jeff jackson

Guys...I am reinstalling the cam belt covers after my TB-WP overhaul and replacement. I have the Center Belt cover back ON...and the Harmonic Balancer. The Large steel pulley that is "sandwiched" between the Harmonic Balancer, and the Black accessory drive belt pulley...doe it matter which way this large steel pulley is mounted ??? There is a small square boss on one side of this pulley, it is approximately 1/4" square, and is NOT keyed to fit the outer Black pulleys mating flange as far as I can tell...Nor is it keyed to fit the Harmonic Balancer's outboard face. So, my question is...does it matter which side of this large, steel single pulley is mated to the Harmonic Balancer ? And is this square boss cast into one side of this pulley, significant in any way ? For those who don't know, car's an 86.5 Engines a M28 / 44....and the engine number is 81G05745

Bill Ball

The square boss on the AC pulley is a balancing weight. I can't see how it matters which way this goes. The pulley is symmetric.

Correct, there are no keys for the accessory pulleys. You've got 218 ft-lbs of bolt torque to hold them. Be sure you get the special washer under the bolt head on correctly.

jeff jackson

Bill...you mean the recess in the special crankbolt washer faces the pulley...and NOT the nut ??? I put it on with the nut inside the recessed area in the washer (I thinK)...Mybe time to take it back of, and check. But, just to be sure...the recessed section of the crankshaft accessory drive belt pulley...faces the pulley flange, and NOT the nut ...Correct ???

Bill Ball

Yes, I think the WSM image close-up shows the washer correctly. The side with the deep recess is facing the pulley. My recollection is that if you put it on backwards things don't cinch up properly.

jeff jackson

All Hail to Bill Ball....you my friend were "Right Again"...(at least I hope so). I indeed had the recess in the washer facing the "Nut side" It just "looked" so obvious...the nut "fits" perfectly inside the "slight recess" in the washer, and the "flat" side of the washer "seemed" a proper mathch to the flat "inner flange" of the pulley, so ...(in this case 2+2 = RONG)...Anyway, I'm glad I posted this Q...before I returned Roger Tyson's flywheel lock, so I can easily remove the crank bolt, and "flip-over" the recessed washer with the recess facing the pulley, and NOT the nut. Thats WHY folks...it PAYS to ask questions for those select few here on the list that have "truly" BTDT... I sure thought from the "looks" of things, that the nut was to "center itself" inside the "recess" in the crank bolt washer...(there I go "thinking "again")...
Thanks Bill...your timely advice has once again become "invaluable". Thanks Bill

WAIT A MINUTE....HOLD THE PHONE...Bill...are you talking about the Air Conditioning Compressor pulley and bolt ????I am talking specifically about the Crankshaft pulley bolt and washer. AND,...the thin single pulley "sandwiched" between the Harmonic Balancer, and the painted Black accessory drive belt pulley mounted to the front of the crankshaft by the aforementioned bolt and cupped washer which is to be torqued to 218#/ft. per the WSM. Please "clarify" your answer if possible...Thanks...Jeff

Bill Ball

You can hang the phone up. No, I'm talking the crank bolt. The AC compressor pulley/clutch assembly has no such washer, but it has other weirdo parts that you have to pay close attention to on removal.

Your thinking about the crank washer got me thinking, but it fits the bolt snugly enough that it needs no such centering. Maybe it makes no big difference, but I thought the wrong way causes problems with the bolt bottoming.

Bill Ball

Oh, I've got another one for you, since you just did the TB/WP....

I've encountered 2 instances now where the low tension warning system wire that passes through the passenger cover came off the spade on the tensioner arm soon after a TB/WP job. It appears that when the tensioner was rebuilt, the spade bolt was loosed and retightened with the spade moved 180 degrees from where it really should be. Instead of being on the backside of the bolt head, it was swung around so it made contact with the inside of the cover. Over time the motion of the arm against the inside of the cover caused the wire connector to work off the spade.

jeff jackson

OK...but was there a question in there somewhere Bill ??? On my car,.. I left the tensioner sensor connector terminal (Male Spade terminal).. as I found it,...Upright, and connected via the screw to the upper end side of the tension roller arm, ... adjacent to the smaller roller. No adjustments were required, or made, to this setup. I DID "break" the grommet, that secures the harness connector through the CENTER Cambelt cover..and replaced the grommet with another I had handy , but... I had to drill it out to provide a proper fit for the "inner' ( inside the center cambelt cover)... TB tension sensor electrical connector, but, all in all, a pretty easy fix. My "Original question had to do with the large "cupped" washer...that is secured by the crankshaft pulley bolt...inside the accessory drive belt pulley...DOES THIS "CUPPED" washer...have the recess...facing the pulley flange....OR, .... Does the recess in this washer, face the Crankshaft Pulley Locknut, .... which is to be "ReTorqued" to 218#/ft. ??? That is what I need to knoow... Thanks Bill for your help.

Jeff

Bill Ball

Oh, I thought I answered that. I was just tossing in a freebie trivia piece not mentioned in the WSM or TB guides that may trip people up who have done the TB.

Anyway, I would reorient the washer the way shown in the WSM with the deep recess to the rear. I believe it has been oriented that way on all the cars I have worked on. That wasn't part of your orginal question either, but it came to mind when you asked about the pulleys.

jeff jackson

Thanks, Bill..if thats what "you" would do...thats good enough for me. Like I said...I could NOT tell by looking....which direction the washer beneath the crank pulley locknut should face, so I thought the best course for an "informed" answer....was to pose this "Q" here. Thsnk goodness for folks like Bill Ball, and ALL you other fellows, that have that "BTDT" experience. Makes a hard job for an "experienced" mechanic, do-able...and for an "inexperienced" mechanic "tryable"..Advice like this, is "priceless'...AS I HAVE checked the WSM, and the reassembly instructions are simply ..."Reverse the Steps Taken in the Disassembly Process".

anonymousagain

Jeff - for what it's worth, I just finished sinching that bolt last weekend (Bill saved me on the lock tool ) and I couldn't find a difference between washer direction; tried both successfully to torque and fitment against pulley and bolt depth. Ended up leaving the recess against the bolt head, 'cause it looked like it made sense, as you said. Bill's right, the 200+ ftlbs is what really counts

jeff jackson

Thanks anonymousagain...thats "exactly" what I did too...I could find no advantage one way o the other, they both torqued evenly, and to the "Elbow Wrenching" 218 #/FT...Thats why I thought to myself....one way or the other, "has" to be right, IT CAN"T be OK, to put this washer in "either direction"...or WHY...would it have the recess on one side of the washer, and NOT the other ??? But...I AM NOT going to let this trivial issue delay the completion of this project, so help me GOD. Bill has NEVER steered me wrong, so I am counting on him one more time, Like taking candy from a baby...

Bill Ball

Glad you tried it both ways. It may not matter, as it seems you concluded. It is clear the washer has two distinct sides. Who knows, I may be misreading the picture in the manual - you have to enlarge it to see the bevel.

Also, flipped the way you guys did it allows for more thread engagement, which is usually a good thing - maybe that is right, but I haven't seen any direct information and cars that had never had a TB done had it the way I did it.

Eh, unless Jim, Wally or Greg come in and make a pronouncement, don't worry about it.

SharkSkin

That washer is probably cupped that way so that the clamping force of tightening the crank bolt is distributed over the crank nose, rather than concentrated near the hole. I believe that the crank nose has a chamfer in the center around the bolt hole, this is not where you want to be clamping the pulleys down.

Bill Ball

Interesting, Dave, and it sounds logical. I can't find anything specific about which way this washer is supposed to go, but recess inward, so the force goes to the periphery is a good rationale. The washer is very hefty, so it appears it may have been designed to tolerate all the force on its edge without deforming. Anyway, that's the way mine is. How about yours?