Best method for removing carbon from valves, cylinder heads and pistons? (lapping)
10-13-2006, 01:51 PM
#31
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Too late i know but for the next candidates this is my little contribution.
About the grinding compound, it's more than 100% sure that you have to clean seriously the valves and every part which has been in contact with it. The grinding stuff contained in it is not dissapearing but simply becoming smaller and smaller and even in this smooth like form, it is still agressive for brass or aluminium.
prussian blue stuff is right but as you are there there's a way to know if the valves are correctly closing and are airtight is to close the valve, put some petrol in the admission or exhaust duct for each valve, one after the other and let the petrol stay in it 5 minutes for each. If the valve is not right closing or not airtight, then you will see some petrol first making the valve wet on the piston side, after that you should see a petrol drop.
If petrol drop appear then you can try to use the compound again or check with some mechanic shop so they can clean and give again the right angles to the seat, often this implies a new valve if damaged.
About the carbon, in the Liquid Moly stuff there is mix of ammoniac (take care this is very dangerous for lungers, brain, skin, hands, eyes) and probably some other stuff but it cleans for real the f* carbon crap without pulling metal from parts.
About the grinding compound, it's more than 100% sure that you have to clean seriously the valves and every part which has been in contact with it. The grinding stuff contained in it is not dissapearing but simply becoming smaller and smaller and even in this smooth like form, it is still agressive for brass or aluminium.
prussian blue stuff is right but as you are there there's a way to know if the valves are correctly closing and are airtight is to close the valve, put some petrol in the admission or exhaust duct for each valve, one after the other and let the petrol stay in it 5 minutes for each. If the valve is not right closing or not airtight, then you will see some petrol first making the valve wet on the piston side, after that you should see a petrol drop.
If petrol drop appear then you can try to use the compound again or check with some mechanic shop so they can clean and give again the right angles to the seat, often this implies a new valve if damaged.
About the carbon, in the Liquid Moly stuff there is mix of ammoniac (take care this is very dangerous for lungers, brain, skin, hands, eyes) and probably some other stuff but it cleans for real the f* carbon crap without pulling metal from parts.
11-17-2006, 01:43 AM
#32
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Update on this,
I finally found this Berrymans carbcleaner sold in .75 gallon cans. $20.00 tells me it better work.
WOW, this stuff is amazing. I was using xylene as i read this is a common chemical in carb cleaners. But this didnt do crap! I was scrubbing the heck ouf of my pistons to get this to come off. For comparison, I put 4 pistons and rods in a bucket with the berrymans and within an hour all the oil varnish on the sides of the pistons was gone, as was the carbon buildup on the skirts in between the rings!
For carbon removal off the piston tops, i used a 2" fine wire brush on a mini die grinder, on low rpm to break up the carbon. The only area's left with carbon are the valve reliefs on the pistons. But some gentle scrubbing with the berrymans is working very well.
Thanks Bill for the suggestion, took me awhile to find this stuff, and at one point i had resigned myself to thinking this stuff just isnt sold in CA. But i found it at the local Autozone, it was probably there all along, but i never noticed it.
Great stuff, no agitation needed it just eats up all the junk on everything ive put in it.
I finally found this Berrymans carbcleaner sold in .75 gallon cans. $20.00 tells me it better work.
WOW, this stuff is amazing. I was using xylene as i read this is a common chemical in carb cleaners. But this didnt do crap! I was scrubbing the heck ouf of my pistons to get this to come off. For comparison, I put 4 pistons and rods in a bucket with the berrymans and within an hour all the oil varnish on the sides of the pistons was gone, as was the carbon buildup on the skirts in between the rings!
For carbon removal off the piston tops, i used a 2" fine wire brush on a mini die grinder, on low rpm to break up the carbon. The only area's left with carbon are the valve reliefs on the pistons. But some gentle scrubbing with the berrymans is working very well.
Thanks Bill for the suggestion, took me awhile to find this stuff, and at one point i had resigned myself to thinking this stuff just isnt sold in CA. But i found it at the local Autozone, it was probably there all along, but i never noticed it.
Great stuff, no agitation needed it just eats up all the junk on everything ive put in it.
11-17-2006, 03:10 PM
#33
Ryan, where did you get the berrymans? I need to disassemble a block.
11-17-2006, 03:43 PM
#34
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Autozone, your funny, i mentioned it in the post. LOL
It was on the top shelf, and of course i was looking for something else entirely when i found it. Of course as always they didnt have what i really came there for. But getting the carbcleaner was a good compromise.
Literally within an hour all the oil varnish was gone on the pistons. Previously i spent about 30-40 minutes on each piston scrubbing the skirts and still couldnt get all the varnish off the pistons. I wouldnt suggest any other chemical either. The xylene i used was pretty worthless for this. Teh berrymans is a little messy its thicker stuff, not oil thick but it leaves a film which comes off in running water. I'll post some pics later.
It was on the top shelf, and of course i was looking for something else entirely when i found it. Of course as always they didnt have what i really came there for. But getting the carbcleaner was a good compromise.
Literally within an hour all the oil varnish was gone on the pistons. Previously i spent about 30-40 minutes on each piston scrubbing the skirts and still couldnt get all the varnish off the pistons. I wouldnt suggest any other chemical either. The xylene i used was pretty worthless for this. Teh berrymans is a little messy its thicker stuff, not oil thick but it leaves a film which comes off in running water. I'll post some pics later.
11-17-2006, 03:47 PM
#35
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Also, if your going to clean the blocks and heads, buy 4 or more cans of this stuff. I cant tell yet if it evaporates quickly, i leave mine covered. But i imagine you could drop your heads in a large bucket come back in a couple hours and they look new. I wish i found this stuff a month ago when i was cleaning my heads. I would have done this. Also if you have enough of the stuff and something large enough to contain it, throw the whole block in and let it sit, scrub the areas the water line dosent get to and it would look great i imagine.
This stuff has a metalic shine to it, its hard to describe what it is, almost looks like tiny metal particles suspended in it. So i suggest you really wash whatever you dip in the stuff.
This stuff has a metalic shine to it, its hard to describe what it is, almost looks like tiny metal particles suspended in it. So i suggest you really wash whatever you dip in the stuff.
11-17-2006, 04:12 PM
#36
I wonder if I could get enough to submerge the whole head.
11-17-2006, 04:17 PM
#37
Drifting
Originally Posted by RyanPerrella
For carbon removal off the piston tops, i used a 2" fine wire brush on a mini die grinder, on low rpm to break up the carbon. The only area's left with carbon are the valve reliefs on the pistons.
11-17-2006, 04:40 PM
#38
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
yeah i wouldnt suggest a die grinder and wheel brush for piston tops while in the block, you maybe able to if you rotated each piston to the top then tried it. Otherwise you risk serious damage to the bores.
For dipping the heads, get enough to fill it halfway up the heads, put them in one way, then flip them over. When i did this i used gasoline and i used 4 gallons of it. I still had to scrub the heck ouf of the ports and they ports are still stained although the large carbon chunks are now gone. I will probably go at the heads again with the berrymans now that ive got it.
For dipping the heads, get enough to fill it halfway up the heads, put them in one way, then flip them over. When i did this i used gasoline and i used 4 gallons of it. I still had to scrub the heck ouf of the ports and they ports are still stained although the large carbon chunks are now gone. I will probably go at the heads again with the berrymans now that ive got it.
11-17-2006, 05:54 PM
#39
I'm actually excited. I love engine work.
11-17-2006, 06:01 PM
#41
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Originally Posted by RyanPerrella
Update on this,
I finally found this Berrymans carbcleaner sold in .75 gallon cans. $20.00 tells me it better work.
Thanks Bill for the suggestion, took me awhile to find this stuff, and at one point i had resigned myself to thinking this stuff just isnt sold in CA. But i found it at the local Autozone, it was probably there all along, but i never noticed it.
Great stuff, no agitation needed it just eats up all the junk on everything ive put in it.
I finally found this Berrymans carbcleaner sold in .75 gallon cans. $20.00 tells me it better work.
Thanks Bill for the suggestion, took me awhile to find this stuff, and at one point i had resigned myself to thinking this stuff just isnt sold in CA. But i found it at the local Autozone, it was probably there all along, but i never noticed it.
Great stuff, no agitation needed it just eats up all the junk on everything ive put in it.
11-17-2006, 07:23 PM
#42
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
Bill
Funny you mentioned that, i was debating on how to keep the valves sorted when dipping them. I thought about getting some plastic tags or something but some thin wire wrapped around sounds like it would work fine, i didnt want to just stand them up, i figured at some point the can would get kicked or knocked around and they would fall down and i would never get the order right again.
Funny you mentioned that, i was debating on how to keep the valves sorted when dipping them. I thought about getting some plastic tags or something but some thin wire wrapped around sounds like it would work fine, i didnt want to just stand them up, i figured at some point the can would get kicked or knocked around and they would fall down and i would never get the order right again.
11-17-2006, 07:30 PM
#43
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I just strung them together in a long wire chain with some indication of which end was which and which part of the chain went in which row of valves written down on a notepad.
11-17-2006, 07:44 PM
#44
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I posted this a while back
FYI......... If you need to clean off carbon I bought some carberator cleaner from Wal-Mart. I don't remember the brand (don't think it matters) 97 cents per can! Worked great on the pistons,intake and exhaust manifold carbon during my rebuild. I bought a case! I know if you had carbon on your exhaust tips or anywhere else it would tackle that with ease.
FYI......... If you need to clean off carbon I bought some carberator cleaner from Wal-Mart. I don't remember the brand (don't think it matters) 97 cents per can! Worked great on the pistons,intake and exhaust manifold carbon during my rebuild. I bought a case! I know if you had carbon on your exhaust tips or anywhere else it would tackle that with ease.
