyway Bill, don't go tearing everything apart looking for the "fix". I did all that and it cost me another 3.5-4 grand. My car now idles as stock pulls strong to the red and doesn't miss a beat. Believe me others have had this exact scenario after an install, but they seem quiet on this. All this being said we all owe Tim a thankyou for even making this stuff available.
Kevin

Shmurzik

Good morning to all,

I would like to point out (once again) that my gripe is with the way delivery of the kit has been handled. And I don’t think anybody has put froth a convincing argument stating that things went the way they were supposed to. The kit was delayed and arrived incomplete. That’s it.

Everything else – the age of the car, its mileage, condition, etc – I am very well aware of and temper my expectations accordingly. Same goes for planning a long-range trip, I know there are pitfalls. As for calling Tim – I didn’t have his number and while most of you assumed that I did, I assumed that I wouldn’t need to call – Tim knows what’s what and things would be handled well. Well, so much for assumptions.

The only question that I think can be argued about is whether or not it was a good idea to publish my complaints. I think so. Tim has a very good reputation and in this case it’s only fair that he lives up to it. And if this thread will help him avoid these issues in the future (since it appears Bill and I will be on our own at least until Wednesday) then, in my opinion, it was worth it. Time will tell. I am off to the airport. Thank you and enjoy your weekend.

Sab

having installed a supercharger kit myself a few years back with Andy Keel, I would have advised you not to make any plans for long distance trips right after. I am sure everyone that installed one of these semi production kits has had a few issues to resolve.
I my case everything went smooth but the power steering belt would move and eat into the radiator hose for quite some time. That was real fun stuff...
I think if you want production stuff, you will not get what you are looking for on a 20 year old 928 and a supercharger kit.

If your post is to get help and results to do your trip, I would not vent frustration towards the guys that can make it work.

As for the fan issue, I just recently saw some very nice looking electric fan assemblies at the local auto parts store. They looked just like the Maserati fans that are sold for the supercharger installs...

Hope it all works out, you still have some time.

I still have no transmission... talk about some frustrating ordeal...

Bill Ball

That's what's puzzling - the car had about the best idle properties I've seen...before the SC. Konstantin left this car here about a year ago. I've driven it periodically, often right after reconnecting the battery from storage. Most S4s run a bit off until the LH adapts - not this one. So, the surge is very unexpected. Still I will swap in another MAF I have, but I'm having a hard time blaming the car.

An I incorrect in thinking that the SC really should not be doing anything at idle and low speed cruise? There is a blow-off valve. With tons of vacuum at idle it appears to be working.

It would be interesting to remove the FMU - it's not needed at idle and slow speed anyway.

It would be interesting to disconnect the intake after the blower.

Bill Ball

Kenin:

Thanks for posting your experience. I seem to recall a note long ago about not seating the boot all the way. Of course I made sure everything was fit down as far as can be. It sounds very odd, but turbulence at the MAF entrance from the nearby 90 degree bend and the change from a smaller diameter runner to the MAF has been reported with other modifications to the intake unrelated to an SC install. Thanks for reminding me. I'll fiddle with that.

I'm not sure yet what to conclude about the need for an auxiliary fan. While the intake for the SC obstructs the middle of the radiator and the fans only pull from the sides, the car should not overheat cruising on the freeway on a cool day regardless. I am going to do some experiements with the SC belt off and intake feed disconnected to isolate that.

Thanks again.

Bill Ball

OK, here is my preliminary look at the idle surge issue.

1. Checked the idle switch - OK

2. Pulled and plugged the vacuum to the blow-off valve (per Tim) - no change.

3. Checked blow-off valve function - it is bleeding off air at idle, although it's such a small orifice, the bleed is not much, but that's the way they work.

4. Disconnected the blower output tube, removing the blower from the system - no change. Man, it pushes a lot of air at idle! So, this isolates the problem down to the MAF area.

5. Pulled the intake boot to the MAF off - idle smooth as butter.

So, this car, like Kevin's, has a problem with the turbulence created by the boot going from 3" to 3-1/2" in a few inches while making a 90 degree turn. I'm not sure what to do. See the picture below. Note the cross-section changes from less than 2-1/2" ID to 3-1/2" ID in a matter of a few inches. It would be better if these transitions were further away from the MAF, but the transition in the diameter of the aluminum tube is not the issue as the car still surges with it removed - it's the boot. Why some have surging and others do not is a bit puzzling, but I can tell you this car has extremely high vacuum - it is sealed tight as a drum intake-wise. I put my hand gently over the boot inlet and my skin was almost pulled off. George's does not surge but the has an intercooler in the path and I think the boot has a larger inlet. The aluminum piping in this new Stage 1 kit is different from the older kits too.

I will try another MAF. The boot really needs to be seated fully and clamped hard to stay on under boost. SUGGESTIONS? I'm hoping I can isolate the overheat issue this easily!

Fabio421

Bill, al local guy ( Tampa 928 ) had a similar problem and what he found was that the hard pipe was pushed too far into the rubber boot. Try pulling it out a little and see if that makes a difference in the turbulence.

Bill Ball

I doubt that will help as it surges when the pipe is completely removed and just the boot is on, but truth is stranger than fiction, so I WILL try it. THANKS!

BACK....
Nope, that didn't do it. I only partially seated the boot and it still surged. I connected the intake tube but left it only slightly inserted and the surge was just as bad. I'm about ready to go to Home Depot and look for a consistent 3-1/2" elbow and try to get rid of the abrupt ID transition in the elbow and see if that helps.

the flyin' scotsman

Bill............are the screens on the MAF?

Perhaps if you remove them the turbulence will be lessend.

RyanPerrella

or at least remove the lower screen

Kevin Michael

Bill, I got rid of the thick t-bolt clamp for that connection, then installed two much thinner worm drives. That boot has not come loose even under WOT at 12 psi! Used to pop off regularly. My idle is dead nuts and no surging after I installed the intercooler. The reason as far as I can tell is the IC creates a restriction there before the maf boot and delivers a smoother charge into the boot. Who knows? But it and runs perfect and hasn't 1 year before that mod. Any how when you rev it I bet it almost stalls for a second then catches as well. Its all about that boot IMO. I took one of our late friend Scott mohr's friends out for a hard romp around Gettysburg, and he said it idled and ran better than any 928 he'd been in, and this wasn't the case a month ago! Good luck Bill, and there's probably nothing wrong with K's car, you need to work the bugs out of the kit.
Kevin

Kevin Michael

Battery disconnect with the pipe off and then run it?

hacker-pschorr

This sums things up quite well:
You started a thread bashing someone you have never dealt with??

As for this:
I doubt you care but you are in the minotirty on this one.


If I were Tim I would offer you a full refund and walk away from this deal.
The amount of time that goes into every kit and in some cases going above and beyond the call of duty (is Tampa around) this type of grief makes the whole process not worth it.

This is a very small community that regularly goes out of its way to help each other. A simple phone call to Tim would have cleared everything up pretty quick. Insted you start a public thread dragging multiple people needlessly through the mud.

JKelly

It sounds like you planned ahead with plenty of time to have a supercharger installed and working properly before SITM.

2-3 week turn around time.
Charged immediately.
Multiple photos of "Superchargers and Intercoolers in Stock" on Carl's website.
Could be a little misleading to a customer who planned for a 2-3 week turn around time.

2 months after initial purchase, the kit arrives.

All legitimate complaints:
Kit arrived late = screwed up the plans for SITM
Kit is modified = not what the buyer paid for
Kit with no instructions = how is a person supposed to install it?
Kit with no aux fan = important item missing

Buyer should have definitely been notified of the supercharger swap.
Maybe that is why the kit ran so late, and without instructions?

Rennlist is the place to find help; you just have to skip the counterattack posts from those who can't sympathize and/or don't bother to closely read into the initial post.

Bill has always been da' Man.
Trying to troubleshoot a hot running problem, under pressure from a completion date, with a fan missing that should have been there, would be frustrating.

Agreed.
How many years has this kit been evolving towards perfection now?
Is it still considered a "Murph" kit with the different style supercharger, or is this a "beta" kit again?

It really burns me every time I see someone get jumped on for venting a little frustration through posting a legitimate complaint. The plan for a supercharger install was made way ahead of SITM and the money spent. What other responsibility does the customer have at that point?

I'd be beyond furious.