How much power can a k26 support?
03-26-2009, 03:05 AM
#33
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First off, you have one nice looking car outside and inside(where it counts in this thread).
My k26/6 hits full boost at 3,000, yours looks about 3,650 so this is not a #6 hotside by any means however the boost does drop off ~2psi by redline along with the AFR creeping slightly up. Could you take some better pics of the turbo? From where your AFR is at now, I wouldn't run anymore boost. I keep my AFR under 12 while under boost but then again I'm only using 91.
My k26/6 hits full boost at 3,000, yours looks about 3,650 so this is not a #6 hotside by any means however the boost does drop off ~2psi by redline along with the AFR creeping slightly up. Could you take some better pics of the turbo? From where your AFR is at now, I wouldn't run anymore boost. I keep my AFR under 12 while under boost but then again I'm only using 91.
03-26-2009, 04:33 AM
#34
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Ok, some points...
A k26 cold-side _can_ put down 300rwhp, IMO. And the compressor maps I've seen support my opinion. Example:
Click Me
Now the stock k26/6 hotside is going to be hard to push that much air through... AFAIK there is no #10 option that will bolt-on to a k26 and stock crossover/downpipe. So at best you are running a #8 hotside, which is more then capable of +300hp. The late response of your turbo suggest that you are running a larger then factory #6 turbine hsg/wheel.
Your turbo could very well be a "stock appearing" upgrade, but without pulling the turbo and measuring the wheels it will be very hard to know. IIRC a K27 compressor wheel can fit in the k26 housing with some work. And a #6 hotside can be machined to fit a #8wheel. This combo is exactly what I would do for a 'cheater-turbo'. This also fits the late-response of your turbo.
Final thought is that since the history of the motor is uncertain, the short-block could be an NA piece. Running higher CR pistons will make more power assuming knock is under-control.
BTW, do you have any more info on your air-meter?
-Rogue
A k26 cold-side _can_ put down 300rwhp, IMO. And the compressor maps I've seen support my opinion. Example:
Click Me
Now the stock k26/6 hotside is going to be hard to push that much air through... AFAIK there is no #10 option that will bolt-on to a k26 and stock crossover/downpipe. So at best you are running a #8 hotside, which is more then capable of +300hp. The late response of your turbo suggest that you are running a larger then factory #6 turbine hsg/wheel.
Your turbo could very well be a "stock appearing" upgrade, but without pulling the turbo and measuring the wheels it will be very hard to know. IIRC a K27 compressor wheel can fit in the k26 housing with some work. And a #6 hotside can be machined to fit a #8wheel. This combo is exactly what I would do for a 'cheater-turbo'. This also fits the late-response of your turbo.
Final thought is that since the history of the motor is uncertain, the short-block could be an NA piece. Running higher CR pistons will make more power assuming knock is under-control.
BTW, do you have any more info on your air-meter?
-Rogue
03-26-2009, 09:42 AM
#35
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Well I have sunday off from work, and it is supposed to rain when i wanted to take the car out for a spin, so I guess i'm going to be pulling it into the garage and take the hard pipes out, MAF out and take a closer look at whats going on under the damn intake manifold that covers everything...should just get a LR intake manifold to make all that much easier...who knows...I feel i need to get the Broadfoot racing stage 1 intercooler first, and maybe the cat bypass pipe they make too since the cat is gutted anyway...anyone else have ideas to squeak some more power out of this thing...
03-26-2009, 09:52 AM
#37
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A widefire headgasket just has some extra metal around the cylinder opening. It might mean that they o-ringed the head but wouldn't have anything to do with more CFM.
03-26-2009, 10:33 AM
#38
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ok...good to know...i really need to start learning more of this stuff and become more mechanically inclined...its my first porsche
03-26-2009, 11:00 AM
#39
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There is a lot of info on this board. Use the search function and you can find a post about almost anything related to a Porsche 944.
If you got a chance to get compression and leak down numbers on your engine that might shed some light on your performance numbers. If you came across a different dyno shop and did another run that might be interesting too.
Those HP numbers that you are already putting down are really good for a stock block and head. Most of the higher numbers with a stock block that you will see on this board are obtained running higher octane fuel like race gas and setting the boost to a long term unsustainable number like 22lbs. A general rule of thumb for these cars is that every lb of boost equals 10hp.
I think I can make out a cage in your car - do you know if it saw a lot of track time - perhaps DEs?
If you got a chance to get compression and leak down numbers on your engine that might shed some light on your performance numbers. If you came across a different dyno shop and did another run that might be interesting too.
Those HP numbers that you are already putting down are really good for a stock block and head. Most of the higher numbers with a stock block that you will see on this board are obtained running higher octane fuel like race gas and setting the boost to a long term unsustainable number like 22lbs. A general rule of thumb for these cars is that every lb of boost equals 10hp.
I think I can make out a cage in your car - do you know if it saw a lot of track time - perhaps DEs?
03-26-2009, 11:04 AM
#40
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There is a lot of info on this board. Use the search function and you can find a post about almost anything related to a Porsche 944.
If you got a chance to get compression and leak down numbers on your engine that might shed some light on your performance numbers. If you came across a different dyno shop and did another run that might be interesting too.
Those HP numbers that you are already putting down are really good for a stock block and head. Most of the higher numbers with a stock block that you will see on this board are obtained running higher octane fuel like race gas and setting the boost to a long term unsustainable number like 22lbs. A general rule of thumb for these cars is that every lb of boost equals 10hp.
I think I can make out a cage in your car - do you know if it saw a lot of track time - perhaps DEs?
If you got a chance to get compression and leak down numbers on your engine that might shed some light on your performance numbers. If you came across a different dyno shop and did another run that might be interesting too.
Those HP numbers that you are already putting down are really good for a stock block and head. Most of the higher numbers with a stock block that you will see on this board are obtained running higher octane fuel like race gas and setting the boost to a long term unsustainable number like 22lbs. A general rule of thumb for these cars is that every lb of boost equals 10hp.
I think I can make out a cage in your car - do you know if it saw a lot of track time - perhaps DEs?
It's a little bit more of a tough crowd over there, but there is a lot to learn
03-26-2009, 02:18 PM
#41
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let me get my stuff from the car and take some pictures and we shall see...running a tial 38mm wastegate, boost i believe was being measured off the vacuum line from the blow off valve...just give me some time and i will post some stuff up
and here we go with the motor
Air/Fuel
Boost
Torque
And here is the plate on the turbo...inside the red ring you can see it says k26
i am also going through receipts for the motorwork...so any other questions let me know and i will try to find them...not sure bout what is meant with the factor used in the dyno though...i'm new to some stuff.
and here we go with the motor
Air/Fuel
Boost
Torque
And here is the plate on the turbo...inside the red ring you can see it says k26
i am also going through receipts for the motorwork...so any other questions let me know and i will try to find them...not sure bout what is meant with the factor used in the dyno though...i'm new to some stuff.
Thanks...i cant take the credit for the build though...i bought the car off of a Northern new jersey region pca driving instructor. car was first owned by a shop, motor was blown and second motor had been in storage for 19 years with 1800 miles on it. new motor was completely rebuilt from the ground up.
not sure whether the turbo is new or not, but they did do a 968 6speed tranny...just have to make a bracket for the LR speed sensor kit and wire it up...has an HKS single solenoid boost controller, external oilcooler, and what you see in the picture above...thankfully it also came with those HRE's...I installed a broadfoot racing catback and thats about it i think
not sure whether the turbo is new or not, but they did do a 968 6speed tranny...just have to make a bracket for the LR speed sensor kit and wire it up...has an HKS single solenoid boost controller, external oilcooler, and what you see in the picture above...thankfully it also came with those HRE's...I installed a broadfoot racing catback and thats about it i think
Possibly a #10 as you are a lot slower to build a bar of boost than most k26s. (your dyno shows a bar at about 3500 rpm - most stock k26/6 hit it around 3k if I am not mistaken) Stock would be a #6. Could be an eight too.
Sure do appreciate all the great info. Just for reference I've got light headwork, aftermarket turbo with #8 hotside, 3" exhaust, Vitesse MAF and chips, tial 38mm and 55lb injectors and can't break 300 rwhp at 17lbs of boost - hence the curiosity about your setup.
Sure do appreciate all the great info. Just for reference I've got light headwork, aftermarket turbo with #8 hotside, 3" exhaust, Vitesse MAF and chips, tial 38mm and 55lb injectors and can't break 300 rwhp at 17lbs of boost - hence the curiosity about your setup.
i'm open to any response...i dont care...i'm still learning about all this mechanic stuff...i dont want to just get in my car and drive and not know whats going on like most people. and now, from what i hear or see for that matter...is a k26 cant support over 300whp which means that i need to keep debunking my motor to figure out what i have...some super gerbal running inside that turbo for all i know...so all comments are welcome
Sounds like you have a wonderful running car and it looks great. I'm not going to poo poo your numbers because everyone and their brother did that to me. I have no problem relenquishing my top spot however you aren't making a legitimate 330rwhp on 16psi with a stock 26 and stock motor. Sorry. I'm willing to bet your 300rwhp with a larger hotside possibly and a fresh engine. It would explain alot.
Go back to your dyno operator and ask what correction factor they used. My numbers looked like this.
331rwhp uncorrected.
311rwhp STD corrected
301rwhp SAE corrected.
Welome to rennlist and welcome to the addiction.
03-26-2009, 04:28 PM
#43
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alright, well i just emailed the shop to see what factor numbers they use, so hopefully they will get back to me sooner than later. Thanks for all the info and i will still be taking some parts off to get at that hotside to see just what it is. I think i also remember the previous owner saying something about a k27 impeller inside of the snail if that helps
03-26-2009, 04:49 PM
#45
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If it is really a k27/8 that helps alot. There are probably folks on the board that would say those numbers are possible with that turbo configuration but I still suspect that the dyno number correction factor is off or there is some block/head work. You could easily have a three liter crank in there and that would make it a 2.7 liter I think. Haven't figured out how that works to increase displacement if anyone wants to chime in....