Braided brake lines for Track Days ?
#16
Registered User
Stupid question I suppose...
If you lose the brakes, why not just use the emergency parking brake rather than downshifting???
I would think it would work better, you can modulate it, and that's what it's there for?
Also, if you lose the front brakes, you still should have rear brakes ad most cars have dual master pressure ports, no?
If you lose the brakes, why not just use the emergency parking brake rather than downshifting???
I would think it would work better, you can modulate it, and that's what it's there for?
Also, if you lose the front brakes, you still should have rear brakes ad most cars have dual master pressure ports, no?
#17
Stupid question I suppose...
If you lose the brakes, why not just use the emergency parking brake rather than downshifting???
I would think it would work better, you can modulate it, and that's what it's there for?
Also, if you lose the front brakes, you still should have rear brakes ad most cars have dual master pressure ports, no?
If you lose the brakes, why not just use the emergency parking brake rather than downshifting???
I would think it would work better, you can modulate it, and that's what it's there for?
Also, if you lose the front brakes, you still should have rear brakes ad most cars have dual master pressure ports, no?
#18
Rennlist Member
Stupid question I suppose...
If you lose the brakes, why not just use the emergency parking brake rather than downshifting???
I would think it would work better, you can modulate it, and that's what it's there for?
Also, if you lose the front brakes, you still should have rear brakes ad most cars have dual master pressure ports, no?
If you lose the brakes, why not just use the emergency parking brake rather than downshifting???
I would think it would work better, you can modulate it, and that's what it's there for?
Also, if you lose the front brakes, you still should have rear brakes ad most cars have dual master pressure ports, no?
the other main reason not to rely on the e-brake, because you are going to be approaching a turn, so you want both hands on the wheel to navigate a early apex type turn approach. (using the turn and possibly a slide to slow the car down)
as far as the back up system..... ive often wondered how that works, because it seems with a blown front brake line , there doesnt seem to be available rear brakes.......at least with my experience of a line failure.
#19
Three Wheelin'
At Sebring in the 12 hour race there was a car that lost brakes. It just stayed straight and hit the wall frontal. Commentators where discussing that was the best way...
Safer than trying to lose speed and create an angle.
footage:
Safer than trying to lose speed and create an angle.
footage:
Last edited by MarcD147; 03-24-2017 at 04:02 PM.
#20
Registered User
I haven't personally ever tried using the parking/emergency brake while moving... May want to try it at least a couple times on a safe street to see what happens...
Downshifting is more natural... but wouldn't you essentially be grenading the motor???
If you are going down a straight at 100+ say in 4th at 6000 rpm or so... brakes don't work... you downshift to 3rd... you are now way past redline, no???
If its a matter of life and death, which it may be, then it really doesn't matter. But all downshifting does is apply a braking force to the rear tires... same, in theory, as the emergency brake...
You obviously can modulate and electronic parking brake or foot brake... but most 80's/90's cars have a center console hand brake... The JDM drifters certainly know how to use it
Downshifting is more natural... but wouldn't you essentially be grenading the motor???
If you are going down a straight at 100+ say in 4th at 6000 rpm or so... brakes don't work... you downshift to 3rd... you are now way past redline, no???
If its a matter of life and death, which it may be, then it really doesn't matter. But all downshifting does is apply a braking force to the rear tires... same, in theory, as the emergency brake...
You obviously can modulate and electronic parking brake or foot brake... but most 80's/90's cars have a center console hand brake... The JDM drifters certainly know how to use it
#22
Registered User
If your front breaks over heat/leak/whatever, why wouldn't the rears work? And if so, how would downshifting be "better"?
#24
Rennlist Member
I haven't personally ever tried using the parking/emergency brake while moving... May want to try it at least a couple times on a safe street to see what happens...
Downshifting is more natural... but wouldn't you essentially be grenading the motor???
If you are going down a straight at 100+ say in 4th at 6000 rpm or so... brakes don't work... you downshift to 3rd... you are now way past redline, no???
If its a matter of life and death, which it may be, then it really doesn't matter. But all downshifting does is apply a braking force to the rear tires... same, in theory, as the emergency brake...
You obviously can modulate and electronic parking brake or foot brake... but most 80's/90's cars have a center console hand brake... The JDM drifters certainly know how to use it
Downshifting is more natural... but wouldn't you essentially be grenading the motor???
If you are going down a straight at 100+ say in 4th at 6000 rpm or so... brakes don't work... you downshift to 3rd... you are now way past redline, no???
If its a matter of life and death, which it may be, then it really doesn't matter. But all downshifting does is apply a braking force to the rear tires... same, in theory, as the emergency brake...
You obviously can modulate and electronic parking brake or foot brake... but most 80's/90's cars have a center console hand brake... The JDM drifters certainly know how to use it
even if the do work, downshifting is better as it adds a very controllable and predicable force on the rear tires , and has natural antil lock characteristics. the worst thing you can do is put the car in neutral and ride it out. ive seen that video of the guy that did that, and he ended up blowing out the track gate at sebring and rolling out on to city streets! there is no downside at all by downshifting in that emergency.. just learn how to do it correctly. very easy to practice.
#25
If I am not mistaken, the brake lines on the 2016 RS are hard lines all the way to the calipers. As already mentioned here, replacing them with braided lines can simplify caliper removal and therefore pad changes, but it will not make any difference in terms of performance because the hard lines do not expand at all.
Edit: there must be some part of the lines that is flexible, but it is probably a very short piece, as I believe the hard lines do go to the caliper on the RS, but there should be a flexible piece of rubber hose somewhere further upstream. Still, I doubt you will feel much, if any, difference in pedal feel.
Edit: there must be some part of the lines that is flexible, but it is probably a very short piece, as I believe the hard lines do go to the caliper on the RS, but there should be a flexible piece of rubber hose somewhere further upstream. Still, I doubt you will feel much, if any, difference in pedal feel.
#26
Registered User
Thanks for the explanation... Sounds like you have some skill ...
I think if you find that you don't have brakes in the middle of the starting straight, you can downshift through 3 gears with a 1 second pause in between...
If you find out at the 3rd braking marker...not so much...
So, is the key to test the brakes in the middle of the long straight? Is that what people do?
Because if I found out I had no brakes deep into the end of the straight, I suspect I might have time to downshift 1 gear...
I think if you find that you don't have brakes in the middle of the starting straight, you can downshift through 3 gears with a 1 second pause in between...
If you find out at the 3rd braking marker...not so much...
So, is the key to test the brakes in the middle of the long straight? Is that what people do?
Because if I found out I had no brakes deep into the end of the straight, I suspect I might have time to downshift 1 gear...
#27
Edit: there must be some part of the lines that is flexible, but it is probably a very short piece, as I believe the hard lines do go to the caliper on the RS, but there should be a flexible piece of rubber hose somewhere further upstream. Still, I doubt you will feel much, if any, difference in pedal feel.
#28
Rennlist Member
If I am not mistaken, the brake lines on the 2016 RS are hard lines all the way to the calipers. As already mentioned here, replacing them with braided lines can simplify caliper removal and therefore pad changes, but it will not make any difference in terms of performance because the hard lines do not expand at all.
Edit: there must be some part of the lines that is flexible, but it is probably a very short piece, as I believe the hard lines do go to the caliper on the RS, but there should be a flexible piece of rubber hose somewhere further upstream. Still, I doubt you will feel much, if any, difference in pedal feel.
Edit: there must be some part of the lines that is flexible, but it is probably a very short piece, as I believe the hard lines do go to the caliper on the RS, but there should be a flexible piece of rubber hose somewhere further upstream. Still, I doubt you will feel much, if any, difference in pedal feel.
Thanks for the explanation... Sounds like you have some skill ...
I think if you find that you don't have brakes in the middle of the starting straight, you can downshift through 3 gears with a 1 second pause in between...
If you find out at the 3rd braking marker...not so much...
So, is the key to test the brakes in the middle of the long straight? Is that what people do?
Because if I found out I had no brakes deep into the end of the straight, I suspect I might have time to downshift 1 gear...
I think if you find that you don't have brakes in the middle of the starting straight, you can downshift through 3 gears with a 1 second pause in between...
If you find out at the 3rd braking marker...not so much...
So, is the key to test the brakes in the middle of the long straight? Is that what people do?
Because if I found out I had no brakes deep into the end of the straight, I suspect I might have time to downshift 1 gear...
#29
Rennlist Member
At Sebring in the 12 hour race there was a car that lost brakes. It just stayed straight and hit the wall frontal. Commentators where discussing that was the best way...
Safer than trying to lose speed and create an angle.
footage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PE7-HKHp1ko
Safer than trying to lose speed and create an angle.
footage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PE7-HKHp1ko
#30
Three Wheelin'
He did NOT have plenty of time. He was diving at approx 170 mph into one of the trickiest corners in the US.
Further down the corner the options get a lot uglier.
it looks like he got one maybe two downshifts in and that was as good as it gets there.
He avoided sideways impacts, flips and bounces back into traffic et .
Further down the corner the options get a lot uglier.
it looks like he got one maybe two downshifts in and that was as good as it gets there.
He avoided sideways impacts, flips and bounces back into traffic et .