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Don’t Use LED Bulbs in Halogen Reflector Headlights such as H4's
Greetings All & Merry Christmas...
In my little foray into social media I have some received some interesting comments from some folks about LED headlights:
I got blinded by those f-ing headlights this morning on my way too work. Had to pull over for a bit. They should be illegal!!
They are not so good they blind oncoming traffic and cause more accidents and deer just freeze so you have to have good brakes to miss them
Are you kidding me?? Those LED headlights are too bright and have too much glare due to the high blue content. Blue light scatters much more than other light causing glare! How many other drivers need to get blinded to wreck and die so you can spot one deer in the road or ditch?!
I don't think that those people are trolls - I think they have been victims of LED bulbs in halogen reflector headlights. This prompted me to dig a little deeper and to write a detailed article on why you should never use LED bulbs in halogen reflector headlights. It seems like a cheap and easy upgrade and there are innumerous inexpensive bulbs available, but it's a terrible idea.
A few reasons that I will explore in detail in the article.
You blind on-coming drivers with glare and scatter.
Your illumination is much worse than with halogen bulbs
The cut-off is horrible.
They’re impossible to adjust.
You get a scattered burst of light as opposed to focused light.
You look like a hillbilly noob.
LED bulb in reflector headlight on the left - halogen bulb on the right.
I’ll post the article in a few days. But please don’t drive with LED bulbs in halogen reflector assemblies. It’s just not safe, for you or for on-coming drivers.
Cheers,
JohnA
Note: As you know, I sell LED headlight assemblies so I have a horse in this race. But I don't care if you buy LED headlights from me or someone else, please don't use LED bulbs in halogen reflector assemblies.
Don't Use LED Bulbs in Halogen Reflector Headlights - Part 2
First I will go ahead and provide some quotes for an article on this topic written by the estimable Daniel Stern, an acknowledged expert on automobile lighting. These excerpts are taken from the following article: Daniel Stern: https://www.danielsternlighting.com/...nversions.html
Note: I've inserted "LED bulbs" in places because Mr. Stern considers "HID Kits" and "LED bulbs" to be equivalent in terms of "upgrade".
Good HID and LED headlamps are terrific; they can offer excellent safety performance and driver comfort, but only if they're designed and built from the start as HID or LED headlamps. Installing an "HID kit" or "LED bulbs" in a halogen headlamp isn't an upgrade, it's a large and serious safety downgrade.
"HID kits" and "LED bulbs” are not a legitimate, safe, effective, or legal product. No matter whose name is on them or what the vendor claims, they are a fraudulent scam. They are not capable of producing the right amount of light in the right distribution pattern for the lamp's optics to work. The particular details of the incompatibility are different for LED vs. HID, but the principles and problems are the same overall. In one sentence: halogen headlamps must use halogen bulbs or they don't—can't—won't work effectively, safely, or legally.
Some "HID kit" and "LED bulb" marketeers will try to tell you that the kits are technically illegal only because the US headlamp laws are stuck in the past. That's wrong; the world's experts and regulators all say the same thing: Don't!
What about the law, what does it have to say on the matter? In virtually every first-world country, HID and LED "retrofits" into halogen headlamps are illegal. They're illegal clear across Europe and in all of the many countries that use European ECE headlight regulations. They're illegal in the US and Canada. Nevertheless, on the particular count of HID and LED "retrofits" into halogen headlamps, the world's regulators and engineers all say DON'T!
The only safe and legitimate HID and LED retrofit is one that replaces the entire headlamp—that is lens, reflector, bulb...the whole system—with optics designed for HID or LED usage.
Per usual, Mr. Stern doesn't pull any punches. I encourage you to read the full article.
Cutoff: LED Bulbs in Reflector Headlights
Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute did a study of the efficacy of mounting LED bulbs in reflector headlights that was published by the SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers, founded by Henry Ford among others) and found wild varying results. They tried nine different LED “H4 replacement” bulbs. Among other things, most of the bulbs varied widely in performance compared to the manufacturer’s specs.
And here’s an eye opening (or eye burning) picture of their various cutoffs:
Yikes! It's easy to see why the headlights of an oncoming vehicle with LEDs in reflectors emits a big blast of glare into your eyes. You "might" get lucky and choose a bulb with a decent cutoff. Although it still will not focus properly and it will most likely not yield as much useful lighting as a higher power H4 bulb.
Cutoff of the Audette Collection JW Speaker Evo 2 Dual Burn Headlights
If you're interested in seeing the cutoff of Audette Collection assemblies you can take a look at the following video done by PCA:
Source of cutoff data:
Investigating the Influence of Headlight Glare and Aim on Risk-Related Driving Behavior 2017-01-1360
The results suggest that discomfort from headlight glare, including effects from vertical mis-aim, could be correlated with increased nighttime crash risk while driving.
Citation: Bullough, J., "Investigating the Influence of Headlight Glare and Aim on Risk-Related Driving Behavior,"
SAE Technical Paper 2017-01-1360, 2017
Author(s): John D. Bullough
Affiliated: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute
First I will go ahead and provide some quotes for an article on this topic written by the estimable Daniel Stern, an acknowledged expert on automobile lighting. These excerpts are taken from the following article: Daniel Stern: https://www.danielsternlighting.com/...nversions.html
Note: I've inserted "LED bulbs" in places because Mr. Stern considers "HID Kits" and "LED bulbs" to be equivalent in terms of "upgrade".
Good HID and LED headlamps are terrific; they can offer excellent safety performance and driver comfort, but only if they're designed and built from the start as HID or LED headlamps. Installing an "HID kit" or "LED bulbs" in a halogen headlamp isn't an upgrade, it's a large and serious safety downgrade.
"HID kits" and "LED bulbs” are not a legitimate, safe, effective, or legal product. No matter whose name is on them or what the vendor claims, they are a fraudulent scam. They are not capable of producing the right amount of light in the right distribution pattern for the lamp's optics to work. The particular details of the incompatibility are different for LED vs. HID, but the principles and problems are the same overall. In one sentence: halogen headlamps must use halogen bulbs or they don't—can't—won't work effectively, safely, or legally.
Some "HID kit" and "LED bulb" marketeers will try to tell you that the kits are technically illegal only because the US headlamp laws are stuck in the past. That's wrong; the world's experts and regulators all say the same thing: Don't!
What about the law, what does it have to say on the matter? In virtually every first-world country, HID and LED "retrofits" into halogen headlamps are illegal. They're illegal clear across Europe and in all of the many countries that use European ECE headlight regulations. They're illegal in the US and Canada. Nevertheless, on the particular count of HID and LED "retrofits" into halogen headlamps, the world's regulators and engineers all say DON'T!
The only safe and legitimate HID and LED retrofit is one that replaces the entire headlamp—that is lens, reflector, bulb...the whole system—with optics designed for HID or LED usage.
Per usual, Mr. Stern doesn't pull any punches. I encourage you to read the full article.
Cheers,
JohnA
i read the Stern site. He references very old HID tests....3 of them.
I like his advice on wiring.
He is selling his products that happen to be old quartz stuff.
I can certainly understand why you might feel that way. I don't really have any standing at Rennlist. For most of the last 20 years I have been interested mainly in Longhoods so I have spent most of my time at the Early 911S Registry. I have tried to earn my keep by contributing a lot of information over the years and so I'm well known and well respected there. But I've done squat here so I just haven't earned the right to be believed when I bust in and make proclamations.. In any event, I believe that my stated position is valid. Here are a few more citations:
I'd just like to jump in here with my 2 penny's worth. I've just purchased a couple of LED headlamp bulbs here in the UK from a company called Classic Car LEDs (no affiliation) and they show an interesting picture of the cut off of their particular bulbs. To be honest I hadn't considered any of this until I read this thread but I then went back to their website because I grew concerned.
shows the light distribution of their bulbs and these are some of the latest tech in these types of bulb. Please take a look I'd like your opinion, thanks.
Well, for what it's worth ...
I recently installed some LED headlight bulbs in my F150 , my Subaru Impreza daily driver and my wife's Nissan Juke , and all i can say
is that it's a major improvement over the Philips and Sylvania Halogen bulbs we were using.
Would i install LED's in my 89 911 with H4 lights , no ... as the housing wasn't made to reflect the pattern of the LED bulbs, but for
daily driver street cars it's a worthy upgrade.
In my previous F150 i had installed a HID kit with ballasts and all and it would blind my neighbor's living room whenever
i came home at night, hate to imagine what it did to other motorists at the time !
Sealight makes good quality LED kits ... available on Amazon , i purchased four and it was truly plug and play, no
flickering or flasher issues as they all come with the canbus that eliminates all those issues.
I'm still undecided, my 87 Carrera is due to be out of the paint shop in about a month. I'll then fit the new LED bulbs. The guy I bought them from runs a business that specialises in producing LEDs for classic cars. I've had a chat with him and he's told me he is aware of these concerns and that his bulbs are designed to produce the correct pattern with the housing in my car.
Please do provide feedback , i can attest to the poor lighting from the OEM lights in my 89 , here in North America the lamps have to be DOT approved
so i imagine they would be somewhat certified if they're on the market !
Well, for what it's worth ...
I recently installed some LED headlight bulbs in my F150 , my Subaru Impreza daily driver and my wife's Nissan Juke , and all i can say
is that it's a major improvement over the Philips and Sylvania Halogen bulbs we were using.
Please tell me you also installed a lift kit on your F150. That way you can be 100% certain you are blinding everyone on the road.
Please tell me you also installed a lift kit on your F150. That way you are be 100% certain you are blinding everyone on the road.
If you don't have anything intelligent to add to this post , you can keep your smart *** remarks to yourself !
I'm sure there's more pickup trucks in Texas with lift kits and blinding lights than in Montreal, either way i used the correct DOT approved
bulbs and i have the proper reflectors for my headlights...
I haven’t read all the links but have done similar research.
In the UK and throughout Europe, it is illegal to use a replacement bulb that is not of the same technology as the original design intention. In other words ALL retrofit led bulbs are illegal for road use and NONE carry an E Mark (our DOT equivalent).
I don’t know if it has been covered but the trend for ‘bluey’ white LEDs is entirely marketing driven and is nothing to do with safety. It is in fact more dangerous since the wavelength of blue/white produces 50% more glare than yellow/white for the same intensity.
If you don't have anything intelligent to add to this post , you can keep your smart *** remarks to yourself !
I'm sure there's more pickup trucks in Texas with lift kits and blinding lights than in Montreal, either way i used the correct DOT approved
bulbs and i have the proper reflectors for my headlights...
12-24-2019, 01:57 PM
Don’t Use LED Bulbs in Halogen Reflector Headlights such as H4's
