stout

Lol! Good point. I don't think I have ever been pleasantly surprised by a real curb weight when I've weighed a Porsche.

Okay, actually there was one time I was pleasantly surprised: when I stripped my 914 down for paint. Still "drivable" (though not legally), it scaled at 1,591 pounds. I am sure I would not be as happy with its curb weight now that it's back together, and with a heavier engine in.

Needsdecaf

Pete, is there any way you can get more info on this? I’m very, very curious and excited in a good way. I’ve done the math here: https://rennlist.com/forums/taycan-a...l#post16085299 but basically, the numbers don’t jive at all. If that run is real, and I believe it is, then they have severely overstated the car’s consumption. 260 kWh/100 km is at least 25% higher than what would be needed to make that run with the car’s pack size. Essentially in ICE terms, it would be like saying a car has a 10 gallon tank and gets 30 MPG combined.....and then driving the car 500 miles. Either the car has a bigger tank (doubtful) or they really screwed up the numbers on consumption....way conservative, opposite what would be expected. The WLTP range would be correct if the published consumption is right....but as I said, wither they didn’t do that run, or the car is a lot less thirsty than they are reporting.

Very intriguiging. And I would take back a lot of the negativity I’ve expressed toward the car if it had a real world range of 290 miles. In a highway run, that’s excellent.

Needsdecaf

Dieselgate May have scared the crap out of them.

signes

Pete, curious if for comparison you've driven the Model S, especially a P100D? Likely the most relevant comparison at this point.

stout

No, I have not. I have thought about endeavoring to spend some time in one ahead of driving the Taycan, but can see disadvantage alongside the obvious advantage: Right now, I can come at the Taycan purely from a Porsche perspective in terms of how it should drive. There are many, many test drivers who will come to the Taycan from a Tesla et al perspective—and it would take me weeks/months (if not years) to accumulate their knowledge/experience. And some of them are excellent at what they do. I can always try the Tesla P100D later to form my own impression. Might be interesting to do so the wrong way around: Taycan > Model S.

I have driven pure EVs, but it's been a while since I have driven a pure EV I can barely remember. I feel like there's something since the Leaf, but can't remember it. I remember thinking the Leaf was a pod...actually pretty quick through the old "instant test loop" by the Excellence offices, but devoid of any feedback, interest, or fun. It was, in a word, bland. It was then 918 on E-Power mode that had me rethinking whether an electric Porsche could be fun...as some of my favorite miles came without the V8.

Lapis

I test drove Tesla Model S about 3 years ago, when I had an Audi RS7 as my DD, and was underwhelmed. Taycan will prompt me to go try out Tesla again for due diligence before buying, which makes me wonder aloud whether competition from Porsche, Audi and others might actually be a net positive for Tesla by increasing the size of the EV pie and causing many to do the same?

Needsdecaf

Bingo.

stout

Probably not anytime soon, unfortunately. For now, have to treat it as indicator rather than fact. Which is fine.

I think your math adds up, and that's part of my growing suspicion that a lot of the carping about specs/numbers is (while perfectly understandable) premature. We need to see what the cars do out in the real world, much in the same way we are either pleasantly surprised or not so pleasantly disappointed when our own sports cars exceed or fail to meet EPA fuel efficiency projections...when we are paying attention, that is.

Range anxiety is a thing, and for good reason. My "need" is trips from LA to SF, and theoretical use for vacations, etc. The reality is there are very, very few days in normal life when I do 100 miles in a day in my 911, let alone 50. Or 20, sometimes. Someone has mentioned battery protection, and degradation re: repeatable performance, and I think that is a critical consideration, too.

There's a lot of info needed to form a better opinion…here to learn along with everyone else.

993Mpls

I look at Wednesday's Taycan launch as the launch of a product line, and potentially, the creation of an entirely new category. If the performance stands up in the real world (Ring time, consecutive number of max acceleration launches, max distance in 24 hours, etc) with Porsche quality and fit-and-finish, then the Turbo and Turbo S might be the first cars in, I don't know, the "Ultra premium sports sedan EV" segment.

As far as the pricing, they're just harvesting the people willing to pay a premium price for a premium product - just like Tesla did when they took 100k deposits for a $35k Model 3 and then started shipping $54k Model 3s to people who would pay for them.

Don't want to buy a Taycan Turbo S for $185? Wait for the GTS, or the 4/S, or the base. If you're in the market for a $100k Tesla, the thousand dollar deposit you put down a year ago is immaterial to your finances. Or get a refund and buy a Tesla, if you want.

My bottom line is that virtually none of the commentators here other than Stout and Droops83 have any real-life experience with the Taycan. Porsche is spending what, $6B+ on electric cars and infrastructure? As smart and successful as we all may be, I'd wager that Porsche has studied this longer and just might actually know what they are doing.

stout

Greetings from Copenhagen—just got in and will spend a few days driving the Taycan from here to Hamburg. Looking forward to it, and will treat the event as I have with cars like the GT3 Touring, Carrera T, etc...in other words, I will share my impressions here—and am happy to field questions from you.

May just need to edit the opening line in this thread's title, as it moves from first check-out to first drive.

Needsdecaf

Sweet! If you meet Alex Dykes of Alex on Autos, say hello. He's a good guy and looks like he may be on this wave with you.

Looking forward to your usual excellent "Pete on the ground" impressions!

I'm sure I will think of more questions, but right now, if you can figure out how to display average consumption over your trip, or over certain portions of your trip, and are allowed to report that consumption, I think we would all be very curious. Aside from that, interested in hearing just how well it disguises it's weight. Also, what does the max regen mode feel like if there is no one-pedal driving. That's got me curious.

Thanks Pete!

daveo4porsche

Q: any range management assistance software like Tesla’s burn down chart when a destination is in the nav unit...see chart in Roadtrip model X thread
Q: when using L2 charging can you adjust the amps to lower than the charging station’s advertised setting
Q: does scheduled charging have weekday vs weekend settings?
Q: is the scheduled charging and any L2 charging amp settings saved per gps location?
Q: does nav show estimated battery percentage at destination?
Q: what is the taper rate on battery charging when using fast charging - you’ll need to be at 10% or less i’m sure - at what battery percentage does the charge rate start to tail off..
Q: can you help us all understand porsche’s thinking on two charge ports on the car on opposite sides of the car
Q: what is the performance like at below 10% battery - in low battery conditions Tesla starts to mute the drive trains power and responsiness
Q: what is your observed range in terms of wh/mile?
Q: is there a good display that shows current kw consumption
Q: is there a noticeable difference with AC on/off in consumption
Q: i’d like to know what it’s cold weather penalty is - but you can’t control the weather
Q: charge times at fast charger to various percentages would be nice, 25%, 40%, 60%, 80%
Q: if you have time and curiosity how long does it take to top that sucker off from 90-100%
Q: does the car show you the charge rate while it’s charging and plugged in
Q: what level of remote software control can you do via app from your phone?
Q: I’d love to hear charge rate data at different speed chargers - 50 kW, 150 kW and 270 kW
Q: under braking is there in indication of regen rate?
Q: +1 for careful review of the blended braking - how good is it and can you control it sufficiently to avoid engaging the friction pads
Q: how clearly does the car indicate that it’s delaying charging due to a current schedule - some cars you really don’t know if it’s going to charge and when it will start charging
Q: how easy is it see what current charge settings are, and modify the settings to accommodate peak, mid-peak, off-peak charging by time of day - Chevy’s UI is horrendous for example and your need a CS degree to understand it.
Q: how much does the built in Nav “understand” chargers - i.e. does it show chargers on the map (L2 vs. L3?) - when planing a route beyond battery range, does it integrate charging stops into the “route” planning

I love @stouts write ups and have enormous respect - but I’m going to spot Porsche the belief the car will drive great - but I’m trying to assess how good of an EV they’ve made - it being a good car is a forgone conclusion (although I’ll enjoy anyone’s driving impressions) what is unclear and has been poorly communicated is how well porsche has equipped the car to be an EV - questions above IMHO will help illuminate porche’s progress in the total car department - and EV adapting in particular.

Loess

I'm curious to see real charging speeds and consumption. Porsche says on the press drive from OSL to CPH they recorded a charging power of up to 258kW and on one of their videos they were showing it charging at 750V.

Needsdecaf

stout

Good morning, everyone. About to head out, and just wanted to address the above—to say that's understandable, but that I won't spot Porsche that, because I have driven plenty of good/fast cars, some from Porsche, that left me wanting when it came to fun and involvement. So we will see. And to say that I may not be your best horse for evaluating the Taycan as an EV, as there are others on this trip with much more EV expertise than me, but I'll do my best to provide some insight. My main objective today is to approach the car as a Porsche first, as I view it as one of the most pivotal points in Porsche history.

Driving impressions are embargoed, but I'll check in with what I can, as I can!