lorenolson888

Well, I have been hunting for a ticking/knocking noise...

With a stechoscope I can hear it almost everywhere... I could hear very clearly at the tstat housing which made me wonderif it wasn't the water pump... but I think these sounds travel well through the cooling system

Now I am back to thinkig it is a lifter... Pretty sure it is just one... I exported this .wav from a video I took with my camera.

When I slowed the sounds file down I can count about 6 knocks per second... which is half the speed of the crank... it is a little faster when the engine is cold (like 7 knock per second)

Rislone did not seem to work...

I can hear more chain noise in the drivers head. The knocking sound seems louder on the drivers side.

So that pretty much means removing the cams? which pretty much requires removal of the timing belt system... and lifters seem to be pretty expensive

I think I need a beer...

LO

ZEUS+

Before you start thinking big$,check your oil check valves.

lorenolson888

Hi Zues,

are these in the oil line with the banjo bolts...

The car makes the noise when hot or cold... but I don't know if that means anything

Do you think the check valves may be the problem? Do they leak or clog? Is there a way to check?

Thansk,

Loren

Bill Ball

If it is a single sound per cam revolution, it would be a single lifter, and you should be able to locate it. Since you couldn't locate it, it's not a lifter. It's not the water pump either, as it is not the same period as the cam. The cam tensioner/chain is possible.

ZEUS+

They are in the head accessed after valve cover removed.They become sticky and clog.Only a suggestion.Tough to diagnose from the recording.Seems deeper than a lifter.

Dannyfumi

Loren,
I have an 85, and in the middle of the same process! What I found on my car was the chain tensioner was not functioninf correctly. Now the 85-86 32V models have the oil check valve, as you stated is the upper bolt on the J-tube, I tried to replace that valve, but NLA from any source! Also when I replaced chain tensioner it superceded to new tensioner with new size banjo bolts! So its been 30 days and still sorting out, hope that helps.

Dan Gates
Frisco, Tx

lorenolson888

Hi Dan...

yeah that helps... maybe I should go Jump...

Wow... not available... that hurts... maybe I will remove it and check it out. Is there a way to clean it out? Is there a way to check it.. the cam covers are off righ now... I am looking at the tube as I write this.

The sounds seems to be a little quieter after warm up but the sound is still there..

In the zip file I have stored a cold sound file and a warm soundfile.. you can hear that it is a little softer and slower after warmup...

The sound does seem deeper... but the fact that the frequency of the knock is half the crank speed suggests a cylinder head issue...

I am at least happy to be narrowing the serach down... with the help of local friends and the list...

LO

lorenolson888

Hi Bill,

Not sure how to locate the one bad lifter... I have not really tried... is there a way to locate it...

BTW you had me and my wife crying last night when I read your reply about the 1/2 of 1% chance of water pump failure...

Maybe I could have you come by and take a look.. the cam covers are off... the cams are still in... is there a way to locate it... they all look the same to me... nice and shiny...

I would like to do anything I can to locate it .. If I could isolate it to one particular cylinder than I would feel that it is O.K. to loosen the TB and start pulling the cams out.... but I want to ID it before that if possible...

THanks,

LO

Bill Ball

Loren: The noise should track louder to one cylinder. With the covers off, of course, no. You have narrowed it down to one side. This isn't the typical rattle of the cam chain tensioner either.
http://www.nichols.nu/tip578.htm
So, may still be a lifter that needs location via additional careful listening with a mechanics' stethoscope and a rubber hose.

lorenolson888

I wish I could record the sound from the stethoscope...so I could listen to it over and over...

THe cam cover is not that hard to put back on.... maybe I will do that... but it was hard to tell any differences...

Edit, Bill I just read that thread...about the oiling plugs....

I am not sure whatthey are taling about but it does sound like I should take a look as my car is an early 32 valve....

LO

Bill Ball

Try listening on the sides of the head rather than the cam cover.

lorenolson888

I got her back together Monday and drove a bit.

Listening at the side of the head is hard because of the pipe organ intakes... The intake plenum gets in the way of listening at the cam cover too...

but I did find that listening at the long intake runners is helpful... I think the sounds is loudest at the intake runner of cylinder 6...

At this point I think it is time to just drive it and get a engine to play with on the side...



LO

anonymousagain

Loren, try to make Devek this weekend. During one of Saturday's Tech sessions, I'd bet you could get a strong forum of propeller-heads to help diagnose.

BTW - this ticking noise is different from the louder knocking noise we heard at Bill's a few months back, yes?

Anyway, if you can make Devek, I'll have my stock chips for you as well

jetrainor

Sounds very much like my 87 s4 engine....a knock which i couldn't track down became a worn thrust bearing and the crank lobe was knocking on the journal.....i see however you have a 5 speed which reduces your chance of TBF considerably.

Bill Ball

Ewww. That's scary for us AT owners. Time for me to check the crank endplay again!