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I've attached a pic below of the outside of the fitting. I'm not seeing any sort of rubber grommet, but I'm not sure if I should be seeing it there and, since there's no leak if I should worry about it.
If I should replace while the tanks out, I picked up some deep 1/2" sockets yesterday and will work on it.
If I should leave it as is, I'll just proceed with the tank cleaning. I've already done a run of hot water and detergent, as you suggested previously Bob.
I've got a couple of cans of mineral spirits I was going to use for a second cleaning, but I'm concerned that it'll affect the existing (presumably good) strainer. Is this a risk?
If there is no evidence of fuel leaking from the area pictured, I would leave it alone until there is. Mine was leaking badly. It was only fixed with Bob's wisdom and help (actually I was the helper). Left to my own devices it would have been a new $1100 tank from the fatherland. Be careful.
The gap between the strainer insert and the tank nozzle end looks pretty full of the seal in your picture. The seal is ~4mm thick, and sits in a groove in the strainer insert that starts just inside the outside edge of the strainer insert. On Jim Chambers' car, that seal had disintegrated to powder. Take a small probe and verify that the seal is intact. If it seems to be there and there are no leaks, let it sit as-found and call it good. The fun we had was interesting but not something I'd wish on folks when it isn't necessary.
For those playing along at home: I suspect that the tank seal we are talking about will eventually be an issue for all of our cars. Working on Jim's car, I went through a list of possible engineering changes, including adding an o-ring inside between the end of the tank insert and the end of the nozzle, but tossed that though as we looked at how the factory seal is supposed to work. We were fortunate to be able to do a four-handed extraction of the strainer and the tank insert together without damaging the end of the tank nozzle. Had the seal been there intact, it would have been a lot more likely that the tank nozzle would have been damaged, pinched between the seal and the tank insert as we twisted. There were no good used tanks available from our normal sources, so a new tank was the only fall-back if we were not successful with our repair.
Following along that line of thinking, if you do decide to pull the strainer with the tank insert still attached, get as much of the seal pulled out as you can. This will be tedious work with a small pick or spatula tool, all without risking any nicks or other damage to the tank plastic as you pull the hardened rubber seal out. If you nick or otherwise damage the outer face of the tank nozzle where the seal is supposed to fit, you risk a leak when you reassemble.
Bob is right on as usual. The problem with a used tank if acquired is two fold. First, if the strainer is in place, it is likely to be leaking or soon to leak. In that case you are back to square one, needing to remove the strainer with all attendant problems. Or if the strainer has been removed, is the insert still solidly attached to the tank nozzle.
I'll leave the mineral spirits answer to Bob.
I don't thing mineral spirits will hurt anything, bu I'm also not sure what it will help. The strainer is like a nylon stocking supported by the rings and spars. In your picture through the level sender hole, you can see about half of the strainer. Not sure what you expect to gain putting mineral spirits in there, since gasoline generally dissolves more stuff than mineral spirits. In other words, if the gas didn't soften and remove it, mineral spirits won't help much.
If you find sand/gravel/debris, you can usually get that out with a little liquid Tide and hot water. Easy to dump it out if the tank is out of the car, more fun if the tank is still in the car. You don't want to risk damaging the strainer by blindly poking around in the bottom well with the business end of your wet-dry vac, trying to get water and junk out.
Didn't see any debris come out when I originally drained and flushed, so no Mineral Spirits going back in the tank. Will flush again with the water/detergent one more time and call it a day while I wait for some tank bits to arrive.
As always, thank you very much for the guidance here!
Some thoughts from the experience with Jim Chambers' car here a month ago.
The new strainer and fitting were carefully prep'd with Teflon-based pipe sealing paste on the threads, and Hylomar sealer on the neoprene seal itself and the tank flange and lip. The strainer went in painlessly. We snugged it up enough to seat the gasket well but not much more, then leak-tested by putting a little fuel back into the tank after installation. After a leak-free day, Jim added more fuel to further the test, and again no leaks for a few days of observation. We called it good and finished the installation with new GB hoses, a new pump and filter, and finally the pump cover, down from the lift, and a test drive. Success!
Hey Doc, I'm getting ready to install a new strainer myself (fortunately the old one came off with no fuss), but was under the impression that they got installed dry with no pastes or sealers, just the seal and proper torque per the WSM. My concern wouldn't be so much the hylomar on the seal but instead using teflon paste on the threads. Wouldn't the telfon paste eventually breakup up from exposure to the gasoline and its ethanol and just add additional sediment for the filters to deal with?
I'm hoping that the paste will just sit in there and keep the water dropping out of the fuel from further corroding the steel and aluminum parts there. It's not there to make a seal to keep fuel from leaking out through the threads, more to keep it from leaking in. In our installation, the epoxy used to hold the tank insert in place is good and there was a nice even squeeze-out at the outer end as we used the little puller to get the insert back in place. The puller was removed, squeeze-out cleaned up, puller back in to let the epoxy cure with the sleeve in perfect position. But we aren't depending on the epoxy to hold the fuel forever either. We hope it stays intact, so it keeps any water out from around the sleeve, but no guarantees with the bond to the high-density polyurethane tank material. Our hope is/was that the epoxy would hold the insert well enough to let us put the strainer back in with the new seal, and allow enough tension on the new seal to let it do its job for another N decades before it needs to be replaced. Will the Teflon thread sealant paste or the J-B Weld still be there in another N decades? Statistically, neither Jim nor I will be alive to report on that.
Progress Report: I haven't heard any more reports of fuel fragrance in the garage from Jim or Mrs Jim. So far so good. N decades, minus a month, to go.
10-10-2016, 12:43 PM
