Is my shark ever gonna run?!?!?!?!?!
#17
Drifting
Originally Posted by M. Requin
Best way to anneal copper is to heat it to red and then quench it in water. Makes it very malleable and doesn't burn holes in the floor.
#18
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Capt. Earl and I had the same problem when we swapped out the fuel pump and filter on my '88 right before I headed out across country in it.
We ended up going to the local auto parts store and buying a bunch of new crush washers. Of course when we installed it again, it still leaked!
Then just for the hell of it, we used two of the crush washers, and it did the trick. We didn't use an excessive amount of torque on it, but did tighten it down more then you would think is necesarry.
That was about 3 mths ago and no leaks since.
We ended up going to the local auto parts store and buying a bunch of new crush washers. Of course when we installed it again, it still leaked!
Then just for the hell of it, we used two of the crush washers, and it did the trick. We didn't use an excessive amount of torque on it, but did tighten it down more then you would think is necesarry.
That was about 3 mths ago and no leaks since.
#19
Originally Posted by RngTrtl
I believe this is wrong. Annealing is the heating of a metal and then cooling the metal slowly. The process makes the metal softer...If the metal is quenched while it is still hot, this makes the metal more brittle.
#21
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Truly a pain in the a$$!
I didn't have a real torch either so I just went to a Porsche mechanic here in Toronto Ontario, he couldn't find any of the copper ones in his shop so he gave me 3 alluminum ones and said "these will work just the same as the copper ones". By the looks of the cars he was carring for I believed him.
Went home tightend them up (not to tight!!) tightened till it stopped leaking while the car was running. My experience with over tightning the first time made me very cautious of doing it a second time round!
Haven't looked back...yet.
Good luck!
Troy
86.5 A/T
I didn't have a real torch either so I just went to a Porsche mechanic here in Toronto Ontario, he couldn't find any of the copper ones in his shop so he gave me 3 alluminum ones and said "these will work just the same as the copper ones". By the looks of the cars he was carring for I believed him.
Went home tightend them up (not to tight!!) tightened till it stopped leaking while the car was running. My experience with over tightning the first time made me very cautious of doing it a second time round!
Haven't looked back...yet.
Good luck!
Troy
86.5 A/T
#22
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Originally Posted by RngTrtl
I believe this is wrong. Annealing is the heating of a metal and then cooling the metal slowly. The process makes the metal softer...If the metal is quenched while it is still hot, this makes the metal more brittle.
The copper will maintain it's soft crystal structure after annealing at any realistic cooling rate (from very slow like letting fire die down to fast like throwing it in a bucket of water). Generally, I would suggest water cooling to prevent excessive oxidation of the surface. Steel (iron + carbon) on the other hand will change it's properties dramatically upon rapid cooling . However, it is possible to cool copper fast enough to make it into a brittle material. This normally involves cooling rates of greater than 10 million degrees C per second which can only be obtained by spraying a very thin film on to a very cold surface (this equipment is very expensive).
#23
Race Director
Thread Starter
Update
I went and bought some new copper crush washers from the local auto parts store...but I do not like them...not the same quality at the washers I get from 928intl.....
Good news is the fuel pump runs nice and quiet..smooth too....& the new washers did not leak....the bad news is the I found the leak.....the damm fuel line from the pump to the filter....I guess my "tighten the hell outta it" theory doesn't work so well.....it leaks right at the seam....take a look at the pic....so new parts are on order AGAIN
I went and bought some new copper crush washers from the local auto parts store...but I do not like them...not the same quality at the washers I get from 928intl.....
Good news is the fuel pump runs nice and quiet..smooth too....& the new washers did not leak....the bad news is the I found the leak.....the damm fuel line from the pump to the filter....I guess my "tighten the hell outta it" theory doesn't work so well.....it leaks right at the seam....take a look at the pic....so new parts are on order AGAIN
#24
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I thought mine was leaking there, but it proved to be a loose check valve. I had cranked on the endcap but the checkvalve itself needed more tightening.
#25
Question for the experts out there. How do you back up the pump when tightening the fittings. I think it would be easy to snap off one of the little towers if I used one of them for leverage. I ended up using my 3/8 impact gun with the air pressure turned down way low. This was successful for me. What have others done?
#26
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I ended up cutting away part of the claws on a medium sized slip joint plier so I could grip the center of the pump end while clearing the post.
#27
Originally Posted by G Man
Question for the experts out there. How do you back up the pump when tightening the fittings. I think it would be easy to snap off one of the little towers if I used one of them for leverage. I ended up using my 3/8 impact gun with the air pressure turned down way low. This was successful for me. What have others done?
Pad your vise jaws with cloth or neoprene/rubber, & use it to hold the pump. IIRC, the nuts take a 19mm or 17mm (both?) wrench. Use an open end wrench on the inner nut/fitting & take the outer banjo off with a socket and breaker. I didn't have to take the inner fitting off the old pump as my new (used) pump came with inner fitting in place. Not certain if a brand new pump does.
When installing the banjo fitting on the new pump, use the vise to (gently) hold the pipe and pump. I used a piece of wood on either side of the pipe to secure it when the jaws were closed, then clamped the vise jaws across the seam at top of pump.
Hawkeyes
#28
Race Director
Thread Starter
The WSM torque spec for both the check valve (17mm) and nut that holds it all together (19mm) are both 14ftlbs......I used the highly accurate "I'll hold it in my hands why you crank on it" techinque.....which wouldn't click the torque wrench which only goes down to 20ftlbs....so its probably pretty close....
I am confident it is leaking at that seam because I saw bubble spraying out of it for quite a while after the pump stopped running, since that is where the peak pressure is held....the good part is the other copper washers were holding just fiine and not leaking.....I thought about replacing that part anyway since the end that goes into the fuel filter is kinda chewed up from the PITA we had removing it a couple months ago...now I'm really kicking myself for not ordering it!
Hawkeyes
Be very careful with the outer housing of the pump....I heard that if you put too much pressure on the outside of the pump you will crack the housing, causing a massive leak....which would really suck on a brand new pump!
I am confident it is leaking at that seam because I saw bubble spraying out of it for quite a while after the pump stopped running, since that is where the peak pressure is held....the good part is the other copper washers were holding just fiine and not leaking.....I thought about replacing that part anyway since the end that goes into the fuel filter is kinda chewed up from the PITA we had removing it a couple months ago...now I'm really kicking myself for not ordering it!
Hawkeyes
Be very careful with the outer housing of the pump....I heard that if you put too much pressure on the outside of the pump you will crack the housing, causing a massive leak....which would really suck on a brand new pump!
#29
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I took a similar approach with mine, though it's a different setup. The banjo on the pump goes to a rubber line straight to the secondary pump. I used a somewhat large slipjoint plier, with a piece of leather wrapped around the banjo and using the claw area. I didn't have to tighten it much though -- spec was 14 ft/lb and the pliers were plenty to hang onto it with.
#30
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I am confident it is leaking at that seam because I saw bubble spraying out of it for quite a while after the pump stopped running.