84_Carrera

Oh GOD no Douglas, I pulled the F350 out of my a$$ as an example only, I missed you had specifically referred to it - totally not directed at ANYONE, just a societal thing.

Here's a beer on me...

No, I'm all for those who NEED trucks for a specific purpose, dad's a building contractor, I grew up with all sorts of them from pickups to his F550 Turbo Diesel box now, & so on. It's the Soccer Moms & Rambo Dudes that get me.

Amber Gramps

Boy, I'm glad I logged back on....

Sorry Fred, really I am. I'm a nut case, just read above post and I'll prove it.

old man neri

I think there is an easy solution to all of this

Amber Gramps

See how people get and the lengths they will go to when some outside force reaches into there wallet.

rfloz

A couple of points - My Armada was purchsed 4 years ago specifically as a tow vehicle. That and hauling stuff too bulky for a car have been it's main uses.

But, it has been handy for friends/family outings with up to eight people on board. Cost per mile is no worse than taking two cars in such cases.

Otherwise, it mostly sits, but I do commute (only 8 miles one way) every couple of weeks in it if it hasn't been out in a while. So, if you see me commuting, Im just keeping the seals from drying out.

We are lucky enough to have other cars for commuting that get around 20 mpg city, 26-28 mpg freeway (my 325Ci and the wife's Infiniti I30T). But not everyone who needs a large truck or SUV can afford a commuter car in addition. My gardener is a case in point - needs a truck, no way can he go out and buy a hybrid on the money he makes (No, I'm not going to give him a raise.)

When my wife's Infiniti stopped running last week (oh, she says, there was a small coolant leak -was that important?) and we thought about a new car, I suggested a Mini or even a Smart car for her. Not happening. She wants a Lexus. SIgh. Luckily a new radiator seems to have restored the Infiniti.

I know there are many who have a large vehicle that is never utilized for it's intended purpose. All I can say is they are the ones who are going to eat the depreciation when they flock like lemmings to the next hot trend, my Armada is a keeper.

genripper

You are correct sir, 95 was the first thing that popped up in my head mid rant.

Speculators are a vital part of any effective commodities market, and cannot defy the fundamentals of any given commodity. Speculators provide liquidity, and the more buyers and sellers there are in a market whether they are speculators, producers, refiners or growers, the more rapidly and accurately,
prices will arrive at the appropriate market price.

2 words, Supply and Demand.

Free markets are still the most efficient way to allocate resources, period. Governments are not.

84_Carrera

Matt -
I was actually open minded enough to try that out once for the SHO community. In the case of that car, I had dyno time scheduled out about a month & had the Tornado installed. I could FEEL the difference (in a bad way - performance LOST) and I saw a marked DECREASE in mileage with it, with the SHO's dual-runner-per-cylinder / split-plenum intake manifold. I cancelled my dyno time because it was an obvious "don't bother spending the money on the dyno time" situation. It just didn't work in that car's case.

When I called for an RMA number, the number was no longer in service. I threw it out.

Peter Zimmermann

Well, here's one for you. Saturn's GM, right? But, Saturn makes and sells small, efficient cars, right? I was talking with a local guy, this morning, who works at the Bakersfield Auto Mall; he told me that his cousin, and nineteen other employees, were just laid off by the local Saturn dealer two days ago. OUCH!

84_Carrera

Well, how many 'salesmen' do you need to push a car that's sticker-only? Walk up to the receptionist, she takes your check, hands you keys.

Sorry to hear about the job losses though!

PS - I got my dad into a Saturn Sky Redline last year after we sold his '64 Vette. He LOVES the car, & isn't afraid to drive it anywhere. He's contantly getting Sunday morning coffee conversations going with M/B owners, etc. Nice little turbo-4, 5-speed, 260hp, half-decent mileage, half the price of the M/B roadsters.

Tim993

I would ask anyone who thinks that the current run up in oil prices is simply supply and demand read the congressional testimony of this hedge fund manager. http://hsgac.senate.gov/public/_files/052008Masters.pdf It is very interesting a well worth reading if you have the time.

Amber Gramps

I gotta not give out too much info here but I have some inside info in the North American car industry. I have a customer who is making parts for a large, very large, name in the small car market. They are producing round the clock 24/7 parts for cars made all over the U.S. and to a very small extent in Japan. The parts are optional on most cars and get installed at thedealer level after the car has sold. I have seen production going up for years, but now it is gang busters. It would seem to me that the U.S. consumer is getting a little smarter on what they buy. Now that everyone has spent there HELOC it's back to being responsible with money.

Peter Zimmermann

That's why I mentioned the Saturn dealership, is it that we're buying smarter, or we don't have the money available to buy? Speaking of HELOCs, I'm sure that many of you are aware of the Countrywide fiasco, and their freezing hundreds of thousands of HELOCs because of a fear that people would max them out and move out of their house never to be seen again. I brought a twenty-five year investment with my brother to a close in 2007, part of the realized funds were earmarked for investment (into our house), and we planned to use our Countrywide HELOC to pay our tax nut in April '08. Boy did we get a surprise in late February when Countrywide sent us a letter advising us that we had no funds available in our HELOC for an undetermined period of time. That left us six weeks to nail down a low-interest note to pay our income tax with, which in a way was a good thing. In the process we closed all of our accounts at Citibank, and transferred everything over to a local Federal Credit Union, where we're being treated very well. But, douglas, you're absolutely correct, HELOCs were being used for, in our town, amongst other things, BMWs and, not as many, Hummers. It was a rare day, in '04, when I didn't see another new Bimmer with paper plates going down the road. I used to wonder where all the money was coming from, but eventually realized that people were using their HELOCs to buy cars with. I haven't seen a new Hummer, or a 7-Series, in at least a year, possibly a year and a half. Yes, the interest is deductible, but you still have to write the check every month.

Hey, another economy-related deal. How many of you have noticed "Buy one, get one free" coupons, in the newspaper and junk mail, for both restaurants and fast food places (Der Weiner & Carl's Jr. advertise heavily with freebies here, along with restaurants like Chilis, Macaroni Grille, Red Lobster and others). I've never seen anything like it; eating out is kind of like a sport in Bakersfield (in most homes it's too damn hot to cook in the evening), and the way it is now a family of four can dine for 2/3 of the cost just 6 months ago. Amazing...

lucroberts

There is a good article on the Wall Street Journal today on this topic:
"When Buying a Gas Guzzler Makes Sense"

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1212...d=hpp_us_autos

jakeflyer

Positive Side for this Situation---------------

This may be a good time to buy spare parts, eng or transmission etc for the car that you want to keep long term. Im am also watching special tools and manuals. The 911sc is that car for us and I am looking at the 2nd spare eng and tranny. I also continue to watch for the second '82 or '83 sc with a careful eye.

Keep in mind that our little World is gaining population and as the numbers grow the demand and prices for assets of water, food, fuel, energy, and space increase at a disproportional rate. BUT, as the population grows the demand for rare things also goes up in interesting ways. Many rare cars are still doing well, some rare watches and English doubles are also doing very well.

You may see the day when it is not only the Euro people who want a 911. It may be China, South America, and others. Things of real value do take a hit in bad times but they still retain value over the long haul.

Have faith Bro.

Mike Murphy

Peter, since when did GM executives ever know what was ahead? Trust me, these guys are dinosaurs, I know - I have worked for GM companies and GM employees