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Speccing a new tow vehicle that may in 2022 be used to tow a two-car gooseneck trailer. Probably a 44'-46' or thereabouts. In speccing the truck now it for that heavier tow I'm looking for the total weight of a similar trailer carrying two Porsche race cars (around 3,000 lbs. each), at least four additional sets of wheels, cabinets, big nitrogen tank, and the like. Not that I need anything exact, but some ballpark numbers will help.
Even just the shipping weight from the invoice for your similar trailer empty would help--I can add the contents.
I am also checking with manufacturers, both all-aluminum trailers and steel frame, aluminum box trailers.
I have a 42’ Featherlight (50’ total length) gooseneck that I use to tow a spec Boxster and spec 996 with 4 extra sets of wheels and a whole lot of spare parts. It’s right at 15,000 pounds fully loaded. I’ve had 2 45’ ish goosenecks and both weighed right at 8000 pounds empty.
I have a 2007 Chevy 3500 DRW for all of them. It has been tuned and pulls them very well. I love it. Towed all over the US.
If you know your loaded axle weights, please also let the OP know.
He is trying to decide about SRW vs. DRW. The main issue for him is Rear axle load limit which may tip him over to DRW.
Igooz has correctly pointed me to rear GAWR as the limiting factor (as some variety of payload limit always is in spec'ing a tow vehicle).
The 2021 F-350 Crew Cab 8' bed 4x4 DRW maximum rear GAWR is 2,670 lbs more than the SRW (9,900 lbs. vs. 7,230 lbs) for the 4x4 and the payload is 1,950 lbs. more (6,530 lbs. vs. 4,580). Clearly the DRW is designed for gooseneck towing. If we use the very conservative 25% of trailer weight on the gooseneck’s pin (which is the percentage that the Ford Customer Needs Assessment Worksheet uses) and we assume a 15,000 lbs. trailer, the rear axle will get 3,750 lbs. from the trailer’s pin and 3,866 lbs as half the truck’s base curb weight for a total of 7,616 lbs. If that is the right analysis, then it looks like the GAWR is the limiting factor and the SRW 4x4 is right on or over the edge, especially when one adds options, passengers, and other contributors to payload.
Wouldn't the front and rear axles of the truck loaded with fuel and passengers/gear need to be weighed independently to arrive at the exact rear axle weight rather than taking 1/2 of the truck's curb weight?
Regardless, I don't think I'd want a SRW running that close, or slight over, GAWR for rear axle.
Wouldn't the front and rear axles of the truck loaded with fuel and passengers/gear need to be weighed independently to arrive at the exact rear axle weight rather than taking 1/2 of the truck's curb weight?
I would expect so, but I'm not clever enough to figure it in advance and too risk adverse to buy the truck and then weigh it each axle. :-)
I cannot find the curb weight per axle in Ford's documentation. It would stand to reason that the front axle with the heavy diesel engine over it would have more weight than the empty box over the rear, but by how much? If instead of 50/50 it is 60/40 weighted more on the front, then the rear axle would have 6,850 lbs. on it with the same other assumptions, a cushion of 380 lbs.
There must be a more refined way of figuring this out!
Does the attached Ford form answer my question and tell me the SRW is marginal?
Last edited by Phokaioglaukos; 09-24-2020 at 09:33 AM.
I would expect so, but I'm not clever enough to figure it in advance and too risk adverse to buy the truck and then weigh it each axle. :-)
I cannot find the curb weight per axle in Ford's documentation. It would stand to reason that the front axle with the heavy diesel engine over it would have more weight than the empty box over the rear, but by how much? If instead of 50/50 it is 60/40 weighted more on the front, then the rear axle would have 6,850 lbs. on it with the same other assumptions, a cushion of 380 lbs.
There must be a more refined way of figuring this out!
Take one for an extended "test drive" and go to a scale where you can weigh each axle? But it probably wouldn't have a full tank of fuel and you wouldn't have all your gear and other passengers along......
I would expect so, but I'm not clever enough to figure it in advance and too risk adverse to buy the truck and then weigh it each axle. :-)
I cannot find the curb weight per axle in Ford's documentation. It would stand to reason that the front axle with the heavy diesel engine over it would have more weight than the empty box over the rear, but by how much? If instead of 50/50 it is 60/40 weighted more on the front, then the rear axle would have 6,850 lbs. on it with the same other assumptions, a cushion of 380 lbs.
There must be a more refined way of figuring this out!
Does the attached Ford form answer my question and tell me the SRW is marginal?
Your form shows GVWR as 20,000 lb. That seems high for a SRW Super Duty. My F250 with max towing package has 10,800 GVWR. Is the 20,000 the max gross trailer weight?
BTW, I did a check of my door placard today to see what the max axle ratings are:
Truck: 2020 F250 4WD SRW Max Trailer Package
GVWR: 10,800 lb
Front GAWR: 5,200 lb
Rear GAWR: 6,340 lb
I stopped by the scale on the way home, 2020 (or 2019) F350/superduty/164”WB/4x4/Powerstroke/99% full diesel tank/average hardworking American driver.
60:40 F:R weight is a good rule of thumb on empty Diesel truck; and I may own 25 of these trucks right now.
My friend owns a 45’ Featherlite, 3 axle, and he told me that this the lightest gooseneck and it weighs around 7,900 lbs empty. He is pretty intense and accurate.
if you buy the same trailer, you will most likely end up with another 8,000 lbs of cars and stuff in the trailer, so ~16K gross.
Your 25% at gooseneck is a good estimate if you load the trailer properly (big IF), and that adds ~4K on your gooseneck hitch or 5th wheel.
of course, 4000lbs does not all add on the truck’s rear axle, since the load is fore of the rear axle, so let’s say 3,500lbs. With my truck you will be 6,580 before adding extended tank, 150lb Great Dane dog, etc.
Gooseneck = Dually and be done with the analysis. I don't care if a SRW can technically tow a 15k gooseneck (which it probably can't, on paper anyhow), a DRW is always going to be safer and more stable. Get the right tool for the job.
BTW OP - unless you're getting an XL, your SRW payload won't be anywhere near 4.5k. Think more like low 3's. So you're overloaded from the second you hook your trailer up.
Your form shows GVWR as 20,000 lb. That seems high for a SRW Super Duty. My F250 with max towing package has 10,800 GVWR. Is the 20,000 the max gross trailer weight?
BTW, I did a check of my door placard today to see what the max axle ratings are:
Truck: 2020 F250 4WD SRW Max Trailer Package
GVWR: 10,800 lb
Front GAWR: 5,200 lb
Rear GAWR: 6,340 lb
Conditions: estimated 31 gallons in 34 gallon tank, +/- 1 gallon
Cargo & passenger weight: 245 lbs (consisted of me and a few small personal items in front seat + my backpack in back seat that weights ~16 lbs)
Front axle weight: 4,840 lb.
Rear axle weight: 3,260 lb.
Total vehicle weight: 8,080 lb. (yes, this is 20 lb. less than sum of F/R, chalk it up to round off error, scale had 20 lb resolution)
NOTE: My truck is Platinum trim level, other trim levels will weigh differently, albeit not a huge amount.
This results in almost exactly 60/40 front/rear weight distribution for an empty bed 2017-2021 F250 with 6.7 Powerstroke.
The only thing my truck has that might make it a little heavier in the back than some SRW F250 trucks is the Dana rear axle that comes with the max tow capacity package. This is the same axle that comes standard on the F350.
If this scale is accurate in these weight ranges (have to assume it is, "certified" right?) my truck with me and a full tank of fuel is 2,800 lb below its GVWR of 10,800 lb.
Your form shows GVWR as 20,000 lb. That seems high for a SRW Super Duty.
You are right. The 2020 F-350 SRW 4x4 Crew Cab GVWR tops out at 12,400 lbs. The same in DRW is 14,000 lbs. Corrected sheet attached.
Originally Posted by PGas32
BTW OP - unless you're getting an XL, your SRW payload won't be anywhere near 4.5k. Think more like low 3's.
Maximum payload is 4,580 lbs. HERE. I assume you are reminding me to update the options content weight for the spec of my truck. I don't have those details for the 2021 or 2020, but I do for the 2019. Here are the additions:
23 tires
57 Lariat trim crew cab diesel
118 Gooseneck understructure and hitch kit
58 long bed
13 power mirrors
25 power seats
20 spray in bed liner
30 Tonneau cover
319 total
There are a number of single digit option weights, so call it 325 lbs. of options, an increase of 25 over what was previously in the worksheet.
09-18-2020, 01:12 PM
Need weight info for a two-car gooseneck trailer
But it probably wouldn't have a full tank of fuel and you wouldn't have all your gear and other passengers along......
