Dan87951

When removing the bolts out of the waterpump I had 4 broken ones. I had been slowly spraying WD40 on the bolts for the past 2 weeks trying to get them to soak so I would not have broken waterpump bolts but it seems it didnt help. I guess what do I do now? Can I still remove the waterpump with the broken bolts in there as the heads of the bolts are broken off so it should slide over them, right?? Or will I have to drill them out than remove the waterpump? I tried removing the waterpump a little bit but boy it wouldn't budge. Just my luck I get 4 broken ones. I must have did something to anger the Porsche gods..

AO

It should come off. There are two pins that locate the WP and two little tabs that you can GENTLY pry against. Once the pump is off, spray some PB Blaster or Kroil ont he 4 broken bolts. Let soak for another day or two and remove with a vice grips. Hopefully they won't give you any more issues.

Garth S

A rolled foot pry bar ( a smaller ~7" version) as shown in the bottom of the pic is a easy way to lift the pump off its dowel pins ... and break the gasket seal if it had been glued down. This will not damage the block.
After following Andrew's advice to use a real penetrant, you might wish to gently run a M6 tap/chase into the holes to clean up the threads. Reassemble with antiseize paste ....

leperboy

That stinks, but it's not the record. I think I read of five here. I didn't have any, but I had some other siezed bolts, and helped with another WP where there were a couple.

The water pump can probably be taken off now, but you need to slowly rock it top to bottom. If you have any play at all doing that, just keep doing it and the water pump will eventually slide off.

Andrew had good advice on how to get the old bolts out with vice-grips. If that doesn't work, get some reverse (left-handed drill bits and try to drill the bolts out. This works well, just use a drill bit small enough that it won't score the block, and also work very slowly. Finally, you may want to pull the radiator to do this in order to give yourself more space.

Matt

Mike Frye

+1 (since everything has to be drained anyway) your knuckles and radiator may thank you for not banging the former into the latter as well. BTDT and it smarts. I was actually glad it was my hand that hit the rad instead of a wrench, my hand healed, the rad wouldn't have.

Dan87951

Waterpump is off. Man I don't think it has ever been removed!!

jpitman2

i BROKE ONE BOLT DOING MINE, but pump came off ok. penetrant, and tapping the bolt ends can help to break the corrosion's grip. Definitely clean the bolck threads up afterwards, and use new bolts.
jp 83 Euro S AT 50k

Bill Ball

Porsche does not call for it to be replaced with the TB so it is common to find original pumps on dealer serviced cars.

Garth S

If the rad is left in, it has long been recommended to cover it with a sheet of cardboard .... this has saved many knuckles and rads ....

GregBBRD

Those broken bolts can be really tough to get out. We can get them out and use the original hole (without an insert) about 75% of the time. The absolute best results we get is to weld a nut onto the end of the broken "stud" (after the head breaks off....it is a stud) with a "hot" mig welder. The heat that goes into the stud seems to loosen them up and the nut then allows you to have something to turn the stud out with. You can actually do this when the stud is broken off flush with the block....as a matter of fact, the closer it is broken off, the better this technique works! Heating the aluminum around the broken stud rarely does any good....although there is the rare case. You have to be really blessed to get a stud out with vice grips. First of all, there is rarely enough stud to get the vice grips onto. Second of all, the studs are usually stuck way to hard for the vice grips to turn them. If the vice grips work...then you should not have broken the bolt off in the first place. Never use an air tool to remove these bolts. The quick movement of the air tool doesn't allow the bolt to "break" loose from the sticky threads and you will break off bolts way more often!

Everybody that replaces a water pump should use new hardware...we do EVERY time. You need 5 20mm bolts and 8 25mm bolts (6mm x 1.0). Make sure all of the threaded holes in the block are clean....use a tap only if necessary. A quick thread chaser can be made from a new bolt. Cut a "notch" down the length of the stud with a grinder. This will clean the threads and is not as abusive on the threads as a tap will be. Use the factory anti-sieze on the bolts. It is world class and puts everything else out there (that we can get in this country) to shame! Always use a factory water pump gasket. Most of the gaskets that come with the pumps are bad. They are more porous than the factory gasket and allow the water to seep into the gasket, which rusts the bolts....which makes them break off. We throw the gasket that comes with the rebuilt pumps into the trash can.

When you are absolutely convinced that the stud is not going to come out....that's when you need some tricks......but I'm too tired to get into this. If you get to this point, I'll tell you some of the really slick secrets.

gb

SteveG

Gregg: +1. I think Gregg covered it. There are several threads here on bolt removal. If you end up with unusable threads, I have used Timeserts. Depends on the location and room, it is a sleeve threaded into the enlarged hole and tapped. It is about $50 for a kit but you will not have mis matched bolt sizes.

Bill Ball

Greg: Thanks for the tips! The slotted bolt as a thread chaser and the reason to use a Porsche gasket were new to me. When you're not so tired, a quick rundown of the really slick secrets for broken bolt removal would sure be appreciated.

It would be good if our favored parts suppliers would put a Porsche gasket in there rebuilt WP kits rather than the ones which you are recommending we discard.

dr bob

My "favored parts vendor" is probably the same one Greg supports. While 928 Int'l doesn't have direct control over what gasket the rebuilder supplies in the box, Jim B. recommended the factory gasket as part of the TB/WP Care Package he assembled for me. These are the reasons to use our expert vendors-- they save me (and you!) a lot of time and aggravation. Sometimes a part may be found for slightly less shopping around, but the extra service more than makes up for any pennies I think I might save elsewhere. Plus, that 'shopping around' time is valuable too!

Ditto the tips from Greg. I think the world's record on broken bolts is 7, in one of the t-belt day cars here a year or so ago. Keith W managed to get 5 of tyhem out with Vise-Grips and penetrant, but the others took a lot more coaxing with the drill. One needed an insert.


WD-40 is far from the top of the list of effective solutions to stuck bolts. It's a solvent with a little oil mixed in. No chemicals to release corrosion, the real cause of the bolts sticking in the block. Find some KROIL, or some PB Blaster to use on them. Unfortunately, spraying the heads of them prior to removal doesn't do much except right where the bolt heads seat on the face of the pump. This points to Greg's recommendation for using anti-sieze on the threads. It will reward you in buckets the next time you are in there.


I was in a power plant in Florida the last few weeks, supporting their spring maintenance outage. One of the mechanics had a really slick broken-bolt extractor kit, a stepped left-handed drill setup with a threaded expander collar that follows the drill into the hole. As it engages the bolt, the collar threads in and expands to grab it and extract it all in one effort. I'm trying to get some in smaller sizes; they do have one for 5/16" bolts in the kit (same as 8mm) but we need a 1/4"/6mm kit for WP bolts. I watched them use the bigger ones (1"+) on some steam turbine casing studs and they worked amazingly well. Of course, that's with a big magnet-based drill press mounted over the studs, but it would be fine with an angle drill in our wimpy little toy water pump bolts. The high-pressure steam turbine casing runs at over 1000F, so there's a big chance that the casing studs will break off.

Dan87951

WHere can I get PB Blaster?

leperboy

Any auto parts store should have it. If not, try an Ace Hardware or Home Depot.

Matt