Fuel Tank Strainer Removal
10-09-2016, 12:22 PM
#1
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Fuel Tank Strainer Removal
Many threads on the topic, and I think I've read them all (or most at least).
I've got the tank down, and while it's down I wanted to take the strainer out to:
1. Inspect it and get a new one if needed
2. Apply some anti-seize to the threads of the holder.
I've done pretty much everything that I've seen suggested:
1. Hose Clamp on outside
2. Ammonia Soak to remove aluminum oxide.
3. Evapo-Rust on the inside to do what the name suggests
4. Freeze the outside.
5. Apply PB and other anti-corrosion solutions on the outside, with the tank facing up and facing down. I done this over the course of many evenings.
I have not done:
1. Using an impact wrench to nudge it tight and loose (don't have a deep 17mm socket. yet).
2. Applied heat.
I've been using a crescent wrench to try to loosen, and it doesn't seem to be moving. BUT....I might not be putting enough behind it due to fear.
So...do I:
1. Leave well enough alone, and leave as-is. The strainer *seems* Ok when I look from the top, but I can't definitively tell it's condition
2. Grow a pair and give it more force on the wrench
3. Do the acetone / ATF mix, dump it into tank and let it soak from the inside
4. Go gung ho and really put some muscle on the wrench, knowing that the 928intl half off sale is a couple of months away
5. Apply more PB on the outside and develop more patience
6. Apply heat to the holder. Have been fearful of doing so as I don't want to soften the tank plastic.
7. Some combo of above
8. Other?
I've got ample time here, so there's no rush at all to get it resolved
Thanks!
I've got the tank down, and while it's down I wanted to take the strainer out to:
1. Inspect it and get a new one if needed
2. Apply some anti-seize to the threads of the holder.
I've done pretty much everything that I've seen suggested:
1. Hose Clamp on outside
2. Ammonia Soak to remove aluminum oxide.
3. Evapo-Rust on the inside to do what the name suggests
4. Freeze the outside.
5. Apply PB and other anti-corrosion solutions on the outside, with the tank facing up and facing down. I done this over the course of many evenings.
I have not done:
1. Using an impact wrench to nudge it tight and loose (don't have a deep 17mm socket. yet).
2. Applied heat.
I've been using a crescent wrench to try to loosen, and it doesn't seem to be moving. BUT....I might not be putting enough behind it due to fear.
So...do I:
1. Leave well enough alone, and leave as-is. The strainer *seems* Ok when I look from the top, but I can't definitively tell it's condition
2. Grow a pair and give it more force on the wrench
3. Do the acetone / ATF mix, dump it into tank and let it soak from the inside
4. Go gung ho and really put some muscle on the wrench, knowing that the 928intl half off sale is a couple of months away
5. Apply more PB on the outside and develop more patience
6. Apply heat to the holder. Have been fearful of doing so as I don't want to soften the tank plastic.
7. Some combo of above
8. Other?
I've got ample time here, so there's no rush at all to get it resolved
Thanks!
10-09-2016, 12:54 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
Ryan, a couple of thoughts: First, any sort of chemical applied from the outside is useless-- the seal is between the fitting and the tank, so any liquid applied from the outside will never get to the threads. Inside, yes, so maybe try the acetone/ATF.
Also a crescent wrench is not going to cut it. It's good for working on toilets, but that's it. Get a proper 1/2" drive socket (17mm sounds too small, check it) and a long-handle ratchet if you don't already have one (e.g. Craftsman flex-head). You still need to be careful about applying too much torque, even with the external clamp.
The trick for dealing with recalcitrant fasteners of any sort is tools and attitude. That fitting is just laughing at your crescent wrench, saying "Is that your best shot? Haha!!". No way is it going to budge. You need to convince it that you will win, that resistance is futile, and that any delay will just cause it pain. Scatter around a few big things like the impact wrench, the big Milwaukee hole-hawg drill with a 1" bit (useless here, but intimidating), the short-handled sledge hammer, you get the idea.
Mark the fitting so you can tell if it budged. Then try an opening move that promises more to come, like the impact wrench with the air pressure turned down. It might be sufficiently intimidating, and impact tools also work well to break up corrosion. If it budges at all then get in some more penetrating fluid. Going back and forth-- once it starts to loosen-- is also good to help get the penetrating oil in there. Keep escalating until it budges.
Or just leave it. If it looks OK and is not leaking then there is little to be gained.
Also a crescent wrench is not going to cut it. It's good for working on toilets, but that's it. Get a proper 1/2" drive socket (17mm sounds too small, check it) and a long-handle ratchet if you don't already have one (e.g. Craftsman flex-head). You still need to be careful about applying too much torque, even with the external clamp.
The trick for dealing with recalcitrant fasteners of any sort is tools and attitude. That fitting is just laughing at your crescent wrench, saying "Is that your best shot? Haha!!". No way is it going to budge. You need to convince it that you will win, that resistance is futile, and that any delay will just cause it pain. Scatter around a few big things like the impact wrench, the big Milwaukee hole-hawg drill with a 1" bit (useless here, but intimidating), the short-handled sledge hammer, you get the idea.
Mark the fitting so you can tell if it budged. Then try an opening move that promises more to come, like the impact wrench with the air pressure turned down. It might be sufficiently intimidating, and impact tools also work well to break up corrosion. If it budges at all then get in some more penetrating fluid. Going back and forth-- once it starts to loosen-- is also good to help get the penetrating oil in there. Keep escalating until it budges.
Or just leave it. If it looks OK and is not leaking then there is little to be gained.
10-09-2016, 01:06 PM
#4
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Thanks, Jim.
I thought I saw a little bit of space between the plastic from the tank and the aluminum fitting, so was hoping the penetrant would work it's way in, hence my applying with the tank at varying angles.
I was getting some flex in the tank with the wrench, but will get me some more appropriate tools.
I like the intimidation approach. Think I'll throw a Sawzall into the mix, too 
I don't currently have any leak, so no issue there. But was just worried about the state of the strainer since I can't see the entire thing while inside.
Also a crescent wrench is not going to cut it. It's good for working on toilets, but that's it. Get a proper 1/2" drive socket (17mm sounds too small, check it) and a long-handle ratchet if you don't already have one (e.g. Craftsman flex-head). You still need to be careful about applying too much torque, even with the external clamp.
The trick for dealing with recalcitrant fasteners of any sort is tools and attitude. That fitting is just laughing at your crescent wrench, saying "Is that your best shot? Haha!!". No way is it going to budge. You need to convince it that you will win, that resistance is futile, and that any delay will just cause it pain. Scatter around a few big things like the impact wrench, the big Milwaukee hole-hawg drill with a 1" bit (useless here, but intimidating), the short-handled sledge hammer, you get the idea.
I don't currently have any leak, so no issue there. But was just worried about the state of the strainer since I can't see the entire thing while inside.
10-09-2016, 01:10 PM
#5
PUT DOWN THE CRESCENT WRENCH!! Use the impact, gently, a little bump at a time. When I finally got mine out I discovered that there was a small relief hole drilled into the threads that was filled with a white plastic sort of stuff which keeps the strainer from loosening once installed. If I were to do it again, I would do this-
https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...al-thread.html
and then use a heavy duty soldering iron, holding it to the fuel strainer to heat it which will soften up the plastic plug and allow the strainer to turn in the collar. Don't heat the plastic tank, that will just cause you problems. Of course make sure that the all of the gas is out of the tank and no residual fumes present.
The replacement strainer I got from Porsche did not have that hole drilled into it and hence no plastic plug. If you look at pics of OE strainers you will see the hole/holes I'm talking about. I thought it was dirt in the threads. I used a dental pic to try to clean them. I bent the pic. So I got a stronger pic and was able to pry the plug out. It took a lot of force and when it let go it flew off and I could not find it. I look for quite awhile. I wanted to take pics and document why these are such a bitch to get out.
Be patient.
https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...al-thread.html
and then use a heavy duty soldering iron, holding it to the fuel strainer to heat it which will soften up the plastic plug and allow the strainer to turn in the collar. Don't heat the plastic tank, that will just cause you problems. Of course make sure that the all of the gas is out of the tank and no residual fumes present.
The replacement strainer I got from Porsche did not have that hole drilled into it and hence no plastic plug. If you look at pics of OE strainers you will see the hole/holes I'm talking about. I thought it was dirt in the threads. I used a dental pic to try to clean them. I bent the pic. So I got a stronger pic and was able to pry the plug out. It took a lot of force and when it let go it flew off and I could not find it. I look for quite awhile. I wanted to take pics and document why these are such a bitch to get out.
Be patient.
10-09-2016, 01:20 PM
#6
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
PUT DOWN THE CRESCENT WRENCH!! Use the impact, gently, a little bump at a time. When I finally got mine out I discovered that there was a small relief hole drilled into the threads that was filled with a white plastic sort of stuff which keeps the strainer from loosening once installed. If I were to do it again, I would do this-
https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...al-thread.html
and then use a heavy duty soldering iron, holding it to the fuel strainer to heat it which will soften up the plastic plug and allow the strainer to turn in the collar. Don't heat the plastic tank, that will just cause you problems. Of course make sure that the all of the gas is out of the tank and no residual fumes present.
The replacement strainer I got from Porsche did not have that hole drilled into it and hence no plastic plug. If you look at pics of OE strainers you will see the hole/holes I'm talking about. I thought it was dirt in the threads. I used a dental pic to try to clean them. I bent the pic. So I got a stronger pic and was able to pry the plug out. It took a lot of force and when it let go it flew off and I could not find it. I look for quite awhile. I wanted to take pics and document why these are such a bitch to get out.
Be patient.
https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...al-thread.html
and then use a heavy duty soldering iron, holding it to the fuel strainer to heat it which will soften up the plastic plug and allow the strainer to turn in the collar. Don't heat the plastic tank, that will just cause you problems. Of course make sure that the all of the gas is out of the tank and no residual fumes present.
The replacement strainer I got from Porsche did not have that hole drilled into it and hence no plastic plug. If you look at pics of OE strainers you will see the hole/holes I'm talking about. I thought it was dirt in the threads. I used a dental pic to try to clean them. I bent the pic. So I got a stronger pic and was able to pry the plug out. It took a lot of force and when it let go it flew off and I could not find it. I look for quite awhile. I wanted to take pics and document why these are such a bitch to get out.
Be patient.
I'm not quite following your suggestion regarding the soldering iron. Are you suggesting applying it to the strainer like in my pic above?
10-09-2016, 01:46 PM
#7
Heat the metal part of the strainer from the outside, at the outlet hole. That will soften up the plastic plug.
Your strainer looks like it is in good condition.
My problem was that the gasket between the strainer and the tank had deteriorated and it developed a small leak. If you can see a gap between the strainer lip and tank, yours might be going. If you have no leak, I wouldn't mess with it.
Your strainer looks like it is in good condition.
My problem was that the gasket between the strainer and the tank had deteriorated and it developed a small leak. If you can see a gap between the strainer lip and tank, yours might be going. If you have no leak, I wouldn't mess with it.
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10-09-2016, 02:35 PM
#9
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
10-09-2016, 04:44 PM
#10
Chronic Tool Dropper
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Some thoughts from the experience with Jim Chambers' car here a month ago.
-- Inspect through the level sender opening. If the screen is intact (and yours appears to be intact) and there are no external leaks, be happy, live long and prosper.
-- If you do decide to remove the strainer, follow Jim Corenman's advice with the socket, at minimum. Using a Crescent or even the "proper" box wrench applies a lot of lateral force to the connection, when you really want just twisting. Lateral force adds to the chance of distorting or straining the bond between the plastic and the threaded insert.
-- Follow the guidance on freezing the strainer insert. Easy options include "canned air" with the can inverted, same but with refrigerant or other freeze spray, or dry ice per the previous suggestions.
-- Confirming GJB's info, that "gap" between the tank neck and the screw-in fitting is supposed to be occupied by a rubber-like seal. In Jim Chambers' car, that seal had completely disintegrated and scattered as orange dust. That seal is what's supposed to keep the fuel inside the tank, although the corrosion in the threads often seems to supplement that sealing.
-- Contrary to GJB's info, we did not find any holes or plastic pins designed to retain the screw-in piece to the tank insert. The steel tank insert itself has holes in it that are filled with plastic from the tank molding process, probably to keep it from turning. Those holes and the plastic in them are deeper in the insert than the threads on the screw-in piece will reach, so won't interfere with removing or installing the thread-in piece.
----
The aluminum screw-in piece on Jim Chambers' tank was corroded quite well to insert. Impact and long-handled bar with socket ended up spinning the insert in the tank, so both pieces were removed together for more work on the bench.
The tank itself was fine with the pieces removed. Jim did a bunch of cleanup of the tank, including the nose where the insert lives. While he worked on that, I made a clamping fixture to hold the insert piece in the vise without distorting or collapsing it. The corrosion bond was so strong that even with a week of soaking in ATF/Acetone mix, it wouldn't budge. I ended up twisting the hex and rounding it, even with a six-point socket. The aluminum hex parts sheared off, leaving an ugly torn area that guaranteed that replacement was the only option. At that point I drilled out the hole in the middle, big enough to push a hacksaw blade through. Fitted the blade to a saw frame and carefully made radial cuts in the aluminum out to the steel tank insert threads. A couple intersecting cuts allowed me to collapse the aluminum from the steel, and from there extraction was no problem.
The steel insert was given a bath in a rust remover for a bit to get all the obvious corrosion removed. The sleeve was then cleaned thoroughly in prep for reinsertion.
I made a small "press" tool from a piece of 3/8" all-thread and some nuts and washers. I found that a 3/8" fender washer in my collection has the same OD as the tank insert, while a 1/2" USS flat washer OD is a perfect fit inside the steel tank insert. Some other hardware-bin bearing-retainer washers happened to be the right ID to fit over the flange lip at the end of the tank nozzle/neck, so we had a way to keep the sleeve square to the "puller", plus a way to keep the pressure at the outside end limited to the area around that flange lip without collapsing the lip or the nozzle flange area.
With everything clean, we applied a thin but continuous coating of J-B Weld to both the inside of the tank and the outside of the insert. I added some mechanic's wire to each end of the all-thread rod, secured with wire ties, then passed the tool and the insert into the tank via the level sender hole, after threading the pull wire out through the bottom opening. The wire on the back end was used to guide the insert into position in the tank outlet nozzle. Then nuts were tightened on the all thread and washers stack to draw the sleeve in, perfectly square with the face and firmly up against the flanged end of the tank nozzle. We left the tool in there with tension on it for a day while the epoxy set up, then removed it by pulling on the back-end wire and out through the sender opening.
The new strainer and fitting were carefully prep'd with Teflon-based pipe sealing paste on the threads, and Hylomar sealer on the neoprene seal itself and the tank flange and lip. The strainer went in painlessly. We snugged it up enough to seat the gasket well but not much more, then leak-tested by putting a little fuel back into the tank after installation. After a leak-free day, Jim added more fuel to further the test, and again no leaks for a few days of observation. We called it good and finished the installation with new GB hoses, a new pump and filter, and finally the pump cover, down from the lift, and a test drive. Success!
---
Marine Sta-Bil has some good features, including mopping up moisture from ethanol-added fuels that will otherwise corrode aluminum and some steel parts in the fuel system. I strongly recommend that folks use that, especially for cars that are driven less than regularly. The water settles out over time, and ends up puddling under the fuel right at the strainer connection in the bottom of the tank. Anyway, some simple care with the right fuel preservative can help you avoid this and other corrosion-related fuel system maladies.
I'll add pictures and a more complete write-up to Jim Chambers' fuel tank thread soon.
-- Inspect through the level sender opening. If the screen is intact (and yours appears to be intact) and there are no external leaks, be happy, live long and prosper.
-- If you do decide to remove the strainer, follow Jim Corenman's advice with the socket, at minimum. Using a Crescent or even the "proper" box wrench applies a lot of lateral force to the connection, when you really want just twisting. Lateral force adds to the chance of distorting or straining the bond between the plastic and the threaded insert.
-- Follow the guidance on freezing the strainer insert. Easy options include "canned air" with the can inverted, same but with refrigerant or other freeze spray, or dry ice per the previous suggestions.
-- Confirming GJB's info, that "gap" between the tank neck and the screw-in fitting is supposed to be occupied by a rubber-like seal. In Jim Chambers' car, that seal had completely disintegrated and scattered as orange dust. That seal is what's supposed to keep the fuel inside the tank, although the corrosion in the threads often seems to supplement that sealing.
-- Contrary to GJB's info, we did not find any holes or plastic pins designed to retain the screw-in piece to the tank insert. The steel tank insert itself has holes in it that are filled with plastic from the tank molding process, probably to keep it from turning. Those holes and the plastic in them are deeper in the insert than the threads on the screw-in piece will reach, so won't interfere with removing or installing the thread-in piece.
----
The aluminum screw-in piece on Jim Chambers' tank was corroded quite well to insert. Impact and long-handled bar with socket ended up spinning the insert in the tank, so both pieces were removed together for more work on the bench.
The tank itself was fine with the pieces removed. Jim did a bunch of cleanup of the tank, including the nose where the insert lives. While he worked on that, I made a clamping fixture to hold the insert piece in the vise without distorting or collapsing it. The corrosion bond was so strong that even with a week of soaking in ATF/Acetone mix, it wouldn't budge. I ended up twisting the hex and rounding it, even with a six-point socket. The aluminum hex parts sheared off, leaving an ugly torn area that guaranteed that replacement was the only option. At that point I drilled out the hole in the middle, big enough to push a hacksaw blade through. Fitted the blade to a saw frame and carefully made radial cuts in the aluminum out to the steel tank insert threads. A couple intersecting cuts allowed me to collapse the aluminum from the steel, and from there extraction was no problem.
The steel insert was given a bath in a rust remover for a bit to get all the obvious corrosion removed. The sleeve was then cleaned thoroughly in prep for reinsertion.
I made a small "press" tool from a piece of 3/8" all-thread and some nuts and washers. I found that a 3/8" fender washer in my collection has the same OD as the tank insert, while a 1/2" USS flat washer OD is a perfect fit inside the steel tank insert. Some other hardware-bin bearing-retainer washers happened to be the right ID to fit over the flange lip at the end of the tank nozzle/neck, so we had a way to keep the sleeve square to the "puller", plus a way to keep the pressure at the outside end limited to the area around that flange lip without collapsing the lip or the nozzle flange area.
With everything clean, we applied a thin but continuous coating of J-B Weld to both the inside of the tank and the outside of the insert. I added some mechanic's wire to each end of the all-thread rod, secured with wire ties, then passed the tool and the insert into the tank via the level sender hole, after threading the pull wire out through the bottom opening. The wire on the back end was used to guide the insert into position in the tank outlet nozzle. Then nuts were tightened on the all thread and washers stack to draw the sleeve in, perfectly square with the face and firmly up against the flanged end of the tank nozzle. We left the tool in there with tension on it for a day while the epoxy set up, then removed it by pulling on the back-end wire and out through the sender opening.
The new strainer and fitting were carefully prep'd with Teflon-based pipe sealing paste on the threads, and Hylomar sealer on the neoprene seal itself and the tank flange and lip. The strainer went in painlessly. We snugged it up enough to seat the gasket well but not much more, then leak-tested by putting a little fuel back into the tank after installation. After a leak-free day, Jim added more fuel to further the test, and again no leaks for a few days of observation. We called it good and finished the installation with new GB hoses, a new pump and filter, and finally the pump cover, down from the lift, and a test drive. Success!
---
Marine Sta-Bil has some good features, including mopping up moisture from ethanol-added fuels that will otherwise corrode aluminum and some steel parts in the fuel system. I strongly recommend that folks use that, especially for cars that are driven less than regularly. The water settles out over time, and ends up puddling under the fuel right at the strainer connection in the bottom of the tank. Anyway, some simple care with the right fuel preservative can help you avoid this and other corrosion-related fuel system maladies.
I'll add pictures and a more complete write-up to Jim Chambers' fuel tank thread soon.
10-09-2016, 09:17 PM
#11
Three Wheelin'
I retort with the obvious video of the Cardinals winning the world series...but there's so many to choose from, it was very difficult.
Let's see, this is one of my recent favorites Game 6, 2011 Series:
I couldn't fine any for the cubs, at least not since television or radio was invented, so I picked this for you, enjoy:
10-10-2016, 12:33 AM
#13
Three Wheelin'
Was it a confession about buying a championship?
Mic drop 3, 2,1 ....
10-10-2016, 01:02 AM
#14
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Fair retort. There are many fans who are like in the video. My wife & I are not among them.
On the bright side, I don't live in or near St. Louis.
**EDIT**
No. My edit above was to state I hate the Cardinals. As most people do.
On the bright side, I don't live in or near St. Louis.
**EDIT**
No. My edit above was to state I hate the Cardinals. As most people do.
10-10-2016, 12:19 PM
#15
Three Wheelin'
Sigh, well unfortunately the borderline MR hillbilly population here was my weak point.
Well played...
I concede, the thread police will be closing in on me soon anyway.
Part of my hostility with your team stems from an event in the mid 90's, when apparently, I was given some type of date rape drug in my "Old Style" by someone within your organization, while I sat in the bleachers at Wrigley.
I remember some type of Cubby Bar, but nothing else until I woke up at 3am with an empty wallet, and third degree sun burns...
Well played...
I concede, the thread police will be closing in on me soon anyway.
Part of my hostility with your team stems from an event in the mid 90's, when apparently, I was given some type of date rape drug in my "Old Style" by someone within your organization, while I sat in the bleachers at Wrigley.
I remember some type of Cubby Bar, but nothing else until I woke up at 3am with an empty wallet, and third degree sun burns...