Tony K

Z, with all due respect, citing the Insurance Institute for information on speed limits is like citing a medical study commissioned by drug companies. The Insurance Institute is to speed limits as Michael Moore is to George Bush (not trying to get political here; just illustrating a point). Do you honestly think that, if there were a 35% increase in accidents or deaths attributed to raised speed limits, we would still have them 8-9 years later?

Several years ago, I looked at a lot of the numbers made available by NHTSA. Total number of highway accidents and deaths decreased by a small amount every year through some point in the late 80s through 1999. They went down slightly but not (statistically) significantly during the years the speed limits were raised. Total number of highway deaths decreased despite increased total number of vehicles and increased vehicles per miles of highway. The best conclusion that could be drawn was that raising the speed limits didn't seem to have any effect. Did not decrease accidents as some suggested; did not increase accidents, as Ins. Institute, AAA, and others promised. Decrease in deaths per accident was suggested somewhere to have more to do with increased seat belt awareness, a higher percentage of cars on the road having air bags, and other improvements in vehicle safety. Sorry I don't have any citations for you - I am at work and can't spend too much time here, but if you look around on NHTSA web site, you can probably find the numbers buried somewhere. I was working on a project in grad school learning about statistics and SPSS; chose this information out of interest in the subject matter. Pulled it from some NHTSA or other government publications in the university library.

I'm not the voice of Rennlist (heck, I'm not even a member), but I think it's safe to say that no one really disagrees with you. I agree with what you are saying; people just don't like to be preached to. I think it is well-documented on here that the vast majority of people on this forum hate street racing and reckless driving with a passion.

Hey, look at racing (legitimately, on the track) for a moment. How many deaths per mile or per driver are there across the country? I have no clue, but if racing were the least bit of a safe environment, then life insurance companies would not have the problems that they do with people who do it as a hobby.

As for death, chill out a bit. We all want to live. And we're all going to die. I just had three deaths of close family and friends this year - am going to a funeral this weekend. We all get scared about death. When I am scared about it, I know it's time to do some soul searching.

Peace,

Tony K

My personal thoughts on highway safety -

When the American public can do the following:
- use good quality, appropriate tires that are properly balanced and inflated
- keep the suspension aligned, bushings and shock absorbers in good order, wheel bearings snug
- brake system in good order
- lights aimed properly, all signals, etc. working
- windows clean
- proper seating position
- get stupid distractions like tv screens, loud stereos, cell phones, pets, meals, etc. out of the car
- learn how to properly pack/transport things so they are not dangerous in accidents
- bolt their batteries down
- stay alert and pay attention
- learn things like right of way and lane discipline
- and basically learn that your car is not your living room or a yard stick for your *****

...then Americans will be ready for higher speeds.

I would wholeheartedly support inspections like England's MoT in all states (I know some states - PA, for example, maybe? - have inspections already) that would get junk off the road. I would also wholeheartedly support any legislation that either rewards attentive, actively defensive driving and/or punishes the opposite. I would not mind paying a tax for that. I'd be glad to put an inspection sticker for such in my window.

A friend of mine who spends several weeks a hear in Germany (both work and family) told me that they have sort of "parks" there where you can practice your driving, kind of like how many of us probably go to empty snow-covered parking lots to practice our winter driving, learn the limits of our cars, and learn how to control the car out of a skid. I would gladly pay a few bucks more on my registration fee to have something like that.

Cheers,

deni durrell

This is a great thread; I just want to say that if we all agreed, it wouldn't get so long and be so interesting. I believe this thread got separated from the parent topic (it's necesssary to mention this); we all have to thank z-man for serving as devil's advocate to give us something to argue about (Thanks z-man). To digress, I have also seen the show about the Autobahn on the History channel - I intend to buy the DVD. Anyhow here at RL, I feel the majority of posters have a pretty good idea of what is proper and what is imbecile-like behavior. Let's keep it that way - this is what separates us from the "ricer" crowd - although there are always a few that fall into that category and sometimes become winners of the Darwin award.
So - keep it real, and keep it safe!

Predator

If I don't get my 100mph fix every day, I have withdrawal. Course, it only takes about 9 secs and 1000 ft !

Tom R.

Guess it takes me a second or two longer and maybe a few extra feet.

It must be nice to never have to check to make sure your 944 is in first not third like the rest of us.

JediAgent

You know your just making us jealous and thats not fair.

944Fest (aka Dan P)

Great post Tony, and again thanks Z for the voice of reason. I like to dance in the triple digits when able, and this is worth saying.

I KNOW of places it is safer to run 130 on public roads than a racetrack.

Yea, you might think I'm crazy but it is true. I can push my 951 past 130 on mid-ohio's back straight but I've got traffic ahead and behind, a 45 degree right hander rapidly approaching ahead, and no guarentee against ground hogs, turtles and deer. If I'm on a fenced interstate with no traffic in my 4 lanes, I can see for miles with nothing around, I'm going to run it up. In 2 seconds I can be back below 50 with a jab of my Mo30 awesome brakes. My car is fully inspected, tighter than a drum and sitting on Z rated rubber. The driver is sober, alert, and actively scanning for hazards. I choose to take the calculated risk.

Yes, it is a double standard. I feel anyone who doesn't have 10 years of high perf drivers ed under their belt doing what I do is probably a suicidal maniac. Dumb kids, whatever. You have to admit it is FUN! (original topic)

I have gone 160mph + here in Ohio, Not on any race track yet totally legal. No police involved. Anyone remember how I did it?

ERAU-944

wow, it wouldn't be a thread on the 944 forum at rennlist without tom r. continuing to troll...

now, for the On Topic content:

fast is fun - in the US keep it on the track!

JediAgent

Airplane?

WesM951

Airport Runway?

Mongo

I got about 135 on mine with the help of a downgrade on Interstate 8 westbound. Smooth car. 123-125 is a shallow figure for this car; however temperature and altitude do play a very serious role since the closer you are to sea level; the more dense air is hence actually pegging Porsche's top track speed of 130-136 mph in the 944 NA.

Andy

smkn951

do 120 daily avg
lately i've been hiting 135
then this morning 142,43
held it for 24 km going to work @ 0400 in the morning running late.
5th gear, apprx 5 on the tach, boost is about 5 or 7.
how long can it hold at that speed? what would happen if t-belt snaps?
oh as long as i have the heater on temp is below the 1/2 mark
BTW i'm still getting passed, Autobahn is Great!!!

944Fest (aka Dan P)

BINGO!!

OriginalSterm

everybody should go as fast as they want. everybody here is an excellent driver in a car that is safe for anybody over 100 mph. as far as kids in the road, who lets their kids play in or near the road anyway? if a deer runs out, you could just swerve and miss it, right? who in their right mind would just plow right into something in the road? we should have a contest to see who can go the fastest in their town in front of the local elementary school, what a great idea!

btw, going to the track sucks. these cars are city cruisers!

Z-man

Sorry Tony, but you are giving YOUR OPINION vs. their stats. Now I work with stats at work, and I know that stats can be made to show just about anything. So I do take stats with a grain of salt.
I think the biggest factor in preventing the fatality rate from raising today is not that people are driving slower, but that the cars are being made with more safety in mind - crumple zones, air bags and curtains, ABS & traction control all help keep this stat down.
Also note that the 35% increase they site is 55 mph vs. 70/75 mph. IIRC, the speed limit hasn't been raised since it jumped to 70/75mph, so there shouldn't be a great increase in the death rate since then.
Can you point to a reference withint the NHTSA that backs your opinion on this? THIS is what I found at NHTSA:
Source: http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/pdf/nrd...8/Speedlim.pdf
What you posted is hearsay, what I have supplied is from the source. What you posted is OPPOSITE of what the NHTSA findings concluded! Please back up your claims with references! (My high school English teacher would be proud!)

Yesterday, I came across some more NHTSA stats supporting my point, but I can't find it now....

Regards,
-Z.