Hey guy's... it's cool.... i like ALL of you, so.... no bad intentions coming from me.... it IS true, that no matter WHAT the conditions, you DO have less time to react at higher speeds, PLUS, IF you hit something AT that speed, the impact WILL be greater... there was something on here a long time ago about a street race gone bad w/a girl who will NEVER look the same again pictured- showed some pics of the guy who hit her- crying, about to be sentenced- before & after photos of the poor girl- She does not even look HUMAN anymore- I'm sure some of you know about this.... an INNOCENT victim- DEFINATELY made me think a little- I did some STUPID things when I was younger...still take too many risks, BUT, TRY to minimize those much more-so now...

Anyway, as for a 951 breaking 167- yes, I would believe a Turbo or Turbo S w/265rwhp would hit that- the stock Turbo S w/~215RWHP was always listed as 162, so... Rich- everything you've said makes sense, but, IF you're saying 265 FLYWHEEL HP, then, I'm thinking that estimate of power is a little low actually... that's not even another 20hp... I don't know... MAYBE.,.. I DO know that when chips are used & boost control, etc, & the rev limiter is removed, the HP curve is affected- all of them, are different, so, it's possible that the HP is not dropping off as fast as stock & is STILL holding peak (or close to it) at say, 6700rpms or so... Scott Gomes HAD to be making some 500+HP at 8500rpm+ to break 205mph or so... He's got a LOT of HIGH-HP engines though..... 700+ & he hass the Norwood Doom II that ran close to 1000 & is still building one to break the land speed record of some ~250mph in 944 w/well OVER 1000.... we'll see... can't wait actually... anyway, I want an S2 5th- would give a 5th redline of ~181 or so w/stock RD- w/>300rwhp, I'm thinking it MIGHT actually be possible to make use of too.... hopefully I'll be able to find out....

Anyway, Z-man- you said our cars had high frontal area....? I've always heard we had LOW frontal area... I only know a FEW car's #'s for that- our's is like 20.4 sq ft & a 993 was like 19.4 as was a VR6 Corrado... not sure on many others.... do you know any? I KNOW it LOOKS like we have a lot of area, but, I HAVE seen a FEW cars running more like 23.0sq ft & up... just can't remember which & REALLY don't have a baseline for comparison.... I'm very interested in knowing for sure... I DO, however, have a baseline for Cx- 951 - .33
924S - .32
VR6 Corrado- .32
928S4 - .35
older 928's - .38
Scirroco 16V - .38
GTi 16v- .36
Mustang 5.0GT (4.9L) - .38
Mustang 5.0LX (4.9L) - .36
Ferrari F40 - .34
Vette C5 - .29
Viper GTSR - .36
CRX Si (LAST year) - .30
CRX HF (LAST year) - .29
Audi 80 - .29
Audi TT - .35
E46 M3 - .31 - .32(?)
M5 - .31 - .32(?)
996TT - .30
993TT - .31

I've got tons of 'em if I could ever find my list... point? Well, many people say we have a low Cx, but, we do NOT- we are ok- pretty much average anymore... combining the frontal area & Cx, w/gearing, & power at given point, gives a good indication of where we will top out- of course, there are lot's of little factors, but.....

BTW- Tom R- you ARE kidding about the Z breaking 200 aren't you? I've heard of S2's hitting 150, but, a Z28 would need 550+ to reach 200- if you're just speaking of the GEAR limitations, then, cool... the F40 had a 5sp & would have been capable of ~240 IIRC.... many later 928's would have been capable of 240ish too.... The Viper GTSR is the tallest I'm aware of though.... just over 300 in 6th- too bad Hennessey screwed so many people.... might have had a shot w/some of those forced induction bad boys w/1000+ HP..... Of course.... we've still got Lingenfelter building them & LOTS of people messing w/the Supra TT for HUGE #'s.... I want a Supra TT engine my 951... Better Yet... an E36 M3 w/AUDI console (& some sort of interior handles to pull the doors shut with- same for our cars- guess ya have to go to Japan to figure out how to make inner door handles to pull them shut with) & a modded Supra TT engine... :-) :-) :-)

 

Driving fast is fun! That said, Z's point is well-taken. Driving fast on the track is MUCH safer fun.

Z, if you were at LRP last Saturday, you probably saw the black 968 hit the wall after the driving turn leading to the front straight. That car hit the tire wall at about 110 mph (the "fun" speed that started this thread). The track workers said that they had never seen a car so deeply embedded into the tires as that 968.

As it was, the driver walked away with a couple of broken ribs, whiplash, a slight concussion, headaches, etc. He was tightly harnessed into a racing seat, surrounded with a full cage and wore a Bell M2 Pro full face helmet (that absorbed a hard left side blow & is now "toast") and "horse" neck collar (that helped reduce the degree of the whiplash).

If our original poster ever leaves the road and hits, say a tree, at 110 mph, there would, sadly, be no more posts from that young man.

Knowing Z, he advocates for all Porsche owners to enjoy driving their cars at high speeds in an environment that is both challenging and relatively safe for the driver AND which presents no danger to others.

Here in the New York metropolitan area, there really is no place to "safely" drive a Porsche (or an other vehicle for that matter) at twice the legal limit. Sure, I've exceeded the century mark on the NYS thruway on the way up to Albany & back. Practically speaking, such speeds are impossible to sustain what with traffic volume and law enforcement in this part of the world.

Richard

 

Robby,
It says here on this gear calculator that at 5700 rpm the car will do 217mph. So it must be true - right?

Gear Calculator Link

The calculator seems like a pretty good tool for all cars.

 

217???? I'll bet you a million bucks it can't.

Seriously, it takes some major power and aerodynamics for a street car to break 200. The Carrera GT can just barely do it, and the Enzo can hit 211. Drag increases exponentially as the car moves faster. At over 200 a car has to push a helluva lot of air out of the way.

 

I'm with ya Tom... ;-)

944Pete- I didn't know the Carrera GT actually COULD exceed 200, but, you're exactly right... it's supposed to take close to twice the power to hit 150, for a given car, than it took to hit 100. It's supposed to take slightly more than double the HP to make a car drag limited at 150, be able to hit 200. You've got to have gearing (in addition to the RD tire) that will ALLOW for the given speed, PLUS, have the power at the right rpm to do it, plus, have the aerodynamics, to top out.... IF a Turbo S can hit 162 @ 247HP, then, it probably would take some 450HP to hit 200.... Hey, 400HP 993TT's & 415HP 996TT's are barely able to break 190 & they BOTH have less Cx AND lower frontal area....

 

really makes you respect the mclaren f1 reaching 241 mph a little more.

 

No kidding. Thats an old car too.

 

I'm assuming you mean public roads so....
I've driven @ 135 in a N/A 944, no mods but a chip (3 years ago). Not really sure whatit could do now. Back in 1991 I got a ticket for 116 in a 55 I'M NOT KIDDING. He said he gave me a break, Should have been 127. I can't believe I didn't get arrested. Top ending your car at the early AM hours is great, Just watch out for the troopers. BTW... a detector didn't help me, he used "instant on". Once I heard & saw the detector max out, I knew I was screwed.

Fastest that I've ever been a passenger was about the 150-160MPH range a few years back in a late '60s Shelby Mustang.

I love it when the the highway lane stripes look like one slid blurred line..

 

Richard: I was not there, but I heard of all three of the big offs at Lime Rock last weekend.

I am friends with the 914 driver who flipped his car coming out of the Esses. He hit the burm at the start of Noname straight at about 80/90 mph. His rollcage, helmet and safety gear saved his life. The burm probably absorbed 50% or more of the impact. He walked away with some minor bruises.

The 968 driver, and the 911 turbo driver who hit the tire wall in the downhill were very fortunate that the tire wall absorbed so much of their impacts. Both drivers again, walked away without major injuries.

Unfortunately, there are no such things as energy absorbing burms and tire walls lining our highways, where most people like to 'see how much she'll do.' Concrete barriers, trees, and other hard objects don't absorb energy as well, you see. Also: MOST people don't wear a helmet when driving cars on public roads. (I have - to 'wear in' my new helmets: you should have seen the reactions!) Someone has once said: Speed does not kill. It's the sudden stop that does.

-Z-man.

 

Does that mean you "break-in" your new helmets driving to work? Picking up the kids from school? Driving to the dentist? Visiting the in-laws?

If so, your cool.

 

Yeah, I'm cool alright - in the most nerdy sort of way.... 8)

-Z.

 

It would be funny if you always had your windows down for people to see the helmet, and the helmet was white with black lettering that said "Safety First!" - I would sport that.

 

I'm not too sure that a helmet would REALLY help THAT much on a highway wreck in the 150mph range... MAYBE on a track w/other safety gear, etc... you have harnesses to keep you from being ejected & roll bars to keep the chassis together, etc.... on the street, none of that....USUALLY..... well.... MAYBE Z-Mans street car.... I AM just kidding man.... actually.... w/all the damn trendy-*** SUVs on the road.... I'M starting to think it might be a good idea....

241 in Mclaren F1??? I've seen tests where they didn't break 220.... AAMOF.... there was a C&D OR R&T test where it hit 219, BUT, it DID bounce off the rev limiter... BUT, the F1 ALSO had close to 700HP & 7 (SEVEN) close ratio gears to GET it there.... ;-) Makes a BIG dif when combined w/a low Cx (I THINK it was .29???) & low frontal area, etc... Not to mention MOST of that Cx was DOWFORCE.... EVERYTHING about that car was desigined for it to b=hit 230mph.... that was always the claimed top speed iIRC- of course... they weren't exactly production cars- they may have been called that, but, it's really BS! When building $1,000,000 cars, there WILL be more variance than most.... I had a friend w/a VR6 Jetta- he had already been through 3 VR6 Corrados- ALL of the Corrados late 93 & 94, so, were all distributorless, etc... all the same... the corrado had 178HP & Jetta had 172 w/TALLER gearing & an extra 50lbs or so... He did a chip, TB, & filter & susp & wheels for ALL 4 cars- EXACT same stuff for ALL of them.... That Jetta would beat ALL 3 of the Corrados... it was FASTER for SURE! We had that up to ~149 one night..... ALMOST hit 150.... ALMOST..... we were on an open highway w/no cars- it was not really open yet.... about 6 months off & no one knew to travel it.... ;-) Anyway, another good one- MOST people forget that the Vette had 405 HP in the ZR1 by 93.... original ZR1's had 375- R&T tested the 375HP one at 12.9 1/4 mile- years later....in 93....they tested the 405HP one & ran a 13.8.... they mentioned how produtcion variances, etc... made a huge dif.... I would believe an F1 would hit 240 under perfect circumstances- just haven't seen it, so I was just curious.....

 

Ya know, All of this carnage on the track makes me wonder. Maybe we ARE better off on the streets. All the local tracks are what, 2, maybe 2.5 miles long? They are chock FULL of twists and turns. Not to mention a crapload of hot shoe drivers screaming "TORA TORA" as they try to shave .1 sec off their best lap. Every track weekend SOMEBODY bends metal. It has been a 10 years or so since anyone I know was in an accident on the street. All of the straight race tracks are lucky if they are 1/2 mile long. We've got perfectly good long, long (1000's of miles) pieces of asphalt out there, often full of traffic but often not. I've driven across Indiana often and seen vast stretches of open, smooth, protected, vacant concrete. What a waste to limit a well prepped car to 60. Anyone driven across Oklahoma where they have those wierd deer detecting radars that set off your radar detector every 1/4 mile? Those things SUCK! Then again, they detect deer, so I guess it would be nice if an automated corner worker threw a yellow flag when some bouncing buck tresspassers were detected.

Z- I keep casting but I guess the fish aren't biting!

 

Another thing worth mentioning.. This isuue has a lot to do with where you live. How many times in NJ can you go 50 miles and only pass 4 exit ramps, always have 2 open lanes (of 3) to choose from, and not see a single cop? Yea, it happens here.

I remember a debate a while back about merging issues.. (Rich, were you in on that one?) that really boiled down to locality. Some areas it is OK to ram down the closing lane and cut off a long line of traffic waiting to get thru, yet other areas it is not. Vast expanses of open road vs. blasting on the long island expressway (world's longest parking lot?) are two very, very different things!!