JOHN D.... READ
08-24-2002, 10:49 PM
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JOHN D.... READ
in your post
<a href="http://forums.rennlist.com/forums/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=004178" target="_blank">http://forums.rennlist.com/forums/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=004178</a>
sflraver said:
[quote]Originally posted by sflraver:
<strong>Go home to Afghanistan you hairy, goat blowing A-Rab. </strong><hr></blockquote>
and then you made a post about winning a 2 year memebership to whoever flamed webersports best.
and you ended up giving him the free 2 year membership for this. i am not upset about him winning, but i AM upset about racist rennlist memebers who post DEMEANING comments about other peoples nationalities.
i dont know what to even ask for? an appology or what? i guess i just want to make this post public and that fact that you ALLOWED this
the rennlist charter at <a href="https://rennlist.com/charter.htm" target="_blank">https://rennlist.com/charter.htm</a>
SPECIFICALLY states:
Rennlist mailing lists will at all times be open to free discussion about Porsche and other automobiles, assuming the discussion is related to the particular list's topic and is not intentionally inflammatory, fraudulent, libelous, sexual, defamatory, racist, sexually defamatory, or demeaning. At no time will the list administrator(s) attempt to set editorial policy, except as noted above or in Section (5).
please make note of this and take whatever action you feel appropriate. i will respect whatever descision you make, but based upon these past instances, i doubt you will do that.
thank you,
SHAUN
<a href="http://forums.rennlist.com/forums/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=004178" target="_blank">http://forums.rennlist.com/forums/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=004178</a>
sflraver said:
[quote]Originally posted by sflraver:
<strong>Go home to Afghanistan you hairy, goat blowing A-Rab. </strong><hr></blockquote>
and then you made a post about winning a 2 year memebership to whoever flamed webersports best.
and you ended up giving him the free 2 year membership for this. i am not upset about him winning, but i AM upset about racist rennlist memebers who post DEMEANING comments about other peoples nationalities.
i dont know what to even ask for? an appology or what? i guess i just want to make this post public and that fact that you ALLOWED this
the rennlist charter at <a href="https://rennlist.com/charter.htm" target="_blank">https://rennlist.com/charter.htm</a>
SPECIFICALLY states:
Rennlist mailing lists will at all times be open to free discussion about Porsche and other automobiles, assuming the discussion is related to the particular list's topic and is not intentionally inflammatory, fraudulent, libelous, sexual, defamatory, racist, sexually defamatory, or demeaning. At no time will the list administrator(s) attempt to set editorial policy, except as noted above or in Section (5).
please make note of this and take whatever action you feel appropriate. i will respect whatever descision you make, but based upon these past instances, i doubt you will do that.
thank you,
SHAUN
08-24-2002, 10:57 PM
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I apoligize if I had offended anyone. Before I posted that I was looking through my backed pic's and came across a graphic someone made right after sep.11. It dipected somthing along the lines of what I said but I did not think before I posted. I didnt realize that it might offend someone other than the intended target.
08-24-2002, 10:59 PM
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I did make a cool addition to rennlist graphic in a post a few down from this if that helps.... "listing redeaming qualitys"
sorry mideastmafia
sorry mideastmafia
08-24-2002, 11:01 PM
#4
[quote]Originally posted by mideastmafia:
<strong>
but based upon these past instances, i doubt you will do that.
thank you,
SHAUN</strong><hr></blockquote>
What were these other instances?
Also, how many times have you broken that charter?
<strong>
but based upon these past instances, i doubt you will do that.
thank you,
SHAUN</strong><hr></blockquote>
What were these other instances?
Also, how many times have you broken that charter?
08-24-2002, 11:20 PM
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Wow, I just stepped into this mess, I will research the topic, but I can say, anyone that insults Shaun, is doing so without knowing the man. Shaun is one of the most stand up guys I know, always willing to take it to the last mile for you. If I were against a wall, Shaun is one of the top two men I would ask to help me out, without a doubt. I know he would do it.
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08-25-2002, 12:23 AM
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John Anderson, NO ONE insulted Shawn. Let's clear THAT up way before any of this gets out of hand.
The guy just didn't think before he posted, and I'm sure John D. didn't really give it much thought with all that's gone on in Afganistan lately.... So let's not pretend that anyone did this out of racism.
With that said, again, it was a stupid comment. Even I had to read it twice, and I'm a "cracker." Shaun, please don't get too bent out of shape when you know full well it wasn't directed at you in the least, and wasn't meant to
be racist. Guys let's not turn this into a fight.
He apologized, so I think we should drop this. I think he should probably edit that post as well, if he is aware he can do that.
-Matt
The guy just didn't think before he posted, and I'm sure John D. didn't really give it much thought with all that's gone on in Afganistan lately.... So let's not pretend that anyone did this out of racism.
With that said, again, it was a stupid comment. Even I had to read it twice, and I'm a "cracker." Shaun, please don't get too bent out of shape when you know full well it wasn't directed at you in the least, and wasn't meant to
be racist. Guys let's not turn this into a fight.
He apologized, so I think we should drop this. I think he should probably edit that post as well, if he is aware he can do that.
-Matt
08-25-2002, 12:52 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by sflraver:
<strong>
sorry mideastmafia</strong><hr></blockquote>
thank you.. i HIGHLY respect that you did that. i didnt mean to start this post to cause trouble, its just that anyone who knows me will tell you i dont take well to racist remarks.
i now see you did it as a joke and didnt mean it maliciously
THANK YOU,
SHAUN
<strong>
sorry mideastmafia</strong><hr></blockquote>
thank you.. i HIGHLY respect that you did that. i didnt mean to start this post to cause trouble, its just that anyone who knows me will tell you i dont take well to racist remarks.
i now see you did it as a joke and didnt mean it maliciously
THANK YOU,
SHAUN
08-25-2002, 12:59 AM
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Just for the record I dont think Shaun is a "hairy A-Rab." Goat blower... well... J/k
Glad we got this cleared up. I realy didnt mean to offend anyone exept the person that was offending ... well.. all most all of us in this community.
I fell like the kid on road trip when they put the Klan hood in his bag.
Glad we got this cleared up. I realy didnt mean to offend anyone exept the person that was offending ... well.. all most all of us in this community.
I fell like the kid on road trip when they put the Klan hood in his bag.
08-25-2002, 03:51 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by mideastmafia:
<strong>
but i AM upset about racist rennlist memebers who post DEMEANING comments about other peoples nationalities.
....
the rennlist charter at <a href="https://rennlist.com/charter.htm" target="_blank">https://rennlist.com/charter.htm</a>
SPECIFICALLY states:
Rennlist mailing lists will at all times be open to free discussion about Porsche and other automobiles, assuming the discussion is related to the particular list's topic and is not intentionally inflammatory, fraudulent, libelous, sexual, defamatory, racist, sexually defamatory, or demeaning. At no time will the list administrator(s) attempt to set editorial policy, except as noted above or in Section (5).
SHAUN</strong><hr></blockquote>
Shaun, maybe you should keep this charter in mind yourself when calling others psycho killers. Doesn't exactly make me feel welcome to the group <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[nono]" />
<strong>
but i AM upset about racist rennlist memebers who post DEMEANING comments about other peoples nationalities.
....
the rennlist charter at <a href="https://rennlist.com/charter.htm" target="_blank">https://rennlist.com/charter.htm</a>
SPECIFICALLY states:
Rennlist mailing lists will at all times be open to free discussion about Porsche and other automobiles, assuming the discussion is related to the particular list's topic and is not intentionally inflammatory, fraudulent, libelous, sexual, defamatory, racist, sexually defamatory, or demeaning. At no time will the list administrator(s) attempt to set editorial policy, except as noted above or in Section (5).
SHAUN</strong><hr></blockquote>
Shaun, maybe you should keep this charter in mind yourself when calling others psycho killers. Doesn't exactly make me feel welcome to the group <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[nono]" />
08-25-2002, 06:48 AM
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[quote]Originally posted by Stefan:
<strong>
Shaun, maybe you should keep this charter in mind yourself when calling others psycho killers. Doesn't exactly make me feel welcome to the group <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[nono]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
could you refresh me on what instance you are speaking of?
SHAUN
<strong>
Shaun, maybe you should keep this charter in mind yourself when calling others psycho killers. Doesn't exactly make me feel welcome to the group <img src="graemlins/nono.gif" border="0" alt="[nono]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>
could you refresh me on what instance you are speaking of?
SHAUN
08-25-2002, 06:57 AM
#13
Race Car
John D's decision to reward the individual who made this comment was indeed wrong [I don't need people questioning my interpretation of the term 'wrong' either...] and those of you who are putting SHAUN's credibility under scrutiny are missing the bigger picture here. He makes a valid point and I whole-heartedly agree: the parties offended deserve a meaningful apology and the individual who made the racist statement deserves no reward. The bottom line cannot be defined more clearly than that...so don't broaden the scope of this topic by pointing the finger where it need not be pointed.
08-25-2002, 11:04 AM
#14
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[quote]Originally posted by PorscheG96:
<strong>John D's decision to reward the individual who made this comment was indeed wrong [I don't need people questioning my interpretation of the term 'wrong' either...]....</strong><hr></blockquote>
I've been waiting for someone to post that comment, as in fact - you are probably right. I apologize, and applaud you for making that comment publicly. However, I haven't rewarded anyone yet - and this apology is for my original offer altogether....
Second, in defense of SHAUN – you may remember when he first started posting to this Forum – many of you e-mailed me privately about your concerns, as he was asked to leave another Internet group. My decision was that here – on Rennlist – he is responsible for his own actions “here”, not from somewhere else. As well, just so you are aware, each time I have communicated with SHAUN privately, he has taken responsibility for his posts and has maintained a high degree of professionalism in doing so. Frankly, that decision was absolutely the right thing to do.
So – my “batting” average is probably “.500” or so. Yes, I’ll make the right decision on some issues and probably make the wrong decision on certain other issues, this weekend being a clear example of the latter.
At the same time, I’ll ask you to keep my situation in mind – Rennlist and Rennlist Members accomplished something truly amazing with the Racers’ Group and the Natalie L. Streather Fund. We did those things for only the right reasons – and as well – because it was the correct thing to do. And we couldn’t have achieved that without you, Rennlist, Natalie’s parents, Adrain and Gail Streather – and yes, Kevin and Deb Buckler from The Racer’s Group. In my opinion, to have an individual/vendor come back and post for their own commercial benefit or petty personal reasons and in a veiled attempt to tarnish those same ideals and accomplishments that were achieved by so many – is repugnant, to say the least.
So while my methods may have been somewhat “brutal” to have that person understand the repulsive nature of their post, which is “more wrong”? I’m not really sure it matters. What I know “does matter” is that no one has the right to use a personal tragedy and the tremendous affect this site had – for his or her own veiled agenda. In my mind – it’s a simple question of principles, integrity and honor. And yes, I will go to any extent to protect all of those things within Rennlist – this cause being a primary example. And sometimes, in my zeal to protect the same – I will almost certainly continue to make mistakes as to the most effective method to protect them. For that, again – my apologies.
My Best to all,
John D.
<strong>John D's decision to reward the individual who made this comment was indeed wrong [I don't need people questioning my interpretation of the term 'wrong' either...]....</strong><hr></blockquote>
I've been waiting for someone to post that comment, as in fact - you are probably right. I apologize, and applaud you for making that comment publicly. However, I haven't rewarded anyone yet - and this apology is for my original offer altogether....
Second, in defense of SHAUN – you may remember when he first started posting to this Forum – many of you e-mailed me privately about your concerns, as he was asked to leave another Internet group. My decision was that here – on Rennlist – he is responsible for his own actions “here”, not from somewhere else. As well, just so you are aware, each time I have communicated with SHAUN privately, he has taken responsibility for his posts and has maintained a high degree of professionalism in doing so. Frankly, that decision was absolutely the right thing to do.
So – my “batting” average is probably “.500” or so. Yes, I’ll make the right decision on some issues and probably make the wrong decision on certain other issues, this weekend being a clear example of the latter.
At the same time, I’ll ask you to keep my situation in mind – Rennlist and Rennlist Members accomplished something truly amazing with the Racers’ Group and the Natalie L. Streather Fund. We did those things for only the right reasons – and as well – because it was the correct thing to do. And we couldn’t have achieved that without you, Rennlist, Natalie’s parents, Adrain and Gail Streather – and yes, Kevin and Deb Buckler from The Racer’s Group. In my opinion, to have an individual/vendor come back and post for their own commercial benefit or petty personal reasons and in a veiled attempt to tarnish those same ideals and accomplishments that were achieved by so many – is repugnant, to say the least.
So while my methods may have been somewhat “brutal” to have that person understand the repulsive nature of their post, which is “more wrong”? I’m not really sure it matters. What I know “does matter” is that no one has the right to use a personal tragedy and the tremendous affect this site had – for his or her own veiled agenda. In my mind – it’s a simple question of principles, integrity and honor. And yes, I will go to any extent to protect all of those things within Rennlist – this cause being a primary example. And sometimes, in my zeal to protect the same – I will almost certainly continue to make mistakes as to the most effective method to protect them. For that, again – my apologies.
My Best to all,
John D.