Kaizu

Thinking out loud as during winter the mod bug sometimes hits you...

Which one provides better performance on track, given that I can either buy new suspension or lighten the car with the same money:

- Should I change my properly tuned 2-way suspension to 3-way or 4-way shocks? I drive on challenging tracks (Ring...) where you could notice the benefits easily. Majority of people with similar pace there drive 3-way or 4-way and rave about them. Of course some adjusting time is needed.

- Or should I focus now into lightening the car with some beautiful CF body panels etc? Car is relatively heavy (for a track only) 996, so can shed good amount of weight off.

At this stage, I am sure a weight removal would be a better upgrade for ordinary Grand Prix type of circuits, where you can see the (small) difference in lap times quite quickly. But, a good suspension really benefits on difficult places like the Ring.

So, would you rather toss out XXX lbs of the car or upgrade to 3-way or 4-way competition shocks if those are the choices? Where's the break even "XXX lbs" in that comparison, purely in your view?

KaiB

Break even occurs right around $150/lb...

Good dampers are nice, but really want to work as part of an entire (well thought out) suspension and tires.

Der ABT

Suspension is only as good as the settings

dbf73

new shocks would give you one or two more ways to adjust yourself out of being competitive

Frank 993 C4S

Suspension upgrades are all about set-up. It is the proper set-up that will give you the benefit, not just the shocks by themselves.

Weight reduction is great because it will help you with cornering, braking and acceleration. There are many ways to reduce weight before you start replacing body panels with CF (but maybe you already incorporated those).

Here are some other things you might want to consider spending your money on instead of the above:

- A pro coach
- A data system (such as AIM)
- Aerodynamics
- Tires (go to full slicks)

wanna911

Lol.... this.


If its track only, throw some weight out or better yet add some aero if your car still looks like the pic. You can probably do both for the price of 3 or 4 ways. Lighter + aero will be faster.

Veloce Raptor

Agree with the above: lighten the car, get a coach to help dial the car in after lightening it & to help you get the most out of it as a driver.

Spyerx

I'm not a racer... But the best bang for buck in improving performance for me has been coaching and a data system to go with it. Modding the car is fun, but modding me delivers better results

Paseb

If you have already a good 2 ways suspension propelly setuped, then you should leave it like that unless, you race for cash or big series.

For me, i changed my stock pss9 to jrz 2 ways and this changed my car literrally.

You should give us more info on your mods and de/race experience.

If you have the cash for a 3-4ways(i have a set of 997 jrz available(big money suspension) then go all in and changed it if you think this is the only option left.

ninjabones

If you've never had the opportunity to learn how to tune adjustable shocks (high speed, low speed, rebound, can pressure) then I'd vote for that purely for the education / driver-development benefits. Steep learning curve, and you'll probably be slower for quite some time, but to me this whole sport is about learning and improving on my potential. It took me over a year to figure it out in my old 993, but I learned a ton and it gave me something to talk about with a lot of really smart people (the majority of whom contradicted each other and confused me, until I found my Yoda).

Chris P Lewis

Hire Sabine.....

KaiB

So Yonks set you straight....

Kaizu

Thanks for the constructive comments, really like this forum!

I have good idea in mind what to gain in lap time with lower weight, but don't have similar knowledge what's the gain with 2-way vs. 3- or 4-way suspension. Most comparisons there are not fair, and like you say, it's a lot about setup.

I agree you really cannot go wrong with a lower weight, that's for sure! However, I also tried to tell how on the Ring the actual weight is not that critical vs. a great suspension and aerodynamics. There it is more about keeping the momentum in challenging sections vs. "brake hard, focus on one turn for 100%, then accelerate hard" type of stuff, where lightweight is always crucial. A heavier car with specially done suspension is faster there than a lighter car with ok suspension.

I've driven competitively for years. Thanks for the tip on data analysis, may I advertise that I have been involved with the Android lap timer app called RaceChrono, check it out if anyone uses Android phones, I claim it's more useful and practical to use for analysis purposes than the other apps available..

Matt Romanowski

Weight is evil in all forms of racing, so that is what I would take out first.

Also, in regards to shocks, remember that good shock absorbers are not built around the adjustment, but the setup and how they work. A set of perfectly tuned non adjustable shocks can work just as well as a set of perfectly tuned 4 way, it's just harder to set them up. So, if you have a good, well setup set of 2 ways, then I would stay with them and lighten the car.

What shocks are in the car now?

ProCoach

I've found that it's more important how well all the individual components (shocks, springs or torsion bars, sway bars) work TOGETHER than switching and swapping individual components (that's reserved and the reason for a true TESTING regimen).

Also, I have found that the quest should be for BALANCE and making predictable the building of optimum slip angles (the rate and amount of sliding, front and back) first.

For shocks, it's all about transitional car response to a driver's input and making that response FEED the driver's confidence, rather than SHAKE that driver's confidence.

It's the confidence of knowing what the car is going to do BEFORE (and WHILE) it's doing it that allow drivers to carry more momentum (read: slow less) through corners and complex corners. That's one of the reasons why a particular "pro's" "setup" (settings on the car that control the timing and amplitude of weight transfer, hence grip distribution) might not work for another pro or someone with far less experience.

It's about building and tuning a foundation UNDER the driver so they can PUSH beyond their comfort level, progressively unsticking the car in a way that is predictable, linear and KNOWING that they're not going to crash if they go over "the edge" a little...

That's the goal. Not a particular "kit list..."